Author Topic: Colin Kaepernick protest against USA  (Read 11576 times)

Offline yuneeq

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Presidential Platinum Elite
  • *********
  • Join Date: Jan 2013
  • Posts: 5370
  • Total likes: 183
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 9
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
  • Location: NJ
Re: Colin Kaepernick protest against USA
« Reply #30 on: August 28, 2016, 10:01:06 PM »
1- I never said it was the only way
2 - Now you are getting into politics but yes the flag represents their sacrifice.

1. So those that sit aren't necessarily disrespecting the dead, correct? I can assume that they respect them in other ways. 
2. I don't see how the wars have anything to do with politics. Thousands of veterans died because of the mistakes of their government, I don't see that as a right/left issue. It's very nice to call them heroes but is it blasphemy to believe that they died in vain?

At the very least you can see now that there's another side to things let's not make a big deal over sitting down during an anthem.
Live forever or die trying.

Online aygart

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Presidential Platinum Elite
  • *********
  • Join Date: May 2008
  • Posts: 5698
  • Total likes: 825
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 7
    • View Profile
    • Lower Watt Energy Brokers
  • Programs: www.lowerwatt.com
Re: Colin Kaepernick protest against USA
« Reply #31 on: August 28, 2016, 10:02:32 PM »


That's how you feel, I feel otherwise.
Why is the flag the only way to respect the dead?

IMHO a flag means much more than "respecting soldiers that die for the country".

Once something has become an accepted way to respect their sacrifice to use it as a statement is offensive. That is exactly what he is intending it to be. If he would say that he feels that sitting is a better way to show respect people wouldn't care and would dismiss him as a kook.

Let us say that he has a good point about police brutality. It is still not something which the country stands for. If it exists as they claim it would be an issue which everyone would agree needs to be fixed. The symbolism of the flag is what is allowing him to be earning millions a year instead of working on a tobacco field. With his actions he is turning his back on all this country gave him.

Any reasonable person will realize that bigotry exists. Many of us have experienced it. But if a Jew would disrespect the country which has given more freedom than any other in thousands of years due to some bias against him he should be condemned.
You have the right to remain silent. Anything you say can and will be used to start a religious discussion.

Online aygart

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Presidential Platinum Elite
  • *********
  • Join Date: May 2008
  • Posts: 5698
  • Total likes: 825
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 7
    • View Profile
    • Lower Watt Energy Brokers
  • Programs: www.lowerwatt.com
Re: Colin Kaepernick protest against USA
« Reply #32 on: August 28, 2016, 10:03:58 PM »


1. So those that sit aren't necessarily disrespecting the dead, correct? I can assume that they respect them in other ways. 
2. I don't see how the wars have anything to do with politics. Thousands of veterans died because of the mistakes of their government, I don't see that as a right/left issue. It's very nice to call them heroes but is it blasphemy to believe that they died in vain?

At the very least you can see now that there's another side to things let's not make a big deal over sitting down during an anthem.
His whole point is to make a statement disrespecting the country.
You have the right to remain silent. Anything you say can and will be used to start a religious discussion.

Offline elit

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Platinum Elite
  • *******
  • Join Date: Jun 2008
  • Posts: 1220
  • Total likes: 90
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 0
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: Colin Kaepernick protest against USA
« Reply #33 on: August 28, 2016, 10:13:39 PM »
Really? We're having a thread to discuss kapernick?who cares what he thinks?  Wasting a sec on this gives His opinion  more credence than it deserves

Online aygart

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Presidential Platinum Elite
  • *********
  • Join Date: May 2008
  • Posts: 5698
  • Total likes: 825
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 7
    • View Profile
    • Lower Watt Energy Brokers
  • Programs: www.lowerwatt.com
Re: Colin Kaepernick protest against USA
« Reply #34 on: August 28, 2016, 10:15:26 PM »
Really? We're having a thread to discuss kapernick?who cares what he thinks?  Wasting a sec on this gives His opinion  more credence than it deserves
We are not discussing him. We are discussing the fans who burned jerseys.
You have the right to remain silent. Anything you say can and will be used to start a religious discussion.

Offline Baruch

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Platinum Elite
  • *******
  • Join Date: Jan 2013
  • Posts: 2469
  • Total likes: 64
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 1
    • View Profile
Re: Colin Kaepernick protest against USA
« Reply #35 on: August 28, 2016, 10:33:56 PM »
@yuneeq, I wonder if our grandparents, who in America finally stopped being persecuted for being Jews, would agree with you.
When somebody thanks you for a favor you've done, respond "my pleasure", not "no problem".

Offline elit

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Platinum Elite
  • *******
  • Join Date: Jun 2008
  • Posts: 1220
  • Total likes: 90
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 0
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: Colin Kaepernick protest against USA
« Reply #36 on: August 28, 2016, 10:36:50 PM »
We are not discussing him. We are discussing the fans who burned jerseys.
Oh.  Sorry just saw the headline and refused to read the thread

Online zale

  • Dansdeals Platinum Elite + Lifetime Gold Elite
  • ******
  • Join Date: Jun 2011
  • Posts: 928
  • Total likes: 47
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 3
    • View Profile
  • Location: Brooklyn, NY
Re: Colin Kaepernick protest against USA
« Reply #37 on: August 28, 2016, 10:56:19 PM »
Dumb thing to do because will hate him for it but I have no problem with him sitting.
Patriotism is the only religion that if anyone dares question their loyalty they are burnt at the stake.

Patriotism in the American sense of the word is the polar opposite of religion. Patriotism means that you believe in everyone's right to freedom and liberty, and to live their lives as they see fit. Religion entails a set of rules that everyone must follow.

"Pledging allegiance" is pledging that you will fight to protect everyone's freedom, ironically, even those who don't take the pledge.

Nevertheless, "not standing" for the anthem or pledge means that you do NOT believe in these freedoms and that you are NOT ready to fight to protect them.

Your "grievances" with the government or police etc. don't excuse you for not standing up to protect the freedoms of your fellow countrymen as they would do for you. There is simply no other way to interpret this behavior.

Offline yuneeq

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Presidential Platinum Elite
  • *********
  • Join Date: Jan 2013
  • Posts: 5370
  • Total likes: 183
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 9
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
  • Location: NJ
Re: Colin Kaepernick protest against USA
« Reply #38 on: August 28, 2016, 11:03:15 PM »
Once something has become an accepted way to respect their sacrifice to use it as a statement is offensive. That is exactly what he is intending it to be. If he would say that he feels that sitting is a better way to show respect people wouldn't care and would dismiss him as a kook.

Let us say that he has a good point about police brutality. It is still not something which the country stands for. If it exists as they claim it would be an issue which everyone would agree needs to be fixed. The symbolism of the flag is what is allowing him to be earning millions a year instead of working on a tobacco field. With his actions he is turning his back on all this country gave him.

Any reasonable person will realize that bigotry exists. Many of us have experienced it. But if a Jew would disrespect the country which has given more freedom than any other in thousands of years due to some bias against him he should be condemned.

So many thungs wrong with what you wrote.
So one by one.

1. The national anthem isn't an anthem to respect the dead. It is used when respecting the dead, but when they DON'T say "let's sing this anthem in honor of our troops/vets", it has nothing to do with them but rather America and everything it represents. Yes that includes the troops, but that also includes all the bad things along with it. Obviously if the anthem is recited in memory he is disrespecting those that sacrificed for him. Though it doesn't help that the NFL and other sports leagues are literally paid millions to respect the troops, if you ask me that's worse than sitting down during a random non-troop supporting anthem.

2. America has had a problem with police brutality and has done nothing to reel it in. The brutality stems from policies in place that promote cops to use bullets first and policies that say the cop is never guilty no matter how wrong he is. Cops rarely ever get convicted and that's policy. You want to say this flag represents America, you can't change the facts, America is comprised of xyz mostly good things but also bad things.

3. You're obviously a firm believer in american exceptionalis as you believe an athlete like him wouldn't get paid millions to play sports in other countries. Yep only in America. FYI soccer players worldwide aren't picking tobbaco, they are some of the highest paid athletes in the world.

4. Criticizing a countries policies isn't akin to disrespect. We live in a democracy where the beauty of it is that citizens desires can actually be passed into law. Protesting a policy is part of the democratic process, and might be more patriotic than anything you've ever done.
Live forever or die trying.

Offline yuneeq

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Presidential Platinum Elite
  • *********
  • Join Date: Jan 2013
  • Posts: 5370
  • Total likes: 183
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 9
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
  • Location: NJ
Re: Colin Kaepernick protest against USA
« Reply #39 on: August 28, 2016, 11:09:34 PM »
@yuneeq, I wonder if our grandparents, who in America finally stopped being persecuted for being Jews, would agree with you.

They would love the democratic process and would love to be involved.
The first time their voice has been heard and considered.

Kap is a great example of democracy, if people agree with him they'll fight alongside to change the laws, if they disagree they'll fight to keep the laws the way they are.
For me the greatness of America is all about:
"I do not agree with what you have to say, but I'll defend to the death your right to say it."
Live forever or die trying.

Offline Baruch

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Platinum Elite
  • *******
  • Join Date: Jan 2013
  • Posts: 2469
  • Total likes: 64
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 1
    • View Profile
Re: Colin Kaepernick protest against USA
« Reply #40 on: August 28, 2016, 11:12:07 PM »
They would love the democratic process and would love to be involved.
The first time their voice has been heard and considered.

Kap is a great example of democracy, if people agree with him they'll fight alongside to change the laws, if they disagree they'll fight to keep the laws the way they are.
For me the greatness of America is all about:
"I do not agree with what you have to say, but I'll defend to the death your right to say it."
Exactly. That's why we don't jail Kapernick. We burn his jersey.

He has the legal right. That doesn't make him right.
When somebody thanks you for a favor you've done, respond "my pleasure", not "no problem".

Offline yuneeq

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Presidential Platinum Elite
  • *********
  • Join Date: Jan 2013
  • Posts: 5370
  • Total likes: 183
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 9
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
  • Location: NJ
Re: Colin Kaepernick protest against USA
« Reply #41 on: August 28, 2016, 11:19:43 PM »
Exactly. That's why we don't jail Kapernick. We burn his jersey.

He has the legal right. That doesn't make him right.

And that's fine with me.
I don't think he's wrong or right he's just making a stand for what he believes in, but he's definitely dumb as an athlete for alienating his fan base.
Live forever or die trying.

Offline yuneeq

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Presidential Platinum Elite
  • *********
  • Join Date: Jan 2013
  • Posts: 5370
  • Total likes: 183
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 9
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
  • Location: NJ
Re: Colin Kaepernick protest against USA
« Reply #42 on: August 28, 2016, 11:24:12 PM »
Somwthing to think about. .

If someone lived 20 years after our glorious country was founded but when slavery was still legal.
What would you say if that person BURNED the flag and sat down during the anthem in protest of slavery? Wuod you be okay with it?
Live forever or die trying.

Online churnbabychurn

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Presidential Platinum Elite
  • *********
  • Join Date: Jul 2012
  • Posts: 6827
  • Total likes: 146
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 0
    • View Profile
  • Location: Lakewood
Re: Colin Kaepernick protest against USA
« Reply #43 on: August 28, 2016, 11:27:00 PM »
The philosophy of patriotism is very complex. Some believe it is "religious" in nature, others said that " Patriotism is the last refuge of the scoundrel."

ואין עכשיו העת להאריך..

Offline Dan

  • Administrator
  • Dansdeals Lifetime 40K Presidential Platinum Elite
  • **********
  • Join Date: May 2008
  • Posts: 49463
  • Total likes: 1130
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 16441
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
  • Location: CLE
  • Programs: UA Global Services, AA Lifetime Plat, DL Dirt, SPG Plat, Hyatt Diamond, Fairmont Lifetime Plat, Hilton Diamond, Priority Club Plat, Avis Chairman, National EE, Hertz PC
Re: Colin Kaepernick protest against USA
« Reply #44 on: August 28, 2016, 11:32:16 PM »
Anyone that's traveled extensively knows what an amazing nation this is.

There are better ways to protest than when we honor those who gave their lives for our freedom.
Save your time, I don't answer PM. Post it in the forum and a dedicated DDF'er will get back to you as soon as possible.