Author Topic: "One Of Us"  (Read 20842 times)

Offline Aaaron

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Re: "One Of Us"
« Reply #80 on: October 25, 2017, 07:51:33 PM »
How could it not be?

+1

Is there any doubt that if I made a movie about nazis that it would be biased and skewed? Watch the video of her talking about the extermination of chasidim, how she looks amused about how it was because they were so "loud and proud."

So if you're both claiming her biases made her skew facts or details, please provide examples. 

Offline aygart

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Re: "One Of Us"
« Reply #81 on: October 25, 2017, 07:54:09 PM »
So if you're both claiming her biases made her skew facts or details, please provide examples.
There is no real way of know for certain one way or the other, but considering the stupidity of her holocaust comment her interpretation of things is very suspect.
Feelings don't care about your facts

Offline Proisrael

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Re: "One Of Us"
« Reply #82 on: October 26, 2017, 04:27:35 AM »
I agree with a lot that is said about Chasidim but I feel like the film messed up the message entirely.

Mother changes her life and WILL change the kids life regardless of her promises, she should lose the kids I dont feel sorry for that. The kids that went off the D, were not ostracized by their family, in fact the father was there for him when he had issues. The backgrounds of the scenes always show kids laughing/happy mothers look busy but not overwhelmed. I see this as a terrible hit job on Chasidim.

Offline sky121

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Re: "One Of Us"
« Reply #83 on: October 26, 2017, 07:58:32 AM »
I agree with a lot that is said about Chasidim but I feel like the film messed up the message entirely.

Mother changes her life and WILL change the kids life regardless of her promises, she should lose the kids I dont feel sorry for that. The kids that went off the D, were not ostracized by their family, in fact the father was there for him when he had issues. The backgrounds of the scenes always show kids laughing/happy mothers look busy but not overwhelmed. I see this as a terrible hit job on Chasidim.
Just out of curiosity, do you outright believe a father or mother who become not religious deserve to lose their relationship with their children?
"Not all who wander are lost"

Offline Proisrael

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Re: "One Of Us"
« Reply #84 on: October 26, 2017, 08:29:54 AM »
Just out of curiosity, do you outright believe a father or mother who become not religious deserve to lose their relationship with their children?

I think it is heartbreaking!! But at the end of the day they make a pact when they decide to have kids that this is the way they will be raised. If one of the parents decides to change then they lose out. If it is both parents then it becomes murkier.

Offline Sport

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Re: "One Of Us"
« Reply #85 on: October 26, 2017, 08:30:52 AM »
Just out of curiosity, do you outright believe a father or mother who become not religious deserve to lose their relationship with their children?
And even if you do, you can still feel their pain, they're not mutually exclusive.

Offline sky121

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Re: "One Of Us"
« Reply #86 on: October 26, 2017, 08:33:30 AM »
I think it is heartbreaking!! But at the end of the day they make a pact when they decide to have kids that this is the way they will be raised. If one of the parents decides to change then they lose out. If it is both parents then it becomes murkier.
We're talking about human beings here. It seems so crazy to me that you can think in such black and white terms.



Obviously ideally there is respect and compromise to whatever extent but that goes both ways.

As long as a parent is loving, safe and stable there shouldn't be any black and white decisions that that parents loses the right to their children IMHO.
"Not all who wander are lost"

Offline elit

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Re: "One Of Us"
« Reply #87 on: October 26, 2017, 08:34:32 AM »
I think it is heartbreaking!! But at the end of the day they make a pact when they decide to have kids that this is the way they will be raised. If one of the parents decides to change then they lose out. If it is both parents then it becomes murkier.
huh? what does your last line mean?
and of the father's actually abusive you still thunk they are better off with him

Offline Proisrael

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Re: "One Of Us"
« Reply #88 on: October 26, 2017, 08:40:08 AM »
We're talking about human beings here. It seems so crazy to me that you can think in such black and white terms.



Obviously ideally there is respect and compromise to whatever extent but that goes both ways.

As long as a parent is loving, safe and stable there shouldn't be any black and white decisions that that parents loses the right to their children IMHO.

How is it a stable life to see your mother eating cheeseburgers and your father learning gemara?? I dont understand what you think is stable?

Offline Proisrael

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Re: "One Of Us"
« Reply #89 on: October 26, 2017, 08:42:04 AM »
huh? what does your last line mean?
and of the father's actually abusive you still thunk they are better off with him

I did not say that! I do not believe every lady who went off the derech is because of abusive husbands, if the husband was abusive then he should lose the kids as well.

Offline Aaaron

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Re: "One Of Us"
« Reply #90 on: October 26, 2017, 08:43:44 AM »
I agree with a lot that is said about Chasidim but I feel like the film messed up the message entirely.

Mother changes her life and WILL change the kids life regardless of her promises, she should lose the kids I dont feel sorry for that. The kids that went off the D, were not ostracized by their family, in fact the father was there for him when he had issues. The backgrounds of the scenes always show kids laughing/happy mothers look busy but not overwhelmed. I see this as a terrible hit job on Chasidim.

You just said it always showed happy children and mothers, and showed a supportive father to the OTD kid, so how exactly is it a hit job on Chasidim?

Offline elit

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Re: "One Of Us"
« Reply #91 on: October 26, 2017, 08:43:58 AM »
I did not say that! I do not believe every lady who went off the derech is because of abusive husbands, if the husband was abusive then he should lose the kids as well.
well that was the scenario being discussed

Offline Sport

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Re: "One Of Us"
« Reply #92 on: October 26, 2017, 08:44:34 AM »
I think it is heartbreaking!! But at the end of the day they make a pact when they decide to have kids that this is the way they will be raised. If one of the parents decides to change then they lose out. If it is both parents then it becomes murkier.
Would you say that in the reverse case? Say a completely secular family is going through a divorce and one of the spouses is a bal teshuvah now and becoming chasidish. Should the, now chasidish, spouse lose his/her right to any custody of the children because they'll raise the kids  differently.

Offline sky121

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Re: "One Of Us"
« Reply #93 on: October 26, 2017, 08:46:17 AM »
How is it a stable life to see your mother eating cheeseburgers and your father learning gemara?? I dont understand what you think is stable?
Listen, a kid from a divorced house is going to have some things to deal with even in the best of scenerios. 
That's his pekelah.

And ideally a parent who changes his/her path still has the child's best interest at heart and plenty of times that means respecting how they were raised until a certain point. 

Compromise should always be part of the picture. On both sides.  And it won't be perfect no matter what.
But there is still something to be said for a child having a relationship with their mother/father.

You can't write off a parent just because they change their path.

It's not that I don't understand how complicated it can be. And I get not wanting to expose a kid to things but sometimes thats what life throws at you.

You shouldn't lose a child just because you change your path.

If that means becoming not religious. 

Or becoming religious. 


"Not all who wander are lost"

Offline Proisrael

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Re: "One Of Us"
« Reply #94 on: October 26, 2017, 09:10:08 AM »
Would you say that in the reverse case? Say a completely secular family is going through a divorce and one of the spouses is a bal teshuvah now and becoming chasidish. Should the, now chasidish, spouse lose his/her right to any custody of the children because they'll raise the kids  differently.

Yes I would....I am saying clearly when parents decide to get married and have kids they decided on how they will raise them. If someone changes and it is 100% against the principles they agreed to then yes that parent must go.

Offline Proisrael

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Re: "One Of Us"
« Reply #95 on: October 26, 2017, 09:12:41 AM »
Listen, a kid from a divorced house is going to have some things to deal with even in the best of scenerios. 
That's his pekelah.

And ideally a parent who changes his/her path still has the child's best interest at heart and plenty of times that means respecting how they were raised until a certain point. 

Compromise should always be part of the picture. On both sides.  And it won't be perfect no matter what.
But there is still something to be said for a child having a relationship with their mother/father.

You can't write off a parent just because they change their path.

It's not that I don't understand how complicated it can be. And I get not wanting to expose a kid to things but sometimes thats what life throws at you.

You shouldn't lose a child just because you change your path.

If that means becoming not religious. 

Or becoming religious.

I feel the lack of security to kids is more damaging then not having one of the parents around. A parents death R"L is less damaging to a kids future then seeing 2 completely different ways of life. How is the kid ever supposed to know whats right in life if each step is being taught differently?

I think the mother should have full visitation rights however she may not discuss religion and she must dress appropriately!

Offline ChaimMoskowitz

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Re: "One Of Us"
« Reply #96 on: October 26, 2017, 09:40:38 AM »
I think the mother should have full visitation rights however she may not discuss religion and she must dress appropriately!
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Offline elit

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Offline ChaimMoskowitz

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Offline Aaaron

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Re: "One Of Us"
« Reply #99 on: October 26, 2017, 11:04:24 AM »
I feel the lack of security to kids is more damaging then not having one of the parents around. A parents death R"L is less damaging to a kids future then seeing 2 completely different ways of life. How is the kid ever supposed to know whats right in life if each step is being taught differently?

I think the mother should have full visitation rights however she may not discuss religion and she must dress appropriately!

Do you have any psychological data to back this up?  From what I understand, most court systems and jurisdictions disagree based on years of expert testimony.  The exception is where judges have to be worried about a block vote.