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DansDeals Forum => General Discussion => Topic started by: yakov116 on May 29, 2014, 04:02:17 PM

Title: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: yakov116 on May 29, 2014, 04:02:17 PM
I would like to put an outlet 3ft above above a back burner is it an issue?

Will the plugs get ruined from heat or steam? (dosent get very hot)
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: notanonymous on May 30, 2014, 12:00:29 PM
I would like to put an outlet 3ft above above a back burner is it an issue?

Will the plugs get ruined from heat or steam? (dosent get very hot)
Disclaimer - I am not an electrician,  but I do have some electrical knowledge and much experience in LV.

The outlet itself should not be an issue, but what appliance ate you plugging in to it?  Also, there should be some distance (horizontally) from the wall to the burner, no,
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: real-brisker on May 30, 2014, 01:27:33 PM
in many houses there are microwaves on top of burners.
I don't see why you should have a issue.


Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: username on May 30, 2014, 02:18:11 PM
in many houses there are microwaves on top of burners.
I don't see why you should have a issue.
And or exaust fan.



Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: yakov116 on May 30, 2014, 03:14:03 PM
Okay I'm feeling accomplished I put the outlet and its working! If it explodes I'll let you know. :)
I don't think it will be a problem but it was my first time working with electricity and I was nervous.

One more question
If I put an outlet on a switch how do I wire it I cut off the positive?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: flugal on May 30, 2014, 03:32:00 PM
Okay I'm feeling accomplished I put the outlet and its working! If it explodes I'll let you know. :)
I don't think it will be a problem but it was my first time working with electricity and I was nervous.

One more question
If I put an outlet on a switch how do I wire it I cut off the positive?
Yes, the switch should cut off the positive (black) wire.

Also, the outlet should probably be GFCI protected.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: yakov116 on May 30, 2014, 03:36:18 PM
Yes, the switch should cut off the positive (black) wire.

Also, the outlet should probably be GFCI protected.
I know I could google it but... What is GFCI
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: notanonymous on May 30, 2014, 03:48:00 PM
I know I could google it but... What is GFCI
Ground Fault Circut Interrupt.
It shuts iff power if it detects a problem (overload, water, etc).
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: flugal on May 30, 2014, 03:57:26 PM
Did you run the wire from another outlet in the kitchen? If so, it might already be protected. If there's a GFCI outlet in the kitchen already, try pressing the test button on that outlet and see if you lose power on the new outlet. You might also have a GFCI breaker for all the outlets in your kitchen. If not, then you can just buy a GFCI outlet.
3ft above the range seems like it could easily have liquid splashing up from a pot. It's probably also the code requirement, but you should just do it for safety.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: username on May 30, 2014, 04:26:59 PM
Make sure also that the wiring you used matched the Circut Breaker.
Here is a link that i just googled. This is very important.
http://homeguides.sfgate.com/wire-needed-15-amp-breakers-82139.html
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: yakov116 on May 30, 2014, 04:39:40 PM
Did you run the wire from another outlet in the kitchen? If so, it might already be protected. If there's a GFCI outlet in the kitchen already, try pressing the test button on that outlet and see if you lose power on the new outlet. You might also have a GFCI breaker for all the outlets in your kitchen. If not, then you can just buy a GFCI outlet.
3ft above the range seems like it could easily have liquid splashing up from a pot. It's probably also the code requirement, but you should just do it for safety.

I sure hope it won't splash 3 feet high! My main concern was the steam and heat and I think that it won't be a problem.
Thanks for your help I enjoy every last bit of help.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: yos9694 on May 30, 2014, 06:24:29 PM
What's black and crispy and hangs from a chandelier?

An amateur electrician.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: churnbabychurn on June 03, 2014, 09:25:47 AM
In the middle of the night my wife heard a strange buzzing sound...
Woke up in the morning and six individual breakers were tripped.
What happened?
What does this mean? Should I call electrician?
Thanks!
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ckmk47 on June 03, 2014, 10:01:23 AM
In the middle of the night my wife heard a strange buzzing sound...
Woke up in the morning and six individual breakers were tripped.
What happened?
What does this mean? Should I call electrician?
Thanks!
Call!  Especially coming into a yomtov. 
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: churnbabychurn on June 03, 2014, 10:38:16 AM
Call!  Especially coming into a yomtov.
Going away for YT...

Spoke to two electricians, both said it is very strange and they don't even have a working theory.. (I'm thinking a UFO flew over the house!)
The consensus was that since it only happened once we should just monitor it....
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ckmk47 on June 03, 2014, 10:42:57 AM
Going away for YT...

Spoke to two electricians, both said it is very strange and they don't even have a working theory.. (I'm thinking a UFO flew over the house!)
The consensus was that since it only happened once we should just monitor it....
If you spoke to a professional, then take their advice.  I was worried about a fire or even just all the electricity going out. Maybe a mouse ate some wires.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: churnbabychurn on June 03, 2014, 11:03:08 AM
If you spoke to a professional, then take their advice.  I was worried about a fire or even just all the electricity going out. Maybe a mouse ate some wires.
:o :o OY!
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: David R on February 03, 2015, 01:52:34 AM
Is this product a figment of my imagination or has anyone actually manufactured a GFCI receptacle with the prongs facing this way? (I could really use something like this because I have to plug in two appliances that both have right angle plugs, so they would bump into each other if plugged into a regular GFCI.)
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: Something Fishy on February 03, 2015, 08:03:36 AM
Is this product a figment of my imagination or has anyone actually manufactured a GFCI receptacle with the prongs facing this way? (I could really use something like this because I have to plug in two appliances that both have right angle plugs, so they would bump into each other if plugged into a regular GFCI.)

Something like this (http://www.amazon.com/Stellar-Labs-28-11105-Extension-Rotating/dp/B008I5SHKE) should solve your problem.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: Shmulie on February 03, 2015, 09:10:51 AM
Is this product a figment of my imagination or has anyone actually manufactured a GFCI receptacle with the prongs facing this way? (I could really use something like this because I have to plug in two appliances that both have right angle plugs, so they would bump into each other if plugged into a regular GFCI.)
I have one in my house it actually comes in very useful
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ckmk47 on February 03, 2015, 09:34:35 AM
Something like this (http://www.amazon.com/Stellar-Labs-28-11105-Extension-Rotating/dp/B008I5SHKE) should solve your problem.
I don't think it will.  It looks to me, that when you plug that extension cord into an upper outlet, it would block the lower outlet from being accessed.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: Something Fishy on February 03, 2015, 09:39:59 AM
I don't think it will.  It looks to me, that when you plug that extension cord into an upper outlet, it would block the lower outlet from being accessed.

It won't. The whole point is that it would swivel out of the way.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: Shmulie on February 03, 2015, 09:41:59 AM
maybe try this (http://www.homedepot.com/p/360-Electrical-Rotating-Duplex-Outlet-White-36010-W/100665822?AID=11210757&PID=6158626&SID=i5pe62lwfp00zey5001rw&cm_mmc=CJ-_-6158626-_-11210757&cj=true#.UWxp38qQPHU)
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: Something Fishy on February 03, 2015, 09:47:14 AM
maybe try this (http://www.homedepot.com/p/360-Electrical-Rotating-Duplex-Outlet-White-36010-W/100665822?AID=11210757&PID=6158626&SID=i5pe62lwfp00zey5001rw&cm_mmc=CJ-_-6158626-_-11210757&cj=true#.UWxp38qQPHU)

He needs GFCI.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: Shmulie on February 03, 2015, 10:04:46 AM
I dont think they make them anymore but i found one on ebay
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Eagle-Cooper-646-2V-BOX-GFCI-Duplex-Receptacle-Ivory-NIB-/181565648851?_trksid=p2141725.m3641.l6368
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ckmk47 on February 03, 2015, 10:38:57 AM
It won't. The whole point is that it would swivel out of the way.
I didn't realize the circle meant that it swiveled.  Nifty!
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: David R on February 03, 2015, 09:47:56 PM
I dont think they make them anymore but i found one on ebay
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Eagle-Cooper-646-2V-BOX-GFCI-Duplex-Receptacle-Ivory-NIB-/181565648851?_trksid=p2141725.m3641.l6368
I thought I remembered seeing such a thing in a home or building somewhere, but after doing some Google image searches and scrolling through all the pictures looking for it, I did not see it at all. The picture I posted was the result of my editing one of the pictures that my Google search returned, just to show what I was looking for. Your reply was very helpful. Now I know it was not a figment of my imagination. Now that I see a model number, I see some other ebay sellers also have it, so I will try to buy one. Thanks.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: Shmulie on February 03, 2015, 11:35:37 PM
I thought I remembered seeing such a thing in a home or building somewhere, but after doing some Google image searches and scrolling through all the pictures looking for it, I did not see it at all. The picture I posted was the result of my editing one of the pictures that my Google search returned, just to show what I was looking for. Your reply was very helpful. Now I know it was not a figment of my imagination. Now that I see a model number, I see some other ebay sellers also have it, so I will try to buy one. Thanks.
No problem
Happy I could help :)
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: Emkay on January 18, 2016, 07:01:29 AM
want to hardwire a surveillance camera directly to the breaker, is there any reason at all why I shouldn't?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: User6669 on January 18, 2016, 07:15:58 AM
want to hardwire a camera directly to the breaker, is there any reason at all why I shouldn't?
Do you mean a surveillance camera?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: Emkay on January 18, 2016, 07:17:41 AM
Do you mean a surveillance camera?
Yes
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: dovy2 on January 18, 2016, 08:29:08 AM
Anybody here an electrician in brooklyn, looking for a good quote
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: real-brisker on January 18, 2016, 09:42:59 AM
CCTV cameras don't get wired to the breaker. They are low voltage, you would need a receptacle with a 12V converter.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: Emkay on January 18, 2016, 09:49:35 AM
CCTV cameras don't get wired to the breaker. They are low voltage, you would need a receptacle with a 12V converter.
I'm not that much of a beginner
I wouldn't mess around with breakers if I was. Either way its done
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: whacked1 on January 18, 2016, 02:51:32 PM
Anybody here an electrician in brooklyn, looking for a good quote
send me a pm if you're still looking. I have someone good and hes very well priced
Title: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: snapit on January 20, 2017, 11:40:27 AM
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170120/df62363e470f1f7a181095545079302a.jpg)
Anybody know if there's a way to change this terminal? Or do I have to change the whole panel? (I can't find a replacement bar because it's a really old box)
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: mercaz1 on January 20, 2017, 11:49:38 AM
anyone know of a reasonably priced licensed electrician who does work in the five tows?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: Mplace on January 25, 2017, 11:05:06 PM
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170120/df62363e470f1f7a181095545079302a.jpg)
Anybody know if there's a way to change this terminal? Or do I have to change the whole panel? (I can't find a replacement bar because it's a really old box)
what's the issue?
Why not swop out the whole thing?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: snapit on January 25, 2017, 11:21:49 PM
what's the issue?
Why not swop out the whole thing?
Money and time, ultimately that's what I did
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: good sam on October 10, 2017, 08:39:47 PM
I have three switches at my front door (front hall, outside, and upstairs lights). All work other than the front hall. Bulbs are good. Is there a problem with:

A. My switch
B. My light fixture
C. My wiring
D. Not enough information
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: username on October 10, 2017, 08:49:51 PM
do you have a pigtail electrical tester?
probably the swich or the fixture. or their wiring.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: good sam on October 10, 2017, 08:54:37 PM
do you have a pigtail electrical tester?
probably the swich or the fixture. or their wiring.
I don't, wouldn't know how to use it if I did.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: username on October 10, 2017, 08:56:29 PM
call a handyman.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: good sam on October 10, 2017, 09:01:02 PM
call a handyman.
Don't need electrician?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: username on October 10, 2017, 09:04:02 PM
correct. Unless he finds something seriously wrong in the wiring.
Probaby the swich or fixture need replacing. no big deal, doesnt require an electrician.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on October 10, 2017, 09:12:19 PM
I have three switches at my front door (front hall, outside, and upstairs lights). All work other than the front hall. Bulbs are good. Is there a problem with:

A. My switch
B. My light fixture
C. My wiring
D. Not enough information
Does one switch control one light?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: good sam on October 10, 2017, 10:00:20 PM
Does one switch control one light?
Not sure what your question is. There are 3 switches, each controlling one light.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: hachover on October 10, 2017, 11:02:41 PM
I have three switches at my front door (front hall, outside, and upstairs lights). All work other than the front hall. Bulbs are good. Is there a problem with:

A. My switch
B. My light fixture
C. My wiring
D. Not enough information

If it worked before, and recently went bad, its likely the switch or the fixture. Having a tester of some sort would make diagnosing simpler, but you can do it without. Uninstall the switch and swap it with one of the others. If it still doesnt work, it wasnt the switch. To test the fixture, uninstall it enough to access the wires feeding it - depending on the fixture, you might not need to uninstall it all the way to get access. Connect a simple bulb socket to the wires. If it works, then it was your fixture. If thats also not it, then you need to call an electrician.

Obviously dont do any of this if youre not absolutely comfortable with electrical tinkering. As the joke goes, whats black and crispy, and hangs from a chandelier? An amateur electrician.

Even if you are, it makes no sense not to go out and buy a $10 tester to make this easier.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: yitrap on October 10, 2017, 11:04:25 PM
Turn off the fuse before you touch anything
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: good sam on October 11, 2017, 08:52:11 AM
Thanks guys
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ckmk47 on October 11, 2017, 09:29:30 AM
A bathroom. and the outlet outside it, keeps tripping the breaker. This is a new development.
I thought it might be because there is no light 'fixture', just a bulb screwed into a pigtail attached to the wires, so I installed a fixture.  That made no difference.  Within 15 minutes of resetting the breaker, it was tripped again.
Is there anything I can do, or just call an electrician?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on October 11, 2017, 09:40:12 AM
Not sure what your question is. There are 3 switches, each controlling one light.
Then you will have two wires on the switch.
Poor mans switch tester. Turn off breaker. Take one wire off (doesn't matter which one) and connect to the other wire. You will now have two wires on the same screw on the switch. Turn breaker on and see if light goes on. If it does the switch is bad.

Make sure you have the correct breaker. If not 100% sure don't try this.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: real-brisker on October 11, 2017, 09:53:55 AM
Then you will have two wires on the switch.
Poor mans switch tester. Turn off breaker. Take one wire off (doesn't matter which one) and connect to the other wire. You will now have two wires on the same screw on the switch. Turn breaker on and see if light goes on. If it does the switch is bad.

Make sure you have the correct breaker. If not 100% sure don't try this.
+1 simplest method for layman to test.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: good sam on October 11, 2017, 12:23:30 PM
Maybe one day, with some training, I will be a layman.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: User6669 on October 11, 2017, 05:14:55 PM
A bathroom. and the outlet outside it, keeps tripping the breaker. This is a new development.
I thought it might be because there is no light 'fixture', just a bulb screwed into a pigtail attached to the wires, so I installed a fixture.  That made no difference.  Within 15 minutes of resetting the breaker, it was tripped again.
Is there anything I can do, or just call an electrician?

The wiring might be wrong, or the outlet or socket might be defective. If you feel confident enough, you could try to remove and test, otherwise seek help.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: hachover on October 15, 2017, 08:15:36 PM
The wiring might be wrong, or the outlet or socket might be defective. If you feel confident enough, you could try to remove and test, otherwise seek help.

Just to add, my guess would be some frayed insulation on the wires in the circuit, causing a short and tripping the breaker.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ckmk47 on October 15, 2017, 09:34:11 PM
My guess is that it's a short.
I'll test each outlet for power after I flip the breaker, but how will I know if it's short?
Will it not work?  I'll also check each light switch.   


I assume I won't find anything, and then I'll call an electrician.  :D   If I actually find something defective, I'll change it.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: hachover on October 16, 2017, 08:55:20 AM
My guess is that it's a short.
I'll test each outlet for power after I flip the breaker, but how will I know if it's short?
Will it not work?  I'll also check each light switch.   


I assume I won't find anything, and then I'll call an electrician.  :D   If I actually find something defective, I'll change it.

Its not a big leap to guess that its a short, but the key question is what causes the short. If part of a wire is exposed then two pieces could be touching or arcing. The fact that you say it breaks within 15 minutes, but the circuit can be reset, makes me think this is a possibility. The bare wire would not touch anything when all is still, but some minor tremor (like walking on the floor above or on stairs) jostles the wire within the wall and causes the issue.

If this scenario seems likely to you, then you definitely need an electrician. A wire in the wall that has gaps in the insulation is no joke. Depending on the setup, it might be relatively simple to would disconnect the wires and run new ones parallel.

Of course, it could easily be something else. I'm doing my best with your 2 sentence description and I'm not a pro either.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on October 16, 2017, 10:07:00 AM
It can also be a worn breaker. Does the breaker trip with no load?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ckmk47 on October 16, 2017, 11:06:53 AM

The problem is in the basement bathroom.
Over yomtov we also noticed that the pump (that brings the basement waste water up to the outgoing sewer line) was emitting a smell.
I prioritized getting the plumber over the electrician, to give myself 1 more day to see if I could find the short myself.
As soon as the plumber looked at the pump I realized that it's on the same electrical line that has the short and it had no electricity over yomtov to empty.
But when I flipped the breaker,  it didn't turn on.  We found the short!
The plumber is in the middle of finding out if I need a new pump or he can fix the short/motor on this one.  No electrician needed.


Thanks, all of you, for your ideas and support.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: yesitsme on November 05, 2017, 11:22:35 PM
I have a 4 foot fixture that has 4 LED bulbs

What ballast do I need, it says "Use only with instant start ballasts", is there anything I'm supposed to look out for? or standard ballasts are "Instant start"?

Model # is
Philips 9290011242
T8 12w/850
Instantfit 453613
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: JoeyShmoe on November 06, 2017, 10:22:37 AM
I have a 4 foot fixture that has 4 LED bulbs

What ballast do I need, it says "Use only with instant start ballasts", is there anything I'm supposed to look out for? or standard ballasts are "Instant start"?

Model # is
Philips 9290011242
T8 12w/850
Instantfit 453613
IINM LED fixtures don't need ballasts, a ballast is only used as a starter for fluorescent
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: yesitsme on November 06, 2017, 09:52:08 PM
IINM LED fixtures don't need ballasts, a ballast is only used as a starter for fluorescent
You're right that LED works without a ballast, replacing a fluorescent bulb with led you have 2 (3) options 1) rewire and bypass the ballast. 2) get led bulbs special designed with a driver to be compatible with a ballast, their are 2 types of bulbs that are compatible with a ballast some can handle a ballast and others reuire a ballast, unfortunately the bulbs I'm referring to require a ballast all I want to know is what type of ballast.

Please correct me if i'm wrong,
thanks YesItsMe
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: yesitsme on November 06, 2017, 10:06:41 PM
https://insights.regencylighting.com/plug-and-play-or-ballast-bypass-linear-led (https://insights.regencylighting.com/plug-and-play-or-ballast-bypass-linear-led)
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: David R on November 10, 2017, 02:47:50 PM
I have a 4 foot fixture that has 4 LED bulbs

What ballast do I need, it says "Use only with instant start ballasts", is there anything I'm supposed to look out for? or standard ballasts are "Instant start"?

Model # is
Philips 9290011242
T8 12w/850
Instantfit 453613
Too bad the manufacturer left the 12W bulbs off the compatibility list. http://images.philips.com/is/content/PhilipsConsumer/PDFDownloads/United%20States/ODLI20170825_001_UPD_en_US_PLt-16118CR_InstantFit_Ballast_Compatibility_Guide_2017.pdf

However, you can see that the same ballasts are okay for the 10W and 14W 4 foot bulbs, so presumably they would be fine for the 12W too.

When I was shopping for 4 foot LED tubes, I deliberately sought out the ones that did not need a ballast and I threw the the old ballasts in the trash.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: yitrap on November 28, 2017, 12:35:05 PM
So I have an American power bar that I've been using in Israel with a little chupchik...decided to cut off the American plug and put an Israeli plug so I don't need a chupchik anymore, now every time I plug it in the fuse blows.

I've tried switching the black and the white wire with the green in, still blows.

I took the green out and just left the white and black in, doesn't blow.

Suggestions? (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20171128/affb7d7442eae56f2a9501974cc8a341.jpg)
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on November 28, 2017, 05:19:39 PM
What were you using, an adapter?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: yitrap on November 28, 2017, 05:38:46 PM
What were you using, an adapter?
Yes, in Israel anything can be called a chupchik. Looks something like this. (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20171128/4e368f0efff4d088149033e9611d90b0.jpg)
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on November 28, 2017, 06:08:25 PM
There is no grounding plug on that. You had the plug wired correctly. Makes me think the outlet is the problem.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: Qwertyuiop on November 28, 2017, 08:22:46 PM
Chaim, you an electrician?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: yitrap on November 29, 2017, 02:55:01 AM
There is no grounding plug on that. You had the plug wired correctly. Makes me think the outlet is the problem.
Outlet works fine for other things, I'll try power bar in a different outlet to check
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: David R on November 29, 2017, 08:52:08 AM
So I have an American power bar that I've been using in Israel with a little chupchik...decided to cut off the American plug and put an Israeli plug so I don't need a chupchik anymore, now every time I plug it in the fuse blows.

I've tried switching the black and the white wire with the green in, still blows.

I took the green out and just left the white and black in, doesn't blow.

Suggestions? (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20171128/affb7d7442eae56f2a9501974cc8a341.jpg)

I assume the photo is of the Israeli plug and the wiring configuration shown in the photo blew the fuse. Correct?

What is "an American power bar"? A power strip, surge protector or something else?
Which fuse blows - the one that protects the outlet or the fuse in the "American power bar"?

What suggestion are you seeking? Does it not work with the green wire disconnected?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on November 29, 2017, 08:55:41 AM
Chaim, you an electrician?
No but have done a lot of electrical work. It is pretty easy to understand.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on November 29, 2017, 08:58:13 AM
Outlet works fine for other things, I'll try power bar in a different outlet to check
Did the power bar work in the US?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: yitrap on November 29, 2017, 09:05:20 AM
I assume the photo is of the Israeli plug and the wiring configuration shown in the photo blew the fuse. Correct?

What is "an American power bar"? A power strip, surge protector or something else?
Which fuse blows - the one that protects the outlet or the fuse in the "American power bar"?

What suggestion are you seeking? Does it not work with the green wire disconnected?
Correct

Power strip

Fuse protecting the outlet

Any reason not to use it without the green? Why is the green making it blow?
Did the power bar work in the US?
Yes.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on November 29, 2017, 09:32:20 AM
Any reason not to use it without the green? Why is the green making it blow?Yes.
The green is grounding for your protection.

Most likely reason is there is some sort of short between black and green. Either in the power bar or outlet wiring. Test power bar in another outlet. Also for this outlet plug something in that uses the grounding plug and see what happens.

If all else fails fly me out there and I will fix it in minutes.  :)
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: aygart on November 29, 2017, 09:36:17 AM
Is the power strip rated for 220v
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: David R on November 29, 2017, 11:23:36 PM
Is the power strip rated for 220v
He was already pumping 220 volts into it before the rewiring and that did not blow the fuse. The only difference I see is that previously the ground prong would slip below the international adapter and not make contact with anything, but now the ground wire from the power strip connects to what is supposed to be the ground prong of the outlet. Some surge protectors have an LED that indicates the status of the ground and I thought that there is a possibility that connecting the ground wire could activate the circuitry for that and cause the overload. This is why I asked if it was a power strip or a surge protector. If it's just a power strip it shouldn't have any electronics of its own and the extra voltage should not make a difference unless it was truly being overloaded by a high wattage item plugged into the power strip.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on November 30, 2017, 10:06:03 AM
Any update?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on December 01, 2017, 01:38:13 PM
I hope @yitrap is OK!  :)
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: David R on December 01, 2017, 02:32:02 PM
I hope @yitrap is OK!  :)
Presumably staying off DDF during Shabbos.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: yitrap on December 02, 2017, 10:45:03 AM
I'm fine, I'll update shortly thanks for the concern
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: yitrap on December 02, 2017, 03:58:57 PM
So this is the front of the bar, not sure if that's considered a surge protector or not.

I've tried wiring in just the live and testing the ground plug and I'm pretty sure I'm getting electricity in the grounded holes, gonna test it again now to make sure.
ETA. I think this power bar is broken, I just tested it all three holes are apparently live even when the "fuse" is off.
Gonna try getting a new power bar and try this again.

What's weird is that in the US I used it for a year without an issue the only thing I can think is that the outlet I was using wasn't really grounded. (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20171202/60af6631133eb7d8a3a0debdb3c207c6.jpg)
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on December 02, 2017, 06:58:42 PM
Sorry not following. Across what two terminals are you testing for power?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: yitrap on December 02, 2017, 08:19:42 PM
Sorry not following. Across what two terminals are you testing for power?
Tried all three "holes" of a single plug/outlet on the bar, they all show live with my tester.

I know the tester works cause when I try in a regular outlet only the live one shows live.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on December 02, 2017, 08:22:00 PM
Tried all three "holes" of a single plug/outlet on the bar, they all show live with my tester.

I know the tester works cause when I try in a regular outlet only the live one shows live.
How were you testing them. Is this just a single lead tester you touch to each terminal/hole?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: as2 on December 02, 2017, 08:24:40 PM
Tried all three "holes" of a single plug/outlet on the bar, they all show live with my tester.

I know the tester works cause when I try in a regular outlet only the live one shows live.
It may be getting a "live" read from another "hole", is that possible?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: yitrap on December 02, 2017, 08:24:48 PM
How were you testing them. Is this just a single lead tester you touch to each terminal/hole?
Yes, something like this.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on December 02, 2017, 08:34:45 PM
You might be getting those reading because of some type of surge protection the strip might have. Remember the power strip works with the adapter.

Did you try the power strip in a different outlet. Also do you any appliance that has a three prong plug and try it in the outlet.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: yitrap on January 10, 2018, 11:47:29 AM
Update. I bought a new power bar wired it up and it works like a charm. Thanks for all the help
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: henche on January 10, 2018, 11:53:03 AM
What would it cost to re-wire 4 BX cables with newer stuff, in a small house (so, not going that far)
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: henche on January 10, 2018, 12:07:29 PM
What would it cost to replace a meter box?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ual902 on February 08, 2018, 02:54:59 AM
 How do I get these 2 wires from an NEC intercom to power up a ring door bell pro? a tranformer?. The ring door bell will replace the NEC intercom.


(http://i925.photobucket.com/albums/ad97/ual902/20180208_021932.jpg)[/URL]
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: chbochur on February 11, 2018, 06:37:47 PM
Looking for a good electrician in the Flatbush area to put up some light fixtures
Any leads are appreciated
Tia
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: whacked1 on February 11, 2018, 06:43:17 PM
Looking for a good electrician in the Flatbush area to put up some light fixtures
Any leads are appreciated
Tia
I'll pm
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on February 11, 2018, 06:43:56 PM
What would it cost to re-wire 4 BX cables with newer stuff, in a small house (so, not going that far)
What is code, romex or conduit?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on February 11, 2018, 06:44:30 PM
What would it cost to replace a meter box?
What's a meter box?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: cozmohoot on February 11, 2018, 08:45:41 PM
Part of my basement has 3 light fixtures. They are 2 foot long t12 fluorescent tube bulbs. The older thick ones.
How tricky is it to change them to recessed fixtures? Tia. Maybe I should speak to whacked1's person...
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: David R on February 11, 2018, 09:00:36 PM
Part of my basement has 3 light fixtures. They are 2 foot long t12 fluorescent tube bulbs. The older thick ones.
How tricky is it to change them to recessed fixtures? Tia. Maybe I should speak to whacked1's person...
It depends if the end of the cable at the point where it enters the fluorescent fixture can reach where it needs to be to enter the recessed fixture. It could depend on many other things. For example, if the wiring is very old, it can crumble as you work with it. Why do you think it might be tricky?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: cozmohoot on February 11, 2018, 09:21:02 PM
Cuz I'm not an electrician, lol.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: username on February 14, 2018, 05:35:37 PM
fluorescent light/fixture sounds like a motorcycle (slight exaggeration), What needs to be replaced?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: cozmohoot on February 14, 2018, 06:19:38 PM
fluorescent light/fixture sounds like a motorcycle (slight exaggeration), What needs to be replaced?
U referring to my q? I listed the exact bulb type and length...but even after changing to small recessed spot I would have to close up the extra space.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: username on February 14, 2018, 07:05:26 PM
fluorescent light/fixture sounds like a motorcycle (slight exaggeration), What needs to be replaced?

nothing to do with cozmohoot. just his q reminded me of this issue.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: myi on February 14, 2018, 07:10:22 PM
fluorescent light/fixture sounds like a motorcycle (slight exaggeration), What needs to be replaced?
If the ballast is old, it starts to play a nice hum, which means the whole ballast (meaning if the fixture consists of 2-3 ballast in the fixture)needs to be replaced.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: David R on February 23, 2018, 02:26:22 PM
If the ballast is old, it starts to play a nice hum, which means the whole ballast (meaning if the fixture consists of 2-3 ballast in the fixture)needs to be replaced.
If it's a 4 foot fixture that uses tubes and the ballast(s) needs replacing, I would bypass it/them and replace the bulbs with LED tubes that do not need a ballast.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: mgarfin on March 04, 2018, 02:18:30 PM
Im installing LED strip lights in a kitchen
I want 2 24v LED strips with about 72W each.

Im trying to figure what power supply to use.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01B1PREK6
https://www.amazon.com/Dimmable-Driver-Magnetic-Transformer-Voltage/dp/B073FT57V
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01IU8QBCO/
https://www.amazon.com/uxcell-Switching-Power-Supply-Driver/dp/B008SO7QPM
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B077NFHDVB


im seeing a very big gap in pricing, can anyone explain?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on March 04, 2018, 02:29:38 PM
Don't they come with their own power source?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: mgarfin on March 04, 2018, 02:34:03 PM
Don't they come with their own power source?

Some do and some don't
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on March 04, 2018, 02:41:28 PM
Some do and some don't
Link to the LED strips?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: aygart on March 04, 2018, 02:43:50 PM
Some do and some don't
So why don't you just get one which does?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: mgarfin on March 04, 2018, 03:20:24 PM
So why don't you just get one which does?

It doesn't work for my situation!
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on March 04, 2018, 04:22:52 PM
Look at the specs. One of them is a dimmer so more money. There are also different wattages. Does the manufacturer recommend a PS?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: mgarfin on March 04, 2018, 04:45:31 PM
what is PS?

Still
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01B1PREK6 
$20.99

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B073FT57VL
$93.99


Then there is a 500w for $35
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01IU8QBCO

20-90?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on March 04, 2018, 05:50:41 PM
PS - Power Supply
$93 one is dimmable.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: yesitsme on May 13, 2018, 08:02:27 PM
can someone please explain to me why/how some timers aren't compatible to led lights?
Quote
This switch requires a MINIMUM 40 watts and MAXIMUM 500 watts to function. This switch will not work with LED or CFL type lighting.
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B004SOZI2Y/

is it only led's that might have issues but they all work with incandescent bulbs?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: yesitsme on May 13, 2018, 08:06:43 PM
can someone please explain to me why/how some timers aren't compatible to led lights?https://www.amazon.com/dp/B004SOZI2Y/

is it only led's that might have issues but they all work with incandescent bulbs?
got my answer
https://diy.stackexchange.com/a/67951/35548
thanks
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: yesitsme on May 13, 2018, 08:33:54 PM
can someone please explain to me how a timer could work without a neutral?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on May 13, 2018, 08:52:05 PM
can someone please explain to me how a timer could work without a neutral?
Neutral goes directly to the bulb and the timer switches the hot.
ETA: Look at the timer as a simple light switch.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: yesitsme on May 13, 2018, 08:56:32 PM
Neutral goes directly to the bulb and the timer switches the hot.
You're right I don't understand how the timer works with out a full circuit it only has the hot, in 2nd grade i was taught that in order for anything to work with electricity you need a full circuit,
I understand how to wire it I dont understand how it works.
Please don't get moster involved just answer me quickly thanks.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ElectricCPR on May 13, 2018, 09:03:52 PM
You're right I don't understand how the timer works with out a full circuit it only has the hot, in 2nd grade i was taught that in order for anything to work with electricity you need a full circuit,
I understand how to wire it I dont understand how it works.
Please don't get moster involved just answer me quickly thanks.
The switch works with a built in ground 
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on May 13, 2018, 09:04:08 PM
Look at the bulb as a simple resistor. Hot goes directly to timer and neutral goes through the resistor (bulb) to the timer. The timer now has a hot and neutral.
This might help: https://customer.honeywell.com/resources/techlit/TechLitDocuments/69-0000s/69-2454EFS.pdf

Now a question for you. If the bulb burns out does the timer have power?  :)
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: yesitsme on May 13, 2018, 09:11:51 PM
Look at the bulb as a simple resistor. Hot goes directly to timer and neutral goes through the resistor (bulb) to the timer. The timer now has a hot and neutral.
This might help: https://customer.honeywell.com/resources/techlit/TechLitDocuments/69-0000s/69-2454EFS.pdf

Now a question for you. If the bulb burns out does the timer have power?  :)
Thank You very much, Dus iz a R' chaim, whats the answer to your question, i believe that it wouldn't but there would be no need unless if it displays the time and you lost you watch, since it needs a minimum 50 watts for it to function properly, correct me if i'm wrong.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on May 13, 2018, 09:15:03 PM
Thank You very much, Dus iz a R' chaim, whats the answer to your question, i believe that it wouldn't but there would be no need unless if it displays the time and you lost you watch, since it needs a minimum 50 watts for it to function properly, correct me if i'm wrong.
You are correct and the 50 watts IMHO is over kill. I seen them work with 10 watt bulbs.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: yesitsme on May 13, 2018, 09:20:12 PM
if the switchbox doesnt have a neutral how safe would it be to substitute with the ground? or what other tricks are there to go around the problem?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ElectricCPR on May 13, 2018, 09:22:35 PM
if the switchbox doesnt have a neutral how safe would it be to substitute with the ground? or what other tricks are there to go around the problem?
One of the tricks of the trade, they both get connected to the same place in the electric panel
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: yesitsme on May 13, 2018, 09:22:44 PM
The switch works with a built in ground
What in the world? does it also come with a built in hot?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: yesitsme on May 13, 2018, 09:24:21 PM
One of the tricks of the trade, they both get connected to the same place in the electric panel
I heard of that in the past I just want to know safety wise if its Lekatchila or for buchorim in the dorm its ok.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ElectricCPR on May 13, 2018, 09:24:32 PM
What in the world? does it also come with a built in hot?
The ground is the neutral it gets connected via when screwing in the switch
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on May 13, 2018, 09:24:51 PM
if the switchbox doesnt have a neutral how safe would it be to substitute with the ground? or what other tricks are there to go around the problem?
Never ever use ground for neutral. Why do you need a neutral?
Full disclosure: I am not an electrician but an electronic technician.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ElectricCPR on May 13, 2018, 09:25:29 PM
I heard of that in the past I just want to know safety wise if its Lekatchila or for buchorim in the dorm its ok.
It's 100% safe and is ok as long as there is no inspection.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ElectricCPR on May 13, 2018, 09:26:08 PM
Never ever use ground for neutral. Why do you need a neutral?
Full disclosure: I am not an electrician but an electronic technician.
Sorry to bust your bubble I am
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on May 13, 2018, 09:29:44 PM
Sorry to bust your bubble I am
You should not say it is 100% safe.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: yesitsme on May 13, 2018, 09:30:50 PM
Please fight it out (only with explanations not with you could/you cant) and let me know thanks,
Quote
My uncle always used to say ďthe hardest thing to remember is what you didnít used to know.Ē People who donít know wiring will be better served by the rule of thumb that the ground and the neutral are not interchangeable. People who do know wiring, will know what to do to figure out what is going on on the circuits in front of them.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on May 13, 2018, 09:33:11 PM
Please fight it out (only with explanations not with you could/you cant) and let me know thanks,
Nothing to fight out. You are replacing the switch with a timer. The timer now becomes the switch in simple terms.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ElectricCPR on May 13, 2018, 09:33:47 PM
Please fight it out (only with explanations not with you could/you cant) and let me know thanks,
At the panel the neutral wire block is connected the main ground, with this fact in mind, the ground and neutral are virtually the same.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on May 13, 2018, 09:38:58 PM
At the panel the neutral wire block is connected the main ground, with this fact in mind, the ground and neutral are virtually the same.
The voltage potential at that point is the same. Through out the house that will not be the same. As an electrician you are fully aware in older houses the conduit itself was the ground. You try using that as your neutral is an accident waiting to happen.

Now back to the bubble busting. An ET is way up the food chain from an electrician.  :)
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ElectricCPR on May 13, 2018, 09:40:00 PM
The voltage potential at that point is the same. Through out the house that will not be the same. As an electrician you are fully aware in older houses the conduit itself was the ground. You try using that as your neutral is an accident waiting to happen.

Now back to the bubble busting. An ET is way above the food chain than an electrician.  :)
I'd only use it for timers
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: yesitsme on May 13, 2018, 09:42:28 PM
https://community.smartthings.com/t/faq-neutral-and-ground-wires-are-not-interchangeable/27849/23
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: yesitsme on May 13, 2018, 09:52:35 PM
https://community.smartthings.com/t/faq-neutral-and-ground-wires-are-not-interchangeable/27849/23
Based in that discussion, as long as the neutral points back to the same panel its mostly safe, since in NYC all wiring is required to be in a conduit it should be enough to attach to the switch-box.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on May 13, 2018, 09:57:59 PM
Based in that discussion, as long as the neutral points back to the same panel its mostly safe, since in NYC all wiring is required to be in a conduit it should be enough to attach to the switch-box.
Let me say this again. Never use the ground as a neutral.
There are many situations where this can be dangerous. Things can be wired wrong or you can get broken/welded wires. Try using ground for neutral with a GFCI?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: yesitsme on May 13, 2018, 09:59:14 PM
If someone got the 2 wire timer and wants to use it for a chandelier with LED bulbs you can flip one of the many bulbs with a incandescent bulb and everything should work fine.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on May 13, 2018, 10:01:59 PM
If someone got the 2 wire timer and wants to use it for a chandelier with LED bulbs you can flip one of the many bulbs with a incandescent bulb and everything should work fine.
If all the bulbs are in parallel, yes.  :)
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: yesitsme on May 13, 2018, 10:12:01 PM
If all the bulbs are in parallel, yes.  :)
oh my i thought i'm done, what difference would it make? i w'd assume that most chandeliers are parallel otherwise if one burns out none of them would work correct me if i'm wrong.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on May 13, 2018, 10:15:13 PM
oh my i thought i'm done, what difference would it make? i w'd assume that most chandeliers are parallel otherwise if one burns out none of them would work correct me if i'm wrong.
I couldn't let you go that easy.  :)
You are correct. I would also assume they are in parallel since I never seen one in series. 
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: David R on May 14, 2018, 12:29:51 PM
If someone got the 2 wire timer and wants to use it for a chandelier with LED bulbs you can flip one of the many bulbs with a incandescent bulb and everything should work fine.
Go for halogen; they are much more energy efficient.
More importantly, there are some incandescent bulbs that as they blow, a shorter segment of the filament can contact both sides, reducing the resistance and sending a surge of current through the timer that blows the timer. I had a few timers that failed and I suspect this type of bulb failure contributed to it. Halogen bulbs that I have seen tend to have a single straight filament where this would not happen.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: yesitsme on May 15, 2018, 11:41:36 PM
Where can I still get this timer ?
http://intermaticstore.com/~/media/intermatic/documentation/obsolete/ej341.pdf
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on May 15, 2018, 11:54:09 PM
Where can I still get this timer ?
http://intermaticstore.com/~/media/intermatic/documentation/obsolete/ej341.pdf
I had one of those for the garage lights.
http://www.neobits.com/intermatic_ej341ac_intermatic_ej341ac_has_been_p10825267.html?atc=gbp&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIj93v-6mJ2wIVHLbACh2c9wSKEAQYBCABEgJ-PfD_BwE

https://www.amazon.com/Intermatic-EJ341C-Programmable-24-Hour-Security/dp/B001O20RWY
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: yesitsme on July 05, 2018, 02:35:29 PM
How do clear a setting for
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B004SOZI2Y/
you can set 7 programs per week how do you reset program 1  and 2 they should stop running when set to auto?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: David R on July 05, 2018, 02:56:12 PM
How do clear a setting for
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B004SOZI2Y/
you can set 7 programs per week how do you reset program 1  and 2 they should stop running when set to auto?
Cycle through the days for particular program until the day selected is no day at all.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: Something Fishy on July 05, 2018, 05:26:46 PM
Turning off breakers in my house is a pain. I'm going to replace a thermostat (3 wires, if that matters) - do I really need to turn off the fuse, or am I gonna kill myself?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ElectricCPR on July 05, 2018, 05:29:18 PM
If it's low voltage (it usually is) you don't have to worry about turning off the breaker
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: JoeyShmoe on July 05, 2018, 06:30:34 PM
Turning off breakers in my house is a pain. I'm going to replace a thermostat (3 wires, if that matters) - do I really need to turn off the fuse, or am I gonna kill myself?
Is the thermostat connected to power or is it battery powered? If it is the latter (most likely IMO) then the 3 wires are low voltage and turning off the breaker won't do anything anyway
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: moko on July 05, 2018, 06:38:14 PM
How safe is it to use a 2-to-3 prong plug converter for an ac?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on July 05, 2018, 06:41:33 PM
Turning off breakers in my house is a pain. I'm going to replace a thermostat (3 wires, if that matters) - do I really need to turn off the fuse, or am I gonna kill myself?
No you won't kill yourself but always a good idea to turn off breaker. Safety first. :)
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on July 05, 2018, 06:42:03 PM
How safe is it to use a 2-to-3 prong plug converter for an account?
account?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: moko on July 05, 2018, 06:54:49 PM
account?
darn autocorrect
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on July 05, 2018, 06:56:35 PM
darn autocorrect
By adapter do you mean you will be grounding it through the screw on outlet cover?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: moko on July 05, 2018, 07:28:28 PM
By adapter do you mean you will be grounding it through the screw on outlet cover?
It has the option to screw it in, but it's my understanding that just screwing it in is not necessarily grounding it.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: yesitsme on July 05, 2018, 07:43:06 PM
It has the option to screw it in, but it's my understanding that just screwing it in is not necessarily grounding it.
If the switch box is grounded and you it into the switch box then it will be grounded as well
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on July 05, 2018, 08:00:58 PM
It has the option to screw it in, but it's my understanding that just screwing it in is not necessarily grounding it.
If the switch box is grounded and you it into the switch box then it will be grounded as well
You want it grounded. Safety first!
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: Something Fishy on July 05, 2018, 08:10:00 PM
If it's low voltage (it usually is) you don't have to worry about turning off the breaker

Is the thermostat connected to power or is it battery powered? If it is the latter (most likely IMO) then the 3 wires are low voltage and turning off the breaker won't do anything anyway

Yes, it is.

All installed, and I survived to tell the tale.

Thanks guys.

Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: JoeyShmoe on July 05, 2018, 08:11:06 PM
Yes, it is.

All installed, and I survived to tell the tale.

Thanks guys.
ברוך מחיה מתים
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on July 05, 2018, 08:16:23 PM
Yes, it is.

All installed, and I survived to tell the tale.

Thanks guys.
Any small sparks?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: Something Fishy on July 05, 2018, 08:35:55 PM
Any small sparks?

Nope
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: stooges44 on August 16, 2018, 09:54:51 AM
I've googled myself out, already,

I have this bulb which I think is an "sylvania f34cw/ss"

(https://i.gyazo.com/03f1d0d5b5af904fc76abbb4de1c4530.png)

I'm looking for a replacement that I can buy online (with delivery) and so far I haven't found an exact match, can anyone help me find a similar one. I found this one https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0165PE8CY/ but I'm not sure if it will match based on this Q and A: https://www.amazon.com/ask/questions/TxM8Z5U7PM4GZL/ref=ask_ql_ql_al_hza

I don't care about the wattage etc... I just need something that will work and wont blow the ballast.

TIA!!
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ckmk47 on August 16, 2018, 10:30:17 AM
I've googled myself out, already,

I'm looking for a replacement that I can buy online (with delivery)
I don't care about the wattage etc... I just need something that will work and wont blow the ballast.

TIA!!
It might pay to go into a local, knowledgable hardware store.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: srap on August 16, 2018, 11:28:58 AM
I've googled myself out, already,

I have this bulb which I think is an "sylvania f34cw/ss"

(https://i.gyazo.com/03f1d0d5b5af904fc76abbb4de1c4530.png)

I'm looking for a replacement that I can buy online (with delivery) and so far I haven't found an exact match, can anyone help me find a similar one. I found this one https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0165PE8CY/ (https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0165PE8CY/) but I'm not sure if it will match based on this Q and A: https://www.amazon.com/ask/questions/TxM8Z5U7PM4GZL/ref=ask_ql_ql_al_hza (https://www.amazon.com/ask/questions/TxM8Z5U7PM4GZL/ref=ask_ql_ql_al_hza)

I don't care about the wattage etc... I just need something that will work and wont blow the ballast.

TIA!!
What was wrong with this one?  https://www.blocklighting.com/product/41467/f34cwsseco-sylvania-24596-34-watt-t12-fluorescent-g13-base-4200k?gclid=EAIaIQobChMIgMWGxe_x3AIVT-DICh22HAmeEAQYAiABEgKKE_D_BwE

The ss tacked on the end of yours is probably for "supersaver".  So, too, the circled E on both of yours is probably for ECOLOGIC.  Theirs is just written out, as well.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ElectricCPR on August 16, 2018, 04:57:10 PM
It might pay to go into a local, knowledgable hardware store.
+1

or just homedepot.com
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: stooges44 on September 06, 2018, 08:43:51 PM
Is it safe to plug a "plug in class 2 transformer" into a power strip?

Specifically, I want to know if I can safely put this (http://store.rainbird.com/ut1-replacement-transformer-rain-bird-sst-timers.html) into a power strip for long term?

Thanks!
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on September 06, 2018, 08:47:28 PM
Inside? I don't see why not.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: stooges44 on September 06, 2018, 08:50:54 PM
Inside? I don't see why not.

Yes, inside. I don't know, the plug is the heaviest I've ever seen for a plug. It's at least 1 pound and I hear horror stories occasionally of too many things connected in too many different ways that were not designed for it.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on September 06, 2018, 08:54:39 PM
Yes, inside. I don't know, the plug is the heaviest I've ever seen for a plug. It's at least 1 pound and I hear horror stories occasionally of too many things connected in too many different ways that were not designed for it.
Probably well built. I don't see it drawing much current. Trying to find the input specs now.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: stooges44 on September 06, 2018, 08:56:41 PM
Probably well built. I don't see it drawing much current. Trying to find the input specs now.

Does this help?

UL rated
Input: AC 120-Volt/60 Hz, output: AC 25.5-Volt/650 mA
For vertical or floor mount use only; use in dry locations only
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on September 06, 2018, 08:59:12 PM
Does this help?

UL rated
Input: AC 120-Volt/60 Hz, output: AC 25.5-Volt/650 mA
For vertical or floor mount use only; use in dry locations only
That's what I found. Can't see it drawing much current.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: how on September 06, 2018, 09:35:57 PM
Is it safe to plug a "plug in class 2 transformer" into a power strip?

Specifically, I want to know if I can safely put this (http://store.rainbird.com/ut1-replacement-transformer-rain-bird-sst-timers.html) into a power strip for long term?

Thanks!
I didn't follow your link but sometimes  those heavy ones are screwed to the outlet
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: stooges44 on September 06, 2018, 10:04:23 PM
I didn't follow your link but sometimes  those heavy ones are screwed to the outlet

This one doesn't have a screw and it's also not even three prongs so I guess it can't be that heavy duty
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: yos9694 on September 07, 2018, 02:48:04 PM
Question about wiring up a new 3-way switch to join up with two existing single pole switches (not replace).

Currently have Light Bulb #1 controlled by Switch #1 and Light Bulb #2 controlled by Switch #2. I want to add a Switch #3 that will control both Bulb #1 and Bulb #2 at once in a way that preserves the individual control of Switch #1 and Switch #2. Is this possible to do? Assume I have easy access to the existing wires and can easily run new wires from there.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: David R on September 07, 2018, 03:09:37 PM
Question about wiring up a new 3-way switch to join up with two existing single pole switches (not replace).

Currently have Light Bulb #1 controlled by Switch #1 and Light Bulb #2 controlled by Switch #2. I want to add a Switch #3 that will control both Bulb #1 and Bulb #2 at once in a way that preserves the individual control of Switch #1 and Switch #2. Is this possible to do? Assume I have easy access to the existing wires and can easily run new wires from there.
How do you want switch #3 to control the bulbs? With three switches, there are 8 possibilities.
Please specify what you want the bulbs to do in each of the 8 possibilities.

Current configuration:
Switch #1 down, Switch #2 down = Bulb #1 off, bulb #2 off
Switch #1 down, Switch #2 up = Bulb #1 off, bulb #2 on
Switch #1 up, Switch #2 down = Bulb #1 on, bulb #2 off
Switch #1 up, Switch #2 up = Bulb #1 on, bulb #2 on

Proposed configuration (Please replace the question marks with what you want the bulbs to do):
Switch #1 down, Switch #2 down, Switch #3 down = Bulb #1 ?, bulb #2 ?
Switch #1 down, Switch #2 up, Switch #3 down = Bulb #1 ?, bulb #2 ?
Switch #1 up, Switch #2 down, Switch #3 down = Bulb #1 ?, bulb #2 ?
Switch #1 up, Switch #2 up, Switch #3 down = Bulb #1 ?, bulb #2 ?
Switch #1 down, Switch #2 down, Switch #3 up = Bulb #1 ?, bulb #2 ?
Switch #1 down, Switch #2 up, Switch #3 up = Bulb #1 ?, bulb #2 ?
Switch #1 up, Switch #2 down, Switch #3 up = Bulb #1 ?, bulb #2 ?
Switch #1 up, Switch #2 up, Switch #3 up = Bulb #1 ?, bulb #2 ?

Or perhaps you want your new switch to have three positions, in which case there will be 12 possibilities:
Switch #1 down, Switch #2 down, Switch #3 down = Bulb #1 ?, bulb #2 ?
Switch #1 down, Switch #2 up, Switch #3 down = Bulb #1 ?, bulb #2 ?
Switch #1 up, Switch #2 down, Switch #3 down = Bulb #1 ?, bulb #2 ?
Switch #1 up, Switch #2 up, Switch #3 down = Bulb #1 ?, bulb #2 ?
Switch #1 down, Switch #2 down, Switch #3 up = Bulb #1 ?, bulb #2 ?
Switch #1 down, Switch #2 up, Switch #3 up = Bulb #1 ?, bulb #2 ?
Switch #1 up, Switch #2 down, Switch #3 up = Bulb #1 ?, bulb #2 ?
Switch #1 up, Switch #2 up, Switch #3 up = Bulb #1 ?, bulb #2 ?
Switch #1 down, Switch #2 down, Switch #3 center = Bulb #1 ?, bulb #2 ?
Switch #1 down, Switch #2 up, Switch #3 center = Bulb #1 ?, bulb #2 ?
Switch #1 up, Switch #2 down, Switch #3 center = Bulb #1 ?, bulb #2 ?
Switch #1 up, Switch #2 up, Switch #3 center = Bulb #1 ?, bulb #2 ?

Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: yos9694 on September 07, 2018, 03:16:54 PM
Switch #1 down, Switch #2 down, Switch #3 down = Bulb #1 off, bulb #2 off
Switch #1 down, Switch #2 up, Switch #3 down = Bulb #1 off, bulb #2 on
Switch #1 up, Switch #2 down, Switch #3 down = Bulb #1 on, bulb #2 off
Switch #1 up, Switch #2 up, Switch #3 down = Bulb #1 on, bulb #2 on
Switch #1 down, Switch #2 down, Switch #3 up = Bulb #1 on, bulb #2 on
Switch #1 down, Switch #2 up, Switch #3 up = Bulb #1 on, bulb #2 off
Switch #1 up, Switch #2 down, Switch #3 up = Bulb #1 off, bulb #2 on
Switch #1 up, Switch #2 up, Switch #3 up = Bulb #1 off, bulb #2 off
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on September 07, 2018, 03:32:39 PM
Switch #1 down, Switch #2 down, Switch #3 down = Bulb #1 off, bulb #2 off
Switch #1 down, Switch #2 up, Switch #3 down = Bulb #1 off, bulb #2 on
Switch #1 up, Switch #2 down, Switch #3 down = Bulb #1 on, bulb #2 off
Switch #1 up, Switch #2 up, Switch #3 down = Bulb #1 on, bulb #2 on
Switch #1 down, Switch #2 down, Switch #3 up = Bulb #1 on, bulb #2 on
Switch #1 down, Switch #2 up, Switch #3 up = Bulb #1 off, bulb #2 on
Switch #1 up, Switch #2 down, Switch #3 up = Bulb #1 on, bulb #2 off
Switch #1 up, Switch #2 up, Switch #3 up = Bulb #1 off, bulb #2 off
Not making sense. Look at these two. Switch #3 had no effect.
Switch #1 up, Switch #2 down, Switch #3 down = Bulb #1 on, bulb #2 off
Switch #1 up, Switch #2 down, Switch #3 up = Bulb #1 on, bulb #2 off

Do you want switch #3 to reverse the state of the bulbs (on/off) or to turn the bulbs on/off together no matter what their state is (on/off)?

ETA: I don't think the second part of my question is doable.


Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: yos9694 on September 07, 2018, 03:58:34 PM
Not making sense. Look at these two. Switch #3 had no effect.
Switch #1 up, Switch #2 down, Switch #3 down = Bulb #1 on, bulb #2 off
Switch #1 up, Switch #2 down, Switch #3 up = Bulb #1 on, bulb #2 off

Do you want switch #3 to reverse the state of the bulbs (on/off) or to turn the bulbs on/off together no matter what their state is (on/off)?

ETA: I don't think the second part of my question is doable.

Oops, the answers there should have been the reverse. I edited and corrected it. Thanks.

The main thing I want is to have switch #3 control both bulbs whenever it is changed, but switch #1 only controls bulb #1 when it is changed and switch #2 only controls bulb #2. Any way that it is possible to do that would be fine with me
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: aygart on September 07, 2018, 06:11:15 PM
Oops, the answers there should have been the reverse. I edited and corrected it. Thanks.

The main thing I want is to have switch #3 control both bulbs whenever it is changed, but switch #1 only controls bulb #1 when it is changed and switch #2 only controls bulb #2. Any way that it is possible to do that would be fine with me
That should be very easy and would use a regular switch. Just run wires for each bulb out of switch 3 with each one having its own switch along the way.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: aygart on September 07, 2018, 06:15:45 PM
That should be very easy and would use a regular switch. Just run wires for each bulb out of switch 3 with each one having its own switch along the way.
For clarity
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on September 07, 2018, 07:07:30 PM
That should be very easy and would use a regular switch. Just run wires for each bulb out of switch 3 with each one having its own switch along the way.
For clarity
LOL. He wants 1-3 and 2-3 to act like 3 way switches. Not sure they make two 3 way switches in one (switch #3).
ETA: You would need a double pole three way switch. Don't think they make one.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: yos9694 on September 08, 2018, 08:53:10 PM
Thanks
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: David R on September 08, 2018, 09:58:28 PM
Oops, the answers there should have been the reverse. I edited and corrected it. Thanks.

The main thing I want is to have switch #3 control both bulbs whenever it is changed, but switch #1 only controls bulb #1 when it is changed and switch #2 only controls bulb #2. Any way that it is possible to do that would be fine with me
You would have to (contrary to your original post) change both existing switches to three way switches. Then you would need to add a double pole double throw switch for switch #3. I don't recall seeing such a product in the shape and size of a standard light switch for installation into home wiring. If you can't find one, you can install a regular switch to control a DPDT lighting contactor / relay.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on September 08, 2018, 10:49:55 PM
You would have to (contrary to your original post) change both existing switches to three way switches. Then you would need to add a double pole double throw switch for switch #3. I don't recall seeing such a product in the shape and size of a standard light switch for installation into home wiring. If you can't find one, you can install a regular switch to control a DPDT lighting contactor / relay.
The other option is instead of one #3 switch you get two switches for #3. You would have to turn both on/off together.
https://www.eslsupply.com/pass-seymour-693wg-15-amp-white-2-3-way-120-277-volt-stack-switch-combination-switch/?CAWELAID=120164090000008399&CATARGETID=120164090000054927&CADEVICE=c
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: yos9694 on September 20, 2018, 03:42:35 PM
Just to follow up on this, I decided to make new switch a shutoff switch instead. When the new switch is ON, the existing switches will be powered and can control the lights individually. When the new switch is OFF, the lights are off no matter what position the existing switches are in.

Rewiring the 3-way set up as single-pole to the existing switches. Current setup has 2 LINE wires and 2 LOAD wires. I'll be connecting both LINE wires to the new switch and leave the LOAD wires connected to the existing switches. Then I'll connect the other side of the new switch to the common side of the existing switches. Seems straightforward, but if anyone has advice or warnings about doing this before I go ahead with it I'd be appreciative.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on September 20, 2018, 06:46:54 PM
I am confused with load/line side. Is this a GFCI (ground fault) device?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: David R on September 20, 2018, 07:39:02 PM
Show us a diagram.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: yos9694 on September 20, 2018, 09:29:45 PM
Hard for me to do a diagram. I'm already done and it worked. I'll try to describe it again and if that doesn't work I'll try to draw it later.

Original wiring was two simple switches, each on had a hot wire (line) and a white wire (load). The load wires go to the fixtures. The neutral wires are in the box but are not connected directly to the switches.

New wiring- I left the white wires where they were on the old switches, but removed the hot wires from the old switches and attached them instead to the new switch. Then I took a new piece of wire and connected one end of it to the second terminal on the new switch and the other end of it to the empty side of each old switch. It works as I described- each old switch controls the one fixture just as it did before, but only if the new switch is in the ON position. If the new switch is OFF then neither light can be turned on by the old switches.

This last paragraph is not really relevant to the set up in general, so feel free to ignore it.
There is one other thing that I didn't mention... the new switch is a timer and needs a current at all times or the screen blanks out. In this set up, if both old switches are OFF then the timer can't draw a current. (In a normal set up, the timer doesn't have another switch behind it, so it is able to draw a current even while the lights it controls are off by relying on its high resistance). To work around this, I dug out a neutral wire from the box and connected it to another terminal on the timer switch.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on September 20, 2018, 09:45:27 PM
Glad it all worked for you.
Someone messed up your wiring. The white wire is neutral and should not be switched.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: yos9694 on September 20, 2018, 10:18:21 PM
Someone messed up your wiring. The white wire is neutral and should not be switched.

That's not accurate. It's extremely common and perfectly fine to have the neutral wire connected to the fixture and not to the switch. The switch is wired up with only a Line wire and a Load wire. Line comes in hot, load goes to the fixture, and the wire out of the fixture goes to the neutral. Check out some wiring diagrams to see this setup. Absolutely nothing wrong with it.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on September 20, 2018, 10:39:43 PM
That's not accurate. It's extremely common and perfectly fine to have the neutral wire connected to the fixture and not to the switch. The switch is wired up with only a Line wire and a Load wire. Line comes in hot, load goes to the fixture, and the wire out of the fixture goes to the neutral. Check out some wiring diagrams to see this setup. Absolutely nothing wrong with it.
I think you read what I wrote wrong.

Can you please link to wiring diagrams where the white (neutral) wire is switched? If you are going to use a white wire as a switched wire you should mark it somehow with like black tape.

This is the part I don't get: "New wiring- I left the white wires where they were on the old switches,"
Why is there white wires on the switch?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: David R on September 20, 2018, 10:48:13 PM


Hard for me to do a diagram. I'm already done and it worked. I'll try to describe it again and if that doesn't work I'll try to draw it later.

Original wiring was two simple switches, each on had a hot wire (line) and a white wire (load). The load wires go to the fixtures. The neutral wires are in the box but are not connected directly to the switches.

New wiring- I left the white wires where they were on the old switches, but removed the hot wires from the old switches and attached them instead to the new switch. Then I took a new piece of wire and connected one end of it to the second terminal on the new switch and the other end of it to the empty side of each old switch. It works as I described- each old switch controls the one fixture just as it did before, but only if the new switch is in the ON position. If the new switch is OFF then neither light can be turned on by the old switches.

This last paragraph is not really relevant to the set up in general, so feel free to ignore it.
There is one other thing that I didn't mention... the new switch is a timer and needs a current at all times or the screen blanks out. In this set up, if both old switches are OFF then the timer can't draw a current. (In a normal set up, the timer doesn't have another switch behind it, so it is able to draw a current even while the lights it controls are off by relying on its high resistance). To work around this, I dug out a neutral wire from the box and connected it to another terminal on the timer switch.
"Original wiring was two simple switches, each on had a hot wire (line)"
Did you connect both of these to each other and to a single terminal of the new switch? My concern would be if they previously were controlled by two separate circuit breakers, in which case they shouldn't be connected to each other. How could you verify that now without undoing it? Turn off all circuit breakers except the main. Then turn on one at a time while someone watches the timer. If more than one of them causes the timer to come to life, you have a problem.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: David R on September 20, 2018, 11:17:53 PM
I think you read what I wrote wrong.

Can you please link to wiring diagrams where the white (neutral) wire is switched? If you are going to use a white wire as a switched wire you should mark it somehow with like black tape.

This is the part I don't get: "New wiring- I left the white wires where they were on the old switches,"
Why is there white wires on the switch?
You equate white with neutral. It's not always used that way. For example, if the first segment of cable goes from the circuit breaker panel to a ceiling light fixture and a second segment of cable goes from the ceiling light fixture to a wall switch, that second segment will have a black insulated wire that is always hot and a white insulated wire that is hot when the switch is on.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on September 20, 2018, 11:21:50 PM
You equate white with neutral. It's not always used that way. For example, if the first segment of cable goes from the circuit breaker panel to a ceiling light fixture and a second segment of cable goes from the ceiling light fixture to a wall switch, that second segment will have a black insulated wire that is always hot and a white insulated wire that is hot when the switch is on.
If the white is going to be used as a switched wire (hot) it needs to be marked. Most will use black tape.
ETA: White wires are neutral in 110V circuits unless marked otherwise.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: David R on September 20, 2018, 11:25:20 PM
If the white is going to be used as a switched wire (hot) it needs to be marked. Most will use black tape.
ETA: White wires are neutral in 110V circuits unless marked otherwise.
I agree. But how do you know that most will use black tape? Maybe most will forget or ignore the requirement; after all, it works just the same without marking it.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on September 20, 2018, 11:34:05 PM
I agree. But how do you know that most will use black tape? Maybe most will forget or ignore the requirement; after all, it works just the same without marking it.
That is why I said someone messed up the wiring and it doesn't work the same way. If you think it does you hold the white wire and touch something grounded.  :)
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: aygart on September 21, 2018, 12:11:25 AM
Show us a diagram.
Like in this post?
For clarity
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: David R on September 21, 2018, 12:13:24 AM
Like in this post?
No, I meant a diagram showing every wire.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on September 21, 2018, 12:20:07 AM
Like in this post?
Need to mark the colors of the wires.  ;)
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: yos9694 on September 23, 2018, 03:36:50 PM
"Original wiring was two simple switches, each on had a hot wire (line)"
Did you connect both of these to each other and to a single terminal of the new switch? My concern would be if they previously were controlled by two separate circuit breakers, in which case they shouldn't be connected to each other. How could you verify that now without undoing it? Turn off all circuit breakers except the main. Then turn on one at a time while someone watches the timer. If more than one of them causes the timer to come to life, you have a problem.

Good point! The two switches were on the same breaker, so no issue.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: yos9694 on September 23, 2018, 03:45:00 PM
You equate white with neutral. It's not always used that way. For example, if the first segment of cable goes from the circuit breaker panel to a ceiling light fixture and a second segment of cable goes from the ceiling light fixture to a wall switch, that second segment will have a black insulated wire that is always hot and a white insulated wire that is hot when the switch is on.

+1. I never said the wires were neutral, I called them LOAD but not everyone understood, so I said white. Plus, I specifically mwntioned that I dug out the neutral wires from in the box. Appreciate you being helpful.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on September 23, 2018, 08:03:39 PM
Just so everyone understands you never use white for load, line, hot in a 110v circuits. We call these guys "schlocks".  :)
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: Meno on October 10, 2018, 12:55:20 PM
I have a room with no lights, only an outlet connected to a light switch.

I want to put in recessed lighting. Thinking of using these:

Designers Fountain EV407941WH27 Modern Easy Up 4 inch 2700K Warm White 91 CRI Integrated Led Recessed Light with J-Box (No Can Needed) - - Amazon.com ($21.17) (https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01M1KR8EQ/?tag=cl03f-20&smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER)

(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/61VxLQoxuQL._SX425_.jpg) (https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01M1KR8EQ/?tag=cl03f-20&smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER)

Never done this before. Anyone have any tips for me before I start cutting holes and fishing wires?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: David R on October 11, 2018, 12:55:52 AM
I have a room with no lights, only an outlet connected to a light switch.

I want to put in recessed lighting. Thinking of using these:

Designers Fountain EV407941WH27 Modern Easy Up 4 inch 2700K Warm White 91 CRI Integrated Led Recessed Light with J-Box (No Can Needed) - - Amazon.com ($21.17) (https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01M1KR8EQ/?tag=cl03f-20&smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER)

(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/61VxLQoxuQL._SX425_.jpg) (https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01M1KR8EQ/?tag=cl03f-20&smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER)

Never done this before. Anyone have any tips for me before I start cutting holes and fishing wires?
The pic looks like it has holes for NM cable and the product description does not clarify what other holes are available on the junction box. If it does not have holes for metal cable, it may not be suitable for locations that require metal cable. So if your locale does not allow NM, you should pose this question on Amazon.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on October 11, 2018, 01:12:08 AM
The pic looks like it has holes for NM cable and the product description does not clarify what other holes are available on the junction box. If it does not have holes for metal cable, it may not be suitable for locations that require metal cable. So if your locale does not allow NM, you should pose this question on Amazon.
https://www.lbclighting.com/media/uploads/instructsheet/EV407941-install.pdf
This product is designed to be used with NM (Romex) cables only.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: Meno on October 11, 2018, 08:21:02 AM
The pic looks like it has holes for NM cable and the product description does not clarify what other holes are available on the junction box. If it does not have holes for metal cable, it may not be suitable for locations that require metal cable. So if your locale does not allow NM, you should pose this question on Amazon.

Thanks. How do I find out if Romex is allowed? I have a whole bunch of old Romex running through my basement. Can I assume it's fine?

Separate question: Should I replace all the old Romex in the basement?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on October 11, 2018, 09:01:53 AM
Thanks. How do I find out if Romex is allowed? I have a whole bunch of old Romex running through my basement. Can I assume it's fine?

Separate question: Should I replace all the old Romex in the basement?
Don't assume Romex is code. With that being said there is no issue with Romex.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: Meno on October 11, 2018, 09:14:13 AM
Don't assume Romex is code. With that being said there is no issue with Romex.

So hypothetically if I go ahead and do it with Romex, what's the worst case scenario? (assuming I do everything correctly)
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on October 11, 2018, 09:18:35 AM
So hypothetically if I go ahead and do it with Romex, what's the worst case scenario? (assuming I do everything correctly)
The Code Police find you and make you rip it out and fine you.  :)
IMHO in a private there would be no issue.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: Meno on October 11, 2018, 09:21:19 AM
The Code Police find you and make you rip it out and fine you.  :)
IMHO in a private there would be no issue.

Thanks.

To the code police, if you're reading this: I'm not the guy that called you yesterday. That was a different guy.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: username on October 11, 2018, 01:38:11 PM
Thanks. How do I find out if Romex is allowed? I have a whole bunch of old Romex running through my basement. Can I assume it's fine?

!!!
Make sure that you are using the correct gauge of romex for the fuse.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: Meno on October 23, 2018, 08:26:52 PM
Ok so I finally got around to looking at the wiring to try and figure out what's going on. In a nutshell: I have no idea what's going on.

I have a lightswitch that controls only one outlet, nothing else (as far as I can tell).

I pulled the switch out of the box, and found the following:

There are two Romex cables coming into the box. One has two wires (black and white) and one has three (black white and red). The two white wires are connected to each other, makes sense. The red wire is connected to the top screw on the switch. BOTH black wires are connected to the bottom screw of the switch. Huh?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on October 23, 2018, 08:46:55 PM
My guess would be.
White = neutral
Black = hot
Red = switched

The other end of three wire Romex can be feeding another circuit.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: Meno on October 23, 2018, 08:59:10 PM
My guess would be.
White = neutral
Black = hot
Red = switched

The other end of three wire Romex can be feeding another circuit.

Aha. This makes sense.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on October 23, 2018, 09:01:24 PM
Aha. This makes sense.
Is one half of the outlet hot all the time? The other half is switched?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: Meno on October 23, 2018, 09:06:55 PM
Is one half of the outlet hot all the time? The other half is switched?

Just checked and it's not. Good thought though
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: Shmulie on December 08, 2018, 08:43:39 PM
Anyone know any licensed electricians in Flatbush?
I just got my Model 3 and would like a quote on installing a 2nd meter and 240v outlet for off peak charging
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: grodnoking on December 09, 2018, 03:11:28 AM


Anyone know any licensed electricians in Flatbush?
I just got my Model 3 and would like a quote on installing a 2nd meter and 240v outlet for off peak charging

Congratulations!
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: Definitions on December 09, 2018, 05:46:09 PM
I'm trying to connect a stereo system to speakers built into the wall. On the wall there are 4 colored wires coming out (3rd picture).

The wires for the stereo are the other two pictures. There's two connectors (that are marked with positive and negative wires on each) that plug into the back of the stereo (picture 2).

The wires are spliced to make another set of 4 wires in the middle.

Which wires do I connect to what?

(https://i.ibb.co/zS8kVTJ/IMG-20181209-170138632.jpg) (https://ibb.co/VvHKYcm)
(https://i.ibb.co/LQYY7KP/IMG-20181209-165558891.jpg) (https://ibb.co/4sKKrkf)
(https://i.ibb.co/tCCK0H8/IMG-20181209-165207297.jpg) (https://ibb.co/MNNSzgM)
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ElectricCPR on December 09, 2018, 05:49:17 PM
Anyone know any licensed electricians in Flatbush?
I just got my Model 3 and would like a quote on installing a 2nd meter and 240v outlet for off peak charging
PM me
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on December 09, 2018, 06:07:34 PM
Which wires do I connect to what?
You to find out which wires (3rd picture) go to which speaker terminals.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: Definitions on December 09, 2018, 06:14:53 PM
You to find out which wires (3rd picture) go to which speaker terminals.
How do I do that? Is there a way to figure that out using a multimeter?
Also what could the fourth wire be. Isn't there only positive negative and ground?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on December 09, 2018, 06:17:41 PM
How do I do that? Is there a way to figure that out using a multimeter?
Also what could the fourth wire be. Isn't there only positive negative and ground?
Should be two wires per speaker. Yes you can use a multimeter to find the pairs but not polarity.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: puddles on December 10, 2018, 11:39:33 AM
I recently purchased a Nest for a heating zone in my house that has a thermostat outside of the bedroom and therefore rarely goes on and doesnít represent an accurate temp in the room.
The plan was to install a Nest and put the sensor inside the bedroom.
I called a handyman/electrician to install it and he said it needs a C Wire (I tried myself but kept having an issue with my boiler clicking- I believe it was trying to draw power from the boiler and resetting it, not a good thing).
Handyman said he would have to rip open walls etc. Is there any other way to go about this? Anything else that can be done? Any suggestion or tips? This is a hallway wall and shares no walls with the boiler.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: yoohoo on December 10, 2018, 12:45:11 PM
I recently purchased a Nest for a heating zone in my house that has a thermostat outside of the bedroom and therefore rarely goes on and doesnít represent an accurate temp in the room.
The plan was to install a Nest and put the sensor inside the bedroom.
I called a handyman/electrician to install it and he said it needs a C Wire (I tried myself but kept having an issue with my boiler clicking- I believe it was trying to draw power from the boiler and resetting it, not a good thing).
Handyman said he would have to rip open walls etc. Is there any other way to go about this? Anything else that can be done? Any suggestion or tips? This is a hallway wall and shares no walls with the boiler.
nest does not require a C wire. Does your current thermostat use 4 wires?
How old is your home?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: puddles on December 10, 2018, 12:49:46 PM
They said it doesnít- but when I did without a c I had the issue.

50 years or old or so. Old thermostat only had 2 wires plugged into it but four wires total. None labeled
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: yoohoo on December 10, 2018, 12:58:36 PM
They said it doesnít- but when I did without a c I had the issue.

50 years or old or so. Old thermostat only had 2 wires plugged into it but four wires total. None labeled
you have to see if at the unit it has four wires connected.  should not need to run new wires. could be the 2 extra wires arent connected to the unit in basement or attic etc since old thermostats dont require. if you pm me photos ill be glad to help

also, if your nest is dead, try charging it manually via micro usb and then try
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on December 10, 2018, 01:07:32 PM
Without a C wire it needs to charge through your heating/ac wires and it might not be compatible.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ElectricCPR on December 10, 2018, 05:11:50 PM
you have to see if at the unit it has four wires connected.  should not need to run new wires. could be the 2 extra wires arent connected to the unit in basement or attic etc since old thermostats dont require. if you pm me photos ill be glad to help

also, if your nest is dead, try charging it manually via micro usb and then try
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: good sam on December 14, 2018, 11:19:51 AM
Can someone recommend LED bulbs for my new fixtures?

I have new 6 inch cans in my dining room.

I tried retrofits but they don't work because these cans have a lip inside preventing them from going all the way up.

I tried two different LED BR40 bulbs but they both were too tall and protruded too far out of the fixtures.

Any one know the right bulbs?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: jes on December 14, 2018, 02:45:07 PM
The bulb is the right one you just need to move up the socket, Take off the cap of the can you will see a screw to adjust the socket.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: yos9694 on December 16, 2018, 11:35:40 AM
Try something like these, which use a twist in/out design so the lip should be no problem. This is definitely not the cheapest you can get them, but is an example of a retrofit design that should work for you.

https://www.amazon.com/Parmida-LED-Downlight-Replacement-INSTALLATION/dp/B01MTKYS0O
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on December 16, 2018, 11:42:22 AM
Try something like these, which use a twist in/out design so the lip should be no problem. This is definitely not the cheapest you can get them, but is an example of a retrofit design that should work for you.

https://www.amazon.com/Parmida-LED-Downlight-Replacement-INSTALLATION/dp/B01MTKYS0O
Nice!
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: yesitsme on December 16, 2018, 01:42:26 PM
Try something like these, which use a twist in/out design so the lip should be no problem. This is definitely not the cheapest you can get them, but is an example of a retrofit design that should work for you.

https://www.amazon.com/Parmida-LED-Downlight-Replacement-INSTALLATION/dp/B01MTKYS0O
Or these if your socket has clips
https://www.costco.com/Feit-5--6-LED-Retrofit-Soft-White-6-pack.product.100416653.html
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: good sam on December 22, 2018, 11:14:35 PM
Try something like these, which use a twist in/out design so the lip should be no problem. This is definitely not the cheapest you can get them, but is an example of a retrofit design that should work for you.

https://www.amazon.com/Parmida-LED-Downlight-Replacement-INSTALLATION/dp/B01MTKYS0O
Nice!
Or these if your socket has clips
https://www.costco.com/Feit-5--6-LED-Retrofit-Soft-White-6-pack.product.100416653.html
Tried something similar. The lip is inside the can about 3/4 the way up so the metal clips that hold it in place are unable to slide all the way up.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: good sam on December 22, 2018, 11:15:17 PM
The bulb is the right one you just need to move up the socket, Take off the cap of the can you will see a screw to adjust the socket.
I adjusted it all the way up, bulb still sticks out.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: David R on December 23, 2018, 02:55:42 PM
Can someone recommend LED bulbs for my new fixtures?

I have new 6 inch cans in my dining room.

I tried retrofits but they don't work because these cans have a lip inside preventing them from going all the way up.

I tried two different LED BR40 bulbs but they both were too tall and protruded too far out of the fixtures.

Any one know the right bulbs?
Please post the model number of your cans.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: good sam on December 23, 2018, 03:02:09 PM
Please post the model number of your cans.
Where is it?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: yos9694 on December 24, 2018, 11:43:10 AM
Tried something similar. The lip is inside the can about 3/4 the way up so the metal clips that hold it in place are unable to slide all the way up.

As a last resort then, I'd go back to the retrofit models that have the V-shaped clips and cut them off. Then line the can with double sided foil tape (like the kind for heating ducts) to hold the lights in place.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ElectricCPR on December 24, 2018, 11:59:20 AM
As a last resort then, I'd go back to the retrofit models that have the V-shaped clips and cut them off. Then line the can with double sided foil tape (like the kind for heating ducts) to hold the lights in place.
Please don't do that. There is no reason why the "V" clips wont work
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: good sam on December 24, 2018, 12:14:34 PM
As a last resort then, I'd go back to the retrofit models that have the V-shaped clips and cut them off. Then line the can with double sided foil tape (like the kind for heating ducts) to hold the lights in place.
As a last resort, wouldn't it just be easier to replace the cans?
Please don't do that. There is no reason why the "V" clips wont work
How do I get them to slide past the lip?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ElectricCPR on December 24, 2018, 12:21:08 PM
As a last resort, wouldn't it just be easier to replace the cans? How do I get them to slide past the lip?
What lip? I don't see any! Squeeze the "V" clips so it grabs the 2 brackets (1 on each side) and slide it up
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: good sam on December 24, 2018, 12:49:38 PM
What lip? I don't see any! Squeeze the "V" clips so it grabs the 2 brackets (1 on each side) and slide it up
The lip is even with the metal plate held up by the bracket. When I remove the plate and the bracket, the clips don't slide all the way up leaving the fixture protruding 1/4 inch from the ceiling.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: yos9694 on December 24, 2018, 02:08:46 PM
Please don't do that.

Why not
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: yos9694 on December 24, 2018, 02:10:09 PM
As a last resort, wouldn't it just be easier to replace the cans?

Doesn't that seem a lot harder?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: David R on December 29, 2018, 08:58:22 PM
Where is it?
Your model is H27RICAT from HALO which is specifically designed for shallow ceilings, so it does not leave you a lot of extra room. Nevertheless, there are LED retrofit models that are specifically documented to be compatible with this model can.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: good sam on December 29, 2018, 09:17:46 PM
Your model is H27RICAT from HALO which is specifically designed for shallow ceilings, so it does not leave you a lot of extra room. Nevertheless, there are LED retrofit models that are specifically documented to be compatible with this model can.
Thanks! Why would the electrician have used those??
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: good sam on December 29, 2018, 11:54:03 PM
Your model is H27RICAT from HALO which is specifically designed for shallow ceilings, so it does not leave you a lot of extra room. Nevertheless, there are LED retrofit models that are specifically documented to be compatible with this model can.
Can you link to compatible retrofits?


ETA this looks like it might work https://www.amazon.com/dp/B075LVPF9T/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_apa_i_-efkCbFXD72MH
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: David R on January 03, 2019, 12:36:16 AM
Can you link to compatible retrofits?


ETA this looks like it might work https://www.amazon.com/dp/B075LVPF9T/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_apa_i_-efkCbFXD72MH
Here is the info about your cans: http://www.cooperindustries.com/content/public/en/lighting/products/recessed_general_purpose_downlighting/incandescent/_6_inch_housings/_269338.html

Look for you model towards the bottom of page 2 of this:
http://www.cooperindustries.com/content/dam/public/lighting/products/documents/halo/spec_sheets/halo-lt56-td518042en-sss.pdf


Thanks! Why would the electrician have used those??
if inside your ceiling there is insufficient height for the regular size  can.

Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: good sam on January 03, 2019, 07:13:18 AM
Here is the info about your cans: http://www.cooperindustries.com/content/public/en/lighting/products/recessed_general_purpose_downlighting/incandescent/_6_inch_housings/_269338.html

Look for you model towards the bottom of page 2 of this:
http://www.cooperindustries.com/content/dam/public/lighting/products/documents/halo/spec_sheets/halo-lt56-td518042en-sss.pdf

if inside your ceiling there is insufficient height for the regular size  can.
Wow thanks so much. The one I posted above actually fit.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: tzifanya54 on January 07, 2019, 08:10:29 AM
For a regular one way switch to a standard 2 bulb fixture how bad is it if itís not grounded?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: Mplace on January 07, 2019, 01:47:47 PM
For a regular one way switch to a standard 2 bulb fixture how bad is it if itís not grounded?
all old electrical light switches don't even have a neutral
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: David R on January 08, 2019, 01:12:51 AM
For a regular one way switch to a standard 2 bulb fixture how bad is it if itís not grounded?
If the switch is not grounded and you touch the metal screw attaching the plate to the switch, or if it has a metal plate if you touch anywhere on the plate, you are at risk of a shock if a hot wire inside the switch has managed to make contact with what should have been grounded.

If your light fixture is on the ceiling, there are very few scenarios that you would be touching it. That would primarily happen when changing a bulb. If a hot wire has made contact with metal that has an electrical connection to the exposed part of the fixture, you can get a shock. To avoid the risk of a shock, turn off the circuit breaker before touching the light fixture.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: myi on January 08, 2019, 01:18:03 AM
If the switch is not grounded and you touch the metal screw attaching the plate to the switch, or if it has a metal plate if you touch anywhere on the plate, you are at risk of a shock if a hot wire inside the switch has managed to make contact with what should have been grounded.

If your light fixture is on the ceiling, there are very few scenarios that you would be touching it. That would primarily happen when changing a bulb. If a hot wire has made contact with metal that has an electrical connection to the exposed part of the fixture, you can get a shock. To avoid the risk of a shock, turn off the circuit breaker before touching the light fixture.
If I may ask, how is the hot wire roaming loose? If im not mistaken most put a wire cap on the hot wires and electric tape if needed.
 Not the safest thing to have hot wires running loose in the ceiling.
 Either the braker would blow or God forbid cause an electrical fire if you have exposed wires in your ceiling.   
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: David R on January 08, 2019, 01:28:11 AM
If I may ask, how is the hot wire roaming loose? If im not mistaken most put a wire cap on the hot wires and electric tape if needed.
 Not the safest thing to have hot wires running loose in the ceiling.
 Either the braker would blow or God forbid cause an electrical fire if you have exposed wires in your ceiling.   

Here are some examples of how the hot wire is roaming loose:
a mouse has nibbled at the insulation
a cockroach has nibbled at the insulation
some other creature has nibbled at the insulation
the person who installed it accidentally nicked some insulation and either didn't notice or pretended it didn't happen
old age combined with heat has caused the insulation to fray

Subsequently, a change in temperature causes a slight movement of the metal wire, causing it to make contact with some other metal.

If you want to talk about what's the safest thing, it's not the safest thing to forget about grounding either, yet somehow that happened.

If it was properly grounded and then the hot wire made contact with any part that's grounded, that would blow the circuit breaker saving you from getting a shock. But with no grounding, you don't have that protection.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: myi on January 08, 2019, 02:09:48 AM
Here are some examples of how the hot wire is roaming loose:
a mouse has nibbled at the insulation
a cockroach has nibbled at the insulation
some other creature has nibbled at the insulation
the person who installed it accidentally nicked some insulation and either didn't notice or pretended it didn't happen
old age combined with heat has caused the insulation to fray

Subsequently, a change in temperature causes a slight movement of the metal wire, causing it to make contact with some other metal.

If you want to talk about what's the safest thing, it's not the safest thing to forget about grounding either, yet somehow that happened.

If it was properly grounded and then the hot wire made contact with any part that's grounded, that would blow the circuit breaker saving you from getting a shock. But with no grounding, you don't have that protection.
Well explained. Thanks.
Gotch ya.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: tzifanya54 on January 08, 2019, 07:33:17 AM
Here are some examples of how the hot wire is roaming loose:
a mouse has nibbled at the insulation
a cockroach has nibbled at the insulation
some other creature has nibbled at the insulation
the person who installed it accidentally nicked some insulation and either didn't notice or pretended it didn't happen
old age combined with heat has caused the insulation to fray

Subsequently, a change in temperature causes a slight movement of the metal wire, causing it to make contact with some other metal.

If you want to talk about what's the safest thing, it's not the safest thing to forget about grounding either, yet somehow that happened.

If it was properly grounded and then the hot wire made contact with any part that's grounded, that would blow the circuit breaker saving you from getting a shock. But with no grounding, you don't have that protection.
Ok thanks for explaining. Itís an old switch in an old house, if there is now ground wiring in switch box, is there a simple way to ground?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: myi on January 09, 2019, 07:29:58 PM
Ok thanks for explaining. It’s an old switch in an old house, if there is now ground wiring in switch box, is there a simple way to ground?
The Bx would have a green ground, if it does take a screw on the fixture and screw the the ground to it, and if not, not sure how to produce  a ground. Not sure if it's possible.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: tzifanya54 on January 09, 2019, 11:13:51 PM
The Bx would have a green ground, if it does take a screw on the fixture and screw the the ground to it, and if not, not sure how to produce  a ground. Not sure if it's possible.
Some of the wiring is original wiring from the 50ís. Donít think they were so into grounding things back then...
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ElectricCPR on January 09, 2019, 11:30:47 PM
The Bx would have a green ground, if it does take a screw on the fixture and screw the the ground to it, and if not, not sure how to produce  a ground. Not sure if it's possible.
I think you're a little confused. If there is a green wire (meaning it's MC cable) and the box is metal, it needs to be connected to the box as well as the fixture. If there is no green wire (meaning it's BX cable) and the armor is acting as the ground, you would have to attach the fixture ground to the box.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: myi on January 09, 2019, 11:37:30 PM
I think you're a little confused. If there is a green wire (meaning it's MC cable) and the box is metal, it needs to be connected to the box as well as the fixture. If there is no green wire (meaning it's BX cable) and the armor is acting as the ground, you would have to attach the fixture ground to the box.
Correct, the MC I would ground to the box and the AC (or bx) I would have the thin wire or the bx acting like armor like you said act as a ground.
 
 Green to box and fixture ground to box as well/tighten around a screw if you like.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: David R on January 09, 2019, 11:51:15 PM
To attach a ground wire to a metal box:
If it is a relatively recently manufactured box, one or more of the holes in the back of the box is threaded for the purpose of screwing in a ground screw. Wrap the end of the bare wire or the stripped end of the green wire around the screw and tighten.
If the box is old, it may not have a threaded hole for grounding. In that case, use a ground clip, which holds the ground wire tightly against a side of the box.

Either way, I am not referring to the thin bare metal wire that runs through armored cable.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: myi on January 10, 2019, 02:05:35 AM

Either way, I am not referring to the thin bare metal wire that runs through armored cable.
As that's made to wrap around the bx and stick in a bushing to avoid the wires from being pulled back into the bx and having the wires nicked on the metal shards of the bx.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: good sam on January 13, 2019, 10:36:29 PM
So now I replaced my old cans with led retrofits. Is there any reason in the world to save the old cans or should they go straight to the trash?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: yesitsme on January 13, 2019, 10:44:59 PM
So now I replaced my old cans with led retrofits. Is there any reason in the world to save the old cans or should they go straight to the trash?
I Would keep it (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compulsive_hoarding)
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: good sam on January 13, 2019, 10:46:41 PM
I Would keep it (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compulsive_hoarding)
I guess your opinion is to throw it out...
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: David R on January 14, 2019, 11:48:03 PM
So now I replaced my old cans with led retrofits. Is there any reason in the world to save the old cans or should they go straight to the trash?
The white pieces in the photo are trims, not cans. As for the metal pieces, I'm surprised you removed them. Would the retrofits not have fit if you left those metal pieces in?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: good sam on January 14, 2019, 11:58:34 PM
The white pieces in the photo are trims, not cans. As for the metal pieces, I'm surprised you removed them. Would the retrofits not have fit if you left those metal pieces in?
Correct, would not have fit.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: stooges44 on April 08, 2019, 10:32:14 PM
 So my gardener removed some bushes today and in the process also cut out an outlet that was next to them connected to the fence, I don't really care  about the outlet because I don't recall ever using it I'm just nervous now that there is a buried live wire somewhere in my yard.

Should I be concerned?  Anything I can do aside from digging around and looking for it? (Something i'd rather not have to do)

Thanks
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: David R on April 08, 2019, 11:43:59 PM
So my gardener removed some bushes today and in the process also cut out an outlet that was next to them connected to the fence, I don't really care  about the outlet because I don't recall ever using it I'm just nervous now that there is a buried live wire somewhere in my yard.

Should I be concerned?  Anything I can do aside from digging around and looking for it? (Something i'd rather not have to do)

Thanks
Yes, be concerned. If you think you know where the wire leads to, turn it off or disconnect it at the next junction box.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: myi on April 09, 2019, 01:10:21 AM
Yes, be concerned. If you think you know where the wire leads to, turn it off or disconnect it at the next junction box.
If the gardener cut some live wires with an electric saw I'm sure there would have been some sparks or something, my hunch is its a dead outlet.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: stooges44 on April 09, 2019, 06:09:35 AM
Yes, be concerned. If you think you know where the wire leads to, turn it off or disconnect it at the next junction box.

But what if I don't know where the wires came from?

If the gardener cut some live wires with an electric saw I'm sure there would have been some sparks or something, my hunch is its a dead outlet.

Good point but how would I know for sure? Maybe he just pulled really hard and it ripped
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: stooges44 on April 09, 2019, 10:01:38 AM
Yes, be concerned. If you think you know where the wire leads to, turn it off or disconnect it at the next junction box.

So I see this at the back of the house and I'm assuming the wires go from there and under the concrete to the the fence on the opposite side

(https://i.gyazo.com/ff08aceac3d92780e38fdbb4c7d46a35.png)

How do I tell which breaker in the house is for this so I can turn it off?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: jes on April 09, 2019, 10:37:09 AM
So I see this at the back of the house and I'm assuming the wires go from there and under the concrete to the the fence on the opposite side

(https://i.gyazo.com/ff08aceac3d92780e38fdbb4c7d46a35.png)

How do I tell which breaker in the house is for this so I can turn it off?
Use a wire tester and a partner and flip the breakers one by one.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: David R on April 09, 2019, 01:48:07 PM
Use a wire tester and a partner and flip the breakers one by one.
The cover visible in the photo should be covering fully insulated wires, where you wouldn't be able to use a neon tester or multimeter to contact the wires without damaging them. Instead, use the test device that makes sound but doesn't require electrical contact.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: stooges44 on April 09, 2019, 02:24:16 PM
The cover visible in the photo should be covering fully insulated wires, where you wouldn't be able to use a neon tester or multimeter to contact the wires without damaging them. Instead, use the test device that makes sound but doesn't require electrical contact.

There is a light switch also that was for in-ground lights that are also gone, those wires are much easier to get to, would it make sense that both the lights and the outlet are on the same breaker?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: myi on April 09, 2019, 04:23:51 PM
There is a light switch also that was for in-ground lights that are also gone, those wires are much easier to get to, would it make sense that both the lights and the outlet are on the same breaker?
Where's the electric coming from? Another outlet on the opposite end?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: Yehudaa on April 14, 2019, 12:35:01 PM
I have a Kitchenaid 6000HD mixer and it was making really bad sounding noises when turned on. I opened it and found this fan-looking thing on the back of the motor (mounted on the back end of the shaft). It was cracked and half was flying around inside the housing, making noise. Took it off and it sounds fine.

My question is: Is there any risk in using the mixer (indefinitely) without it? I couldn't figure out what it does- it looks like a fan but the blades are really small, and there's also no vent on the housing anywhere for this fan to get air out or in. Any risk in just using the mixer without it? Anyone know what this price does?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: Yehudaa on April 14, 2019, 12:43:44 PM
I have a Kitchenaid 6000HD mixer and it was making really bad sounding noises when turned on. I opened it and found this fan-looking thing on the back of the motor (mounted on the back end of the shaft). It was cracked and half was flying around inside the housing, making noise. Took it off and it sounds fine.

My question is: Is there any risk in using the mixer (indefinitely) without it? I couldn't figure out what it does- it looks like a fan but the blades are really small, and there's also no vent on the housing anywhere for this fan to get air out or in. Any risk in just using the mixer without it? Anyone know what this price does?
Just found the part online. They just call it a fan. It's this part. Anyone know if I actually need it?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: dovy2 on April 14, 2019, 08:08:27 PM
Just found the part online. They just call it a fan. It's this part. Anyone know if I actually need it?
It's probably to prevent overheating
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: Yehudaa on April 14, 2019, 08:11:17 PM
It's probably to prevent overheating
Can a fan prevent overheating if there's no vent to let air in or out?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ckmk47 on April 15, 2019, 03:09:13 AM
Just found the part online. They just call it a fan. It's this part(https://emoji.tapatalk-cdn.com/emoji116.png). Anyone know if I actually need it?
How expensive is it to purchase?  It might save your machine down the line.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: stooges44 on April 18, 2019, 10:36:40 AM
Trying my luck over here.

See here: https://forums.dansdeals.com/index.php?topic=77726.msg2084353#msg2084353

Thanks!
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: DealKiller on April 28, 2019, 09:09:05 AM
Can a fan prevent overheating if there's no vent to let air in or out?
It is not a sealed unit. It helps with overheating.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: Yehudaa on April 28, 2019, 09:51:48 AM
How expensive is it to purchase?  It might save your machine down the line.
Idk yet. The only one I found was in Australia and is 20 AUD. I think I'll contact the manufacturer here.
It is not a sealed unit. It helps with overheating.
Thanks.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: thaber on April 28, 2019, 11:05:30 AM
Idk yet. The only one I found was in Australia and is 20 AUD. I think I'll contact the manufacturer here.Thanks.
Try calling the manufacturer directly. They'll often ship parts like that free of charge
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ushdadude on August 15, 2019, 11:43:56 AM
any suggestions for a monitor to place on my panel to see what's pulling the most power? My bill was crazy high. I'm assuming it was the AC but I want to make sure there isn't some hidden energy drain
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ElectricCPR on August 16, 2019, 08:47:50 AM
any suggestions for a monitor to place on my panel to see what's pulling the most power? My bill was crazy high. I'm assuming it was the AC but I want to make sure there isn't some hidden energy drain
Change your panel to a Leviton Wifi panel 🤣 it'll only be between $1000 - $1500🤣
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ushdadude on August 18, 2019, 09:56:35 AM
Change your panel to a Leviton Wifi panel 🤣 it'll only be between $1000 - $1500🤣


Lol meant something like sense
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ElectricCPR on August 18, 2019, 10:51:52 AM

Lol meant something like sense
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07LGR57VS/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_awdb_t1_UqwwDbKM9WPQJ

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B001Q1G4WK/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_awdb_t1_frwwDbG53BQ24

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00GMZRXE8/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_awdb_t1_NpwwDbGQFPDN3
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: stooges44 on September 10, 2019, 02:44:49 PM
I'm trying to trace the wires from my thermostat. They go somewhere near the boiler obviously but there are dozens of wire in and around  the boiler.

Any suggestions? google led me to a tone generator and amazon has tons of them, which one should I get considering I'm a newbie but very much a diyer so I would need something that actually has helpful instructions.

TIA!
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: CountValentine on September 10, 2019, 02:51:56 PM
Are the wires from the thermostat contained in one cable?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: stooges44 on September 10, 2019, 02:53:40 PM
Are the wires from the thermostat contained in one cable?

Nope  :(
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: CountValentine on September 10, 2019, 03:00:37 PM
Nope  :(
This must be old?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: CountValentine on September 10, 2019, 03:01:50 PM
Never worked on a boiler system before. If you post pictures of the connections at the thermostat and boiler we might be able to figure it out.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: churnbabychurn on September 10, 2019, 03:02:21 PM
I've changed a bunch of light fixtures over the years and never had this.

The light switch was definitely off, but I still felt a current when touching the wires. Why and how is this?

Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: CountValentine on September 10, 2019, 03:04:51 PM
I've changed a bunch of light fixtures over the years and never had this.

The light switch was definitely off, but I still felt a current when touching the wires. Why and how is this?
Need more info. Which wires are you touching? Did you separate any wires that were together?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: stooges44 on September 10, 2019, 03:05:34 PM
Never worked on a boiler system before. If you post pictures of the connections at the thermostat and boiler we might be able to figure it out.

Ok you asked....  ;D

Thermostat: (the 3 middle wires come from one cable, the other 2 do not)
(https://i.gyazo.com/8138b2776e3a7eb2148bd06b74be3a7a.png)


Zone controller which is then connected to the boiler:
(https://i.gyazo.com/8c0cb65523796bcb2243bef7fa48da8b.png)
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: churnbabychurn on September 10, 2019, 03:07:30 PM
Need more info. Which wires are you touching? Did you separate any wires that were together?
There's only 3 wires black white and neutral. Didn't separate any. Could be I touched more than one at once but not sure.. just a simple home fixture

I just thought that if it's off it should all be dead..
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: CountValentine on September 10, 2019, 03:09:05 PM
Ok you asked....  ;D
Can you locate the 3 wire cable going to the zone controller?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: CountValentine on September 10, 2019, 03:11:41 PM
There's only 3 wires black white and neutral. Didn't separate any. Could be I touched more than one at once but not sure.. just a simple home fixture

I just thought that if it's off it should all be dead..
Normally yes but I am thinking a bad neutral.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: stooges44 on September 10, 2019, 03:13:53 PM
Can you locate the 3 wire cable going to the zone controller?

If I could I wouldn't be looking for a tone generator  ;)
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: CountValentine on September 10, 2019, 03:15:46 PM
If I could I wouldn't be looking for a tone generator  ;)
You have one cable with three wires. You can't see where that goes? Do you see those three color wires connected anywhere on the zone controller?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: CountValentine on September 10, 2019, 03:16:56 PM
Look at the diameter of the wires also. You can see they are different. Will help in locating them.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: stooges44 on September 10, 2019, 03:23:46 PM
Look at the diameter of the wires also. You can see they are different. Will help in locating them.

Now we've come to the point of the project, the 3 middles ones I'm told are for an AC yet this stat only controls my heat, the AC is an entirely separate system with its own stat. So, my goal is to see if those 3 wires do in fact go nowhere and if one of them can function as the infamous C wire that most newer stats require
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: CountValentine on September 10, 2019, 03:28:45 PM
Now we've come to the point of the project, the 3 middles ones I'm told are for an AC yet this stat only controls my heat, the AC is an entirely separate system with its own stat. So, my goal is to see if those 3 wires do in fact go nowhere and if one of them can function as the infamous C wire that most newer stats require
Google the thermostat to see the wire hookup. It will should which is for AC/Heat.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: CountValentine on September 10, 2019, 03:29:39 PM
You installing a new thermostat?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: stooges44 on September 10, 2019, 03:34:49 PM
You installing a new thermostat?

 I tried to here (https://forums.dansdeals.com/index.php?topic=77726.msg2084353#msg2084353) but in the end I gave up. Now I'm attempting again and on this second round I thought ....if those 3 wires do in fact go nowhere and if one of them can function as the infamous C wire...
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: CountValentine on September 10, 2019, 04:12:14 PM
What three letters do the three wires go to?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: stooges44 on September 10, 2019, 04:13:31 PM
What three letters do the three wires go to?

Rc, Y, G
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: CountValentine on September 10, 2019, 04:20:05 PM
Rc, Y, G
So those control your AC?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: stooges44 on September 10, 2019, 04:21:44 PM
So those control your AC?


Now we've come to the point of the project, the 3 middles ones I'm told are for an AC yet this stat only controls my heat, the AC is an entirely separate system with its own stat. So, my goal is to see if those 3 wires do in fact go nowhere and if one of them can function as the infamous C wire that most newer stats require
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: CountValentine on September 10, 2019, 04:23:15 PM

So can we assume they are no longer used?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: stooges44 on September 18, 2019, 03:08:09 PM
Is it better to add more outlets or just use a bunch of extension cords and power strips? In other words, since another outlet will be running off the same breaker isn't a bunch of connected power strips the same except in aesthetics?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: CountValentine on September 19, 2019, 01:06:25 AM
In other words, since another outlet will be running off the same breaker isn't a bunch of connected power strips the same except in aesthetics?
Simply put H*LL NO!!!
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ExGingi on January 15, 2020, 08:33:46 AM
Yesterday I replaced a 3 way switch with a 3 way dimmer that is LED compatible. I currently have 3 LED light bulbs (in basic receptacles in 3 places on my kitchen ceiling) controlled by it.

When I try dimming the lights, the 3 bulbs dim in different levels, to the extent that when I have it all the way down one bulb is totally dark, the next one a dim light, and the 3rd one a drop brighter.

Does this mean there's a problem with the wiring? I am planning on installing flat LED panels. Will I have a similar issue? If yes, is there a workaround?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: yos9694 on January 15, 2020, 08:54:31 AM
Do the three bulbs combined meet the minimum load requirement for the dimmer?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ExGingi on January 15, 2020, 09:01:53 AM
Do the three bulbs combined meet the minimum load requirement for the dimmer?

I believe they do. There's no flicker, and the dimmer is designed to work with LEDS. I will double check later.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: CountValentine on January 15, 2020, 10:55:18 AM
Did you replace both 3 way switches with dimmer switches?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ExGingi on January 15, 2020, 12:20:41 PM
Did you replace both 3 way switches with dimmer switches?

No. That would require a Multi-Point dimmer rather than a 3-way dimmer. 3-way dimmers are designed to work with one dimmer and one switch (though it seems like when it's turned off from the other end of the room with the switch, lights can't be turned on with the dimmer).
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: myi on January 15, 2020, 01:11:24 PM
No. That would require a Multi-Point dimmer rather than a 3-way dimmer. 3-way dimmers are designed to work with one dimmer and one switch (though it seems like when it's turned off from the other end of the room with the switch, lights can't be turned on with the dimmer).
Are you sure everything is wired correctly ?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: CountValentine on January 15, 2020, 01:43:25 PM
I am going to guess you will have to try different LED's.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: yos9694 on January 15, 2020, 01:45:54 PM
No. That would require a Multi-Point dimmer rather than a 3-way dimmer. 3-way dimmers are designed to work with one dimmer and one switch (though it seems like when it's turned off from the other end of the room with the switch, lights can't be turned on with the dimmer).

As myi said, check the wiring. That symptom likely means that the ordinary switch is not wired correctly. Either the traveler wires are reversed or you need to attach a jumper cable to connect the two (solution depends on the design of your 3-way switch, check the instructions)
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: CountValentine on January 15, 2020, 01:51:18 PM
As myi said, check the wiring. That symptom likely means that the ordinary switch is not wired correctly. Either the traveler wires are reversed or you need to attach a jumper cable to connect the two (solution depends on the design of your 3-way switch, check the instructions)
I am going to guess these lights are in parallel. However wired should effect all the lights the same. 
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ExGingi on January 15, 2020, 02:42:57 PM
As myi said, check the wiring. That symptom likely means that the ordinary switch is not wired correctly. Either the traveler wires are reversed or you need to attach a jumper cable to connect the two (solution depends on the design of your 3-way switch, check the instructions)

How in the world do I check this? There have been two three way switches there for the past 20 years or so. Should I try reversing the traveler wires on the dimmer?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: CountValentine on January 15, 2020, 02:58:47 PM
How in the world do I check this? There have been two three way switches there for the past 20 years or so. Should I try reversing the traveler wires on the dimmer?
Which option is yours?  :)
https://www.easy-do-it-yourself-home-improvements.com/3-way-switch-wiring-diagram.html
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: yos9694 on January 15, 2020, 03:35:13 PM
How in the world do I check this? There have been two three way switches there for the past 20 years or so. Should I try reversing the traveler wires on the dimmer?

You can try reversing them on the dimmer switch (logical that it's that switch that is the problem because you just installed it) and if that doesn't work you can try reversing the travelers on the other 3 way switch. But what I said was check the instructions for the new dimmer switch to see if it requires the other 3-way switch to have its traveler wires connected by a jumper.

ETA: To clarify, many new 3-way switches are designed to be the only 3-way switch in the circuit. So if you previously had a 3-way switch in 2 places, when you replace one of them with a new 3-way switch you also have to change the wiring at the other spot too. The instructions usually say this clearly but DIYers miss it because they don't expect to have to touch the other switch that they're not replacing. One hint that your new 3 way switch is like this is if the box included a short jumper cable (a little red wire usually with u-shaped terminals at both ends).
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: yos9694 on January 15, 2020, 03:48:03 PM
I am going to guess these lights are in parallel. However wired should effect all the lights the same.

Yeah the comment about wiring has nothing to do with the lights dimming differently, it was in relation to the part of the quote i bolded.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: CountValentine on January 15, 2020, 03:50:12 PM
Yeah the comment about wiring has nothing to do with the lights dimming differently, it was in relation to the part of the quote i bolded.
Got it.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ExGingi on January 15, 2020, 05:03:52 PM
Which option is yours?  :)
https://www.easy-do-it-yourself-home-improvements.com/3-way-switch-wiring-diagram.html

How in the world do I go about figuring that one out? Do I need to rip out all the sheetrock for this? I never realized there are so many options for 3 way switch wiring.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: CountValentine on January 15, 2020, 05:07:40 PM
How in the world do I go about figuring that one out? Do I need to rip out all the sheetrock for this? I never realized there are so many options for 3 way switch wiring.
I have no idea and I didn't know there was that many either. Can you take pictures of the switch? Also which switch do you have?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ExGingi on January 15, 2020, 05:12:26 PM
While on the topic of wiring. I want to replace my upstairs thermostat with a WiFi supported model. Current thermostat has no C wire attached, but there are several unattached wires going up to the packaged unit on the roof (in addition to the G, R, W & Y wires). The thing is that the control board of the packaged unit doesn't have all the terminals neatly positioned next to each other, but rather spaced out over the board, and there's nothing marked C. There is a terminal marked B (GND) after the G R W & Y terminals, but that doesn't sound like it.

There are blue wires running in several places, including a few connected to a terminal on a relay switch. I don't currently have a Voltmeter to check if that runs 24V or higher, so I held off on connecting a wire from there to the thermostat.

Anyone have any insight on this, or do I just have to wait until I pick up a voltmeter to find where the 24V current is running to connect the C wire to?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: yos9694 on January 15, 2020, 07:03:40 PM
How in the world do I go about figuring that one out? Do I need to rip out all the sheetrock for this? I never realized there are so many options for 3 way switch wiring.

Dont bother. Just use trial and error and you'll get the wires right. Even if you dont have a multi meter amd cant identify the line from the neutral there are still only 6 possible ways to make the connections at the switch
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ExGingi on January 15, 2020, 08:35:07 PM
Dont bother. Just use trial and error and you'll get the wires right. Even if you dont have a multi meter amd cant identify the line from the neutral there are still only 6 possible ways to make the connections at the switch

My only fear is running 110V rather than 24V.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: aygart on January 15, 2020, 08:41:30 PM
You should be able to find something specific to the unit online such as youtube. I found by searching {unit name/model} c wire
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: CountValentine on January 15, 2020, 09:11:33 PM
My only fear is running 110V rather than 24V.
Where is the 24V coming from? There should be no 24V there unless I am missing something.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ExGingi on January 15, 2020, 09:15:41 PM
Where is the 24V coming from? There should be no 24V there unless I am missing something.

https://smartthermostatguide.com/thermostat-c-wire-explained/

ETA: I think I found my answer in one of the comments there:

Quote
Yellow/Y is the AC compressor.
White/W is the Heating element
Green/G runs the fan.
Blue or Black/C should be a ground and will be used by both Rh and Rc, and apparently your thermostat.

But if that is the case, why is there such a fuss about a C wire? Couldn't one just connect to any ground?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: CountValentine on January 15, 2020, 09:21:04 PM
I must be from another planet because even in this thread things are getting mixed up.  :)
Lets see if we can see where we went wrong.
How in the world do I go about figuring that one out? Do I need to rip out all the sheetrock for this? I never realized there are so many options for 3 way switch wiring.
Dont bother. Just use trial and error and you'll get the wires right. Even if you dont have a multi meter amd cant identify the line from the neutral there are still only 6 possible ways to make the connections at the switch
My only fear is running 110V rather than 24V.
Where is the 24V coming from? There should be no 24V there unless I am missing something.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ExGingi on January 15, 2020, 09:28:33 PM
I must be from another planet because even in this thread things are getting mixed up.  :)
Lets see if we can see where we went wrong.

You missed my other (unrelated) question.

https://forums.dansdeals.com/index.php?topic=42079.msg2185328#msg2185328
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: CountValentine on January 15, 2020, 09:37:02 PM
You missed my other (unrelated) question.

https://forums.dansdeals.com/index.php?topic=42079.msg2185328#msg2185328
You quoted the switch question and responded with: My only fear is running 110V rather than 24V.
Either way we are good and just blame me as usual.  ;)
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: CountValentine on January 15, 2020, 09:38:39 PM
Did you get anywhere with your switch? Have model for switch? I have free time watching the Hawks.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: CountValentine on January 15, 2020, 09:58:16 PM
But if that is the case, why is there such a fuss about a C wire? Couldn't one just connect to any ground?
Doesn't C wire supply constant power?
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ExGingi on January 16, 2020, 01:32:13 AM
You quoted the switch question and responded with: My only fear is running 110V rather than 24V.
Either way we are good and just blame me as usual.  ;)

You are right. I missed that. I confused myself by asking two questions concurrently. My bad.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ExGingi on January 16, 2020, 01:32:58 AM
Doesn't C wire supply constant power?

That is what I always thought. But some online reading seems to indicate otherwise.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: CountValentine on January 16, 2020, 10:00:30 AM
Where did this quote come from?

Quote
Yellow/Y is the AC compressor.
White/W is the Heating element
Green/G runs the fan.
Blue or Black/C should be a ground and will be used by both Rh and Rc, and apparently your thermostat.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ExGingi on January 16, 2020, 10:26:22 AM
Where did this quote come from?

Comments at:

https://smartthermostatguide.com/thermostat-c-wire-explained/

From what I gather Rc is 24VAC for cooling, RH is 24VAC for heating. Circuit can bet closed with either of Y, W, or G, for AC compressor, heating, or fan (respectively) the C wire allows for a closed circuit and powering the Thermostat even when none of those are running.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: CountValentine on January 16, 2020, 10:58:13 AM
Comments at:

From what I gather Rc is 24VAC for cooling, RH is 24VAC for heating. Circuit can bet closed with either of Y, W, or G, for AC compressor, heating, or fan (respectively) the C wire allows for a closed circuit and powering the Thermostat even when none of those are running.
This gets confusing. There is no ground in this circuit. So to your earlier question you just can't use a ground.
The transformer used to supply the 24V is an isolation transformer (pretty much the standard now). It is used to isolate it from the 110V circuit.
This diagram lays it all out. If you want to get into it I can explain it.  :)
https://i.stack.imgur.com/QeZbQ.png
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: CountValentine on January 20, 2020, 10:01:38 PM
Any update on your two issues? @ExGingi
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: ExGingi on January 20, 2020, 10:03:15 PM
Any update on your two issues? @ExGingi
Not yet. Didn't have time for the projects yet.
Title: Re: I need Electric Help... Any electricians out there?
Post by: CountValentine on January 20, 2020, 10:15:32 PM
Not yet. Didn't have time for the projects yet.
Don't make me come out there.  :)