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DansDeals Forum => General Discussion => Topic started by: dovy2 on September 28, 2014, 08:46:49 AM

Title: Cheap bamboo mats from home depot
Post by: dovy2 on September 28, 2014, 08:46:49 AM
September 24, 2014
 
The cRc chicago has researched some of the bamboo mats sold at Home Depot for their validity in using them for schach on your Succah. The current information as to which schach at Home Depot we recommend, is now on our website at:
http://www.crcweb.org/Schach%20Mat%20Fencing%20(Sep%202014).pdf

Let the discussion begin!
Title: Re: Cheap bamboo mats from home depot
Post by: Achas Veachas on September 28, 2014, 10:15:00 AM
Curious, why do the reeds have to be perpendicular to the support beams?
Title: Re: Cheap bamboo mats from home depot
Post by: lubaby on September 28, 2014, 10:30:29 AM
Curious, why do the reeds have to be perpendicular to the support beams?
I'm no rabbi, but we do it that way for extra support. Otherwise it might sag and fall through.
That's also why you need the small piece of wood on top, to help hold it down.
Title: Re: Cheap bamboo mats from home depot
Post by: churnbabychurn on September 28, 2014, 10:42:31 AM
Curious, why do the reeds have to be perpendicular to the support beams?
they want the support beams to be maamid the sechach, not the wire woven into the fence.
Title: Re: Cheap bamboo mats from home depot
Post by: churnbabychurn on September 28, 2014, 11:52:01 AM
I am looking for a photo of a wooden Venetian blind from around 1950-1960.

It is my understanding that until a few years ago, these blinds generally contained a woven strip of material. (instead of the stings, to hold the slats.)
If you can find such a pic online, or a link to something that would help it would be much appreciated. (A pic of your bubbies blinds would work!)


I need this to disprove someone's incorrect understanding of a teshuva of R Moshe RE using a wooden Venetian blind for sechach.

TIA!
Title: Re: Cheap bamboo mats from home depot
Post by: Achas Veachas on September 28, 2014, 11:55:41 AM
Like this?

(http://www.customwholesaleblinds.com/product_images/cloth-tapes-large.jpg)
Title: Re: Cheap bamboo mats from home depot
Post by: churnbabychurn on September 28, 2014, 11:58:01 AM
Like this?

(http://www.customwholesaleblinds.com/product_images/cloth-tapes-large.jpg)
exactly!
How can I show that those were the blinds that were prevalent when he wrote the teshuva?
Title: Re: Cheap bamboo mats from home depot
Post by: aygart on September 28, 2014, 11:59:05 AM
exactly!
How can I show that those were the blinds that were prevalent when he wrote the teshuva?
how do you know they were?
Title: Re: Cheap bamboo mats from home depot
Post by: Achas Veachas on September 28, 2014, 12:03:01 PM
exactly!
How can I show that those were the blinds that were prevalent when he wrote the teshuva?
Dunno I just Googled "vintage venetian blinds" and this seemed to match your description...
Title: Re: Cheap bamboo mats from home depot
Post by: churnbabychurn on September 28, 2014, 12:03:53 PM
how do you know they were?
1) It is clearly what the teshuva  means. (But someone needs a visual to grasp that...)
2)My in-laws parents had a blind business and he told me he remembers that woven material was the standard.

I'm just looking for very conclusive evidence that string holding the slats was uncommon.
Title: Re: Cheap bamboo mats from home depot
Post by: churnbabychurn on September 28, 2014, 12:05:13 PM
Dunno I just Googled "vintage venetian blinds" and this seemed to match your description...
vintage is the key. Thanx
Title: Re: Cheap bamboo mats from home depot
Post by: coralsnake on September 28, 2014, 10:47:39 PM
September 24, 2014
 
The cRc chicago has researched some of the bamboo mats sold at Home Depot for their validity in using them for schach on your Succah. The current information as to which schach at Home Depot we recommend, is now on our website at:
http://www.crcweb.org/Schach%20Mat%20Fencing%20(Sep%202014).pdf

Let the discussion begin!
Amazing!

Wish I needed schach this year.
Title: Re: Cheap bamboo mats from home depot
Post by: churnbabychurn on September 28, 2014, 10:53:45 PM
Amazing!

Wish I needed schach this year.
relax. Do you really want sechach that is only kosher if placed a certain way?
Title: Re: Cheap bamboo mats from home depot
Post by: dovy2 on September 28, 2014, 10:56:09 PM
relax. Do you really want sechach that is only kosher if placed a certain way?
why pay triple the price for hecsher
Title: Re: Cheap bamboo mats from home depot
Post by: churnbabychurn on September 28, 2014, 11:23:45 PM
why pay triple the price for hecsher
Why you answering a question with a question? :P



But the answer is that the kosher ones are constructed without depending on a mekabel tuma to hold them together.
 Therefore, one does not have to rely on a "chap" that if placed horizontal or something, the wire becomes a redundant maamid.
Title: Re: Cheap bamboo mats from home depot
Post by: coralsnake on September 28, 2014, 11:25:38 PM
relax. Do you really want sechach that is only kosher if placed a certain way?
All schach is only kosher if placed a certain way.
Title: Re: Cheap bamboo mats from home depot
Post by: churnbabychurn on September 28, 2014, 11:28:06 PM
All schach is only kosher if placed a certain way.
Not at all. As long as you don't ADD a posul component you can put it on however you want.
Title: Re: Cheap bamboo mats from home depot
Post by: Barryg on September 28, 2014, 11:40:29 PM
they want the support beams to be maamid the sechach, not the wire woven into the fence.

+1
Very important to know.
Also, if nothing heavy is on top/or it is on top but not placed at ends of sukkah - and a strong wind comes it will blow schach off of sukkah. If this were to happen on average of once a week (it would in OH) then it's considered a Ruach Metzuya.
Title: Re: Cheap bamboo mats from home depot
Post by: churnbabychurn on September 28, 2014, 11:45:08 PM
+1
Very important to know.
Also, if nothing heavy is on top/or it is on top but not placed at ends of sukkah - and a strong wind comes it will blow schach off of sukkah. If this were to happen on average of once a week (it would in OH) then it's considered a Ruach Metzuya.
Whats the source for the once per week shiur for metzuya?
Title: Re: Cheap bamboo mats from home depot
Post by: thaber on September 29, 2014, 12:48:50 AM
All schach is only kosher if placed a certain way.
Let me jump in here to explain lakewood vs. the rest of america. In Lakewood no one would dream of using a mat from home depot, because kaynus is readily available and not too expensive, and there is a lot of social pressure to be as mehudar as possible. Everywhere else, (Chicago, Cleveland, Kalamazoo, Los Angeles etc.) Kaynus et al is harder to get and much more expensive. You'd be paying literally 10 times the price sometimes, for a hechsher, when it's not really necessary. and even the mats with a hechsher have some issues, and there are people who won't use them.
Also in Lakewood the average Jew probably spends 3 or 4 times as much on Arba Minim as anyone anywhere else. יש דורשים לשבח....

Title: Re: Cheap bamboo mats from home depot
Post by: aygart on September 29, 2014, 07:53:02 AM
Let me jump in here to explain lakewood vs. the rest of america. In Lakewood no one would dream of using a mat from home depot, because kaynus is readily available and not too expensive, and there is a lot of social pressure to be as mehudar as possible. Everywhere else, (Chicago, Cleveland, Kalamazoo, Los Angeles etc.) Kaynus et al is harder to get and much more expensive. You'd be paying literally 10 times the price sometimes, for a hechsher, when it's not really necessary. and even the mats with a hechsher have some issues, and there are people who won't use them.
Also in Lakewood the average Jew probably spends 3 or 4 times as much on Arba Minim as anyone anywhere else. יש דורשים לשבח....
You need to check your data set unless you are comparing to those who choose an esrog because it is nice and yellow
Title: Re: Cheap bamboo mats from home depot
Post by: thaber on September 29, 2014, 09:32:47 AM
You need to check your data set unless you are comparing to those who choose an esrog because it is nice and yellow
Based on personal experience and averages. Comparing kollel guy/alumni to kollel guy/alumni .
Title: Re: Cheap bamboo mats from home depot
Post by: churnbabychurn on September 29, 2014, 09:52:52 AM
Based on personal experience and averages. Comparing kollel guy/alumni to kollel guy/alumni .
+1
Kollel guys definitely spend much more on 4 minim. You cant even compare.
Find me a non Kollel guy who would spend $50+ just for haddasim..
Title: Re: Cheap bamboo mats from home depot
Post by: thaber on September 29, 2014, 10:01:40 AM
+1
Kollel guys definitely spend much more on 4 minim. You cant even compare.
Find me a non Kollel guy who would spend $50+ just for haddasim..
Right.  Now,  keep in mind that the most expensive hadasim available outside of NY are $25.
An esrog in Lakewood can go for as much as $300 you can't find one in Chicago for more than $65
Title: Re: Cheap bamboo mats from home depot
Post by: lunatic on September 30, 2014, 10:00:14 PM


Right.  Now,  keep in mind that the most expensive hadasim available outside of NY are $25.
An esrog in Lakewood can go for as much as $300 you can't find one in Chicago for more than $65

-1.you can spend plenty in Chicago
Title: Re: Cheap bamboo mats from home depot
Post by: Ergel on September 30, 2014, 11:14:04 PM
Right.  Now,  keep in mind that the most expensive hadasim available outside of NY are $25.
An esrog in Lakewood can go for as much as $300 you can't find one in Chicago for more than $65
-2
In YYZ you can find $40 hadasim
And I am willing to bet a lot of money that you can find more expensive lulavim in Chicago
Title: Re: Cheap bamboo mats from home depot
Post by: thaber on September 30, 2014, 11:20:24 PM
-2
In YYZ you can find $40 hadasim
And I am willing to bet a lot of money that you can find more expensive lulavim in Chicago
I stand corrected.  I was referencing where I've been,  and assumed it was the same for other out of town communities.
However I think my point stands.  Definitely regarding the schach,  and the Lulav I bought here for $45 sells for $90 in NY,  where it was shipped from. Same Lulav from the same Box. (source is the mocher).  The California esrogim go for $250+ in Lakewood,  in California he can't sell anything for more than $75.

There is much more demand there. The majority of the mochrim here won't sell deri,  teimani esrogim,  and other niche products. 
Title: Re: Cheap bamboo mats from home depot
Post by: Ergel on September 30, 2014, 11:40:11 PM
Pricing I think you are way off. Niche products there is definitely more demand in the NYC/Lakewood area
Title: Re: Cheap bamboo mats from home depot
Post by: thaber on September 30, 2014, 11:47:01 PM
Pricing I think you are way off. Niche products there is definitely more demand in the NYC/Lakewood area
I can only testify to my experiences and what the people who sell the stuff tell me. I bought arba minim in lakewood for 5 years. I've been buying them out of town for 5 years. All my numbers are based on conversations with mochrim, and the lulav and hadasim that I bought on Sunday night.
But I definitely may be misinformed.
Title: Re: Cheap bamboo mats from home depot
Post by: Ergel on September 30, 2014, 11:50:48 PM
I can tell you for a fact that in YYZ i saw with my own eyes esrogim bought for $200+ and a few esrogim put aside with asking prices of nearly $500 !!!
Title: Re: Cheap bamboo mats from home depot
Post by: thaber on September 30, 2014, 11:54:15 PM
I can tell you for a fact that in YYZ i saw with my own eyes esrogim bought for $200+ and a few esrogim put aside with asking prices of nearly $500 !!!
Must be a different breed of hungarians there :)
Title: Re: Cheap bamboo mats from home depot
Post by: thaber on October 03, 2014, 11:22:32 AM
Must be a different breed of hungarians there :)
Have a confession to make. Apparently they have $180 esrogim here too. He only brought in five of them, and AFAIK other mochrim don't have them, but I stand corrected.
Title: Re: Cheap bamboo mats from home depot
Post by: ganizzy on October 03, 2014, 12:45:30 PM
In California i have seen esrogim sold for way over 100. But usually yanover or Israel
Title: Re: Cheap bamboo mats from home depot
Post by: thaber on October 03, 2014, 01:12:44 PM
In California i have seen esrogim sold for way over 100. But usually yanover or Israel
This was teimini
Title: Re: Cheap bamboo mats from home depot
Post by: churnbabychurn on October 07, 2014, 07:26:53 PM
BTW according to the sefer by a talmid of r shlomo miller, he feels that using fencing is not appropriate.
Title: Re: Cheap bamboo mats from home depot
Post by: MoYS on October 07, 2014, 10:19:59 PM
I am looking for a photo of a wooden Venetian blind from around 1950-1960.

It is my understanding that until a few years ago, these blinds generally contained a woven strip of material. (instead of the stings, to hold the slats.)
If you can find such a pic online, or a link to something that would help it would be much appreciated. (A pic of your bubbies blinds would work!)


I need this to disprove someone's incorrect understanding of a teshuva of R Moshe RE using a wooden Venetian blind for sechach.

TIA!
I think you should read this (http://www.star-k.org/cons-seasonal-schach.htm) article by the star-k, it discusses R Moshe's psak about the venetian blinds.
Also it discusses the placement of the schach, why they must be placed perpindicular etc.
Title: Re: Cheap bamboo mats from home depot
Post by: Alexsei on September 27, 2016, 09:53:05 AM
September 24, 2014
 
The cRc chicago has researched some of the bamboo mats sold at Home Depot for their validity in using them for schach on your Succah. The current information as to which schach at Home Depot we recommend, is now on our website at:
http://www.crcweb.org/Schach%20Mat%20Fencing%20(Sep%202014).pdf

Let the discussion begin!

Link doesn't work, any updated info?

Can this be used
http://www.ebay.com/itm/5x8-60-x96-Brown-Bamboo-Floor-Mat-Area-Rug-Tatami-Oriental-Chinese-Japanese-/252353699702?hash=item3ac173df76:m:m9a4XORTwoZ32Vbxj8vZRKg
Title: Re: Cheap bamboo mats from home depot
Post by: username on September 27, 2016, 10:01:09 AM
Link doesn't work, any updated info?

use the first link in this WIKI
Best Sukkah? (http://forums.dansdeals.com/index.php?topic=9477.msg114090#msg114090)
Title: Re: Cheap bamboo mats from home depot
Post by: davidmal on September 28, 2016, 12:16:36 AM
Link doesn't work, any updated info?

Can this be used
http://www.ebay.com/itm/5x8-60-x96-Brown-Bamboo-Floor-Mat-Area-Rug-Tatami-Oriental-Chinese-Japanese-/252353699702?hash=item3ac173df76:m:m9a4XORTwoZ32Vbxj8vZRKg
If it has the word rug it's pasul - and you can't use it
Title: Re: Cheap bamboo mats from home depot
Post by: chbochur on September 28, 2016, 02:11:05 AM
Link doesn't work, any updated info?

Can this be used
http://www.ebay.com/itm/5x8-60-x96-Brown-Bamboo-Floor-Mat-Area-Rug-Tatami-Oriental-Chinese-Japanese-/252353699702?hash=item3ac173df76:m:m9a4XORTwoZ32Vbxj8vZRKg
Cannot be used cause as you see the sides that hold it together (maimid) are made of material that is possul for schach
Title: Re: Cheap bamboo mats from home depot
Post by: chbochur on September 28, 2016, 02:16:02 AM
September 24, 2014
 
The cRc chicago has researched some of the bamboo mats sold at Home Depot for their validity in using them for schach on your Succah. The current information as to which schach at Home Depot we recommend, is now on our website at:
http://www.crcweb.org/Schach%20Mat%20Fencing%20(Sep%202014).pdf

Let the discussion begin!
I use this mat as schach I would say you'd need a few layers or evergreen on top cause it's very thin, also (in my opinion based of the shulchan aruch Harav) I'd say you (at least lichatchilah)  need to put 2x4s on top to hold it down so the metal string is not what's holding the bamboo together
Title: Re: Cheap bamboo mats from home depot
Post by: davidmal on September 28, 2016, 09:52:37 PM
I use this mat as schach I would say you'd need a few layers or evergreen on top cause it's very thin, also (in my opinion based of the shulchan aruch Harav) I'd say you (at least lichatchilah)  need to put 2x4s on top to hold it down so the metal string is not what's holding the bamboo together
If it says floor it's not kasher

It needs to be made NOT for sleeping on or stepping on

Has to have been made for shade
Title: Re: Cheap bamboo mats from home depot
Post by: chbochur on September 28, 2016, 09:54:56 PM
If it says floor it's not kasher

It needs to be made NOT for sleeping on or stepping on

Has to have been made for shade
The shulchan aruch Harav might have a different opinion, he writes if people buy it for both it goes by what he's buying it for
Title: Re: Cheap bamboo mats from home depot
Post by: davidmal on September 29, 2016, 11:37:31 AM
The shulchan aruch Harav might have a different opinion, he writes if people buy it for both it goes by what he's buying it for
everything goes after the majority.....
the way they sell it usually is the way its used
Title: Re: Cheap bamboo mats from home depot
Post by: MarkS on October 12, 2016, 10:32:42 PM
New link updated for 2016

http://www.crcweb.org/Schach.pdf
Title: Re: Cheap bamboo mats from home depot
Post by: noturbizniss on August 13, 2018, 08:25:38 AM
Anyone with experience with these mats care to share which of the 3 options from last year are best or have an opinion?
http://www.crcweb.org/Schach2017.pdf
Title: Re: Cheap bamboo mats from home depot
Post by: thaber on September 05, 2018, 01:07:29 AM
Anyone with experience with these mats care to share which of the 3 options from last year are best or have an opinion?
http://www.crcweb.org/Schach2017.pdf
September 4, 2018

 

In previous years, the cRc has recommended certain readily available fencing material (commonly sold in Home Depot) to be used for schach  and provided detailed instructions on how to place them on the sukkah.   However, based on feedback from consumers on the sturdiness of those materials and how they were being used, we have determined that there is a reasonable chance that some people will end up not having kosher schach (since the fencing material could become invalidated if a few of the reeds break) unless they place multiple layers of fencing on top of their sukkah.


Accordingly, we are no longer issuing specific recommendations of fencing material. Instead we suggest that if you choose to use these fencing mats that you add additional schach (e.g. added layers of these mats, bamboo poles, evergreen or other tree branches) to ensure the fulfillment of the halachic requirement of "more shade than sunlight."  Also, any fencing mats should be placed perpendicular to the schach support beams in order to avoid ma’amid issues, as we have explained in previous years.   

 
Title: Re: Cheap bamboo mats from home depot
Post by: Dan on September 05, 2018, 01:58:56 AM
These worked well.
I doubled them up to get more shade and stability.
http://go.redirectingat.com/?id=53840X1297210&xs=1&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.homedepot.com%2Fp%2FBackyard-X-Scapes-6-ft-x-16-ft-Reed-Fencing-4-Pack-HDD-BIN-RF01-4%2F100664722
Title: Re: Cheap bamboo mats from home depot
Post by: ShmuliT on October 12, 2019, 08:25:29 PM
These worked well.
I doubled them up to get more shade and stability.
http://go.redirectingat.com/?id=53840X1297210&xs=1&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.homedepot.com%2Fp%2FBackyard-X-Scapes-6-ft-x-16-ft-Reed-Fencing-4-Pack-HDD-BIN-RF01-4%2F100664722
I have 2 of these mats available for sale. Pick up in Kew Gardens.
1 new 1 used.
$35 for both.
I used 1 mat last year but I prefer the look of the more expensive sukkah depot mats.
Lots of sun light did shine through, but I guess Dan's suggestion of doubling them up would solve that.
Title: Re: Cheap bamboo mats from home depot
Post by: Sammy82 on October 12, 2019, 10:56:09 PM
Giving away 8 of these mats (although a small donation to my shul would be nice). Located in 5towns. Must be picked up tomorrow or going into Mondays garbage pickup. Used one year. PM me
Title: Re: Cheap bamboo mats from home depot
Post by: thaber on September 02, 2020, 05:51:00 PM
Anyone have an inexpensive option that works? I need to cover 500 square feet (and expecting 80's- 90's sunny weather)
Title: Re: Cheap bamboo mats from home depot
Post by: moko on September 02, 2020, 07:05:34 PM
https://www.dansdeals.com/miscellaneous/crc-updates-guidelines-schach-home-depot/
Title: Re: Cheap bamboo mats from home depot
Post by: thaber on September 02, 2020, 07:18:14 PM
https://www.dansdeals.com/miscellaneous/crc-updates-guidelines-schach-home-depot/
yes, all discussed upthread (and I posted the CRC aricle here before @Dan did there :))
But asking if there's any new eitzas out there