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DansDeals Forum => General Discussion => Topic started by: bukin86 on April 07, 2015, 02:13:44 PM

Title: Money Market Fund, Annuities, Etc
Post by: bukin86 on April 07, 2015, 02:13:44 PM
Anyone have any background in safe more short term investments?
Title: Re: Money Market Fund, Annuities, Etc
Post by: incendia on April 07, 2015, 07:15:30 PM
Annuities aren't short term investments

you could try CDs or 13 week US treasury notes
Title: Re: Money Market Fund, Annuities, Etc
Post by: DMYD on April 07, 2015, 08:03:51 PM
Anyone have any background in safe more short term investments?
Explain more what your trying to accomplish maybe someone can help.
Title: Re: Money Market Fund, Annuities, Etc
Post by: bukin86 on April 08, 2015, 09:18:13 AM
I have 10-15k that I want to do more with than earn 0.005% in the bank.
Title: Re: Money Market Fund, Annuities, Etc
Post by: sky121 on April 08, 2015, 09:19:21 AM
I have 10-15k that I want to do more with than earn 0.005% in the bank.

At the very least it should be in a better savings account or CD.
Title: Re: Money Market Fund, Annuities, Etc
Post by: rileywiles23 on April 08, 2015, 09:21:50 AM

I have 10-15k that I want to do more with than earn 0.005% in the bank.
if you can't afford to lose the $ then put it in a online savings account, such as ge capital, discover, or ally bank.
Title: Re: Money Market Fund, Annuities, Etc
Post by: bukin86 on April 08, 2015, 09:26:13 AM
The T-notes seem risk free, am I missing something? Why not that at the very least?
Title: Re: Money Market Fund, Annuities, Etc
Post by: DMYD on April 08, 2015, 10:41:27 AM
I have 10-15k that I want to do more with than earn 0.005% in the bank.
How long are you ready to leave the money without touching it?
Title: Re: Money Market Fund, Annuities, Etc
Post by: Emkay on April 08, 2015, 10:43:34 AM
I have 10-15k that I want to do more with than earn 0.005% in the bank.
There is a thread discussing ask this stuff already.
What do you call short term? How much you looking to make? (Don't say as much as possible)
Title: Re: Money Market Fund, Annuities, Etc
Post by: dpk4588 on April 08, 2015, 10:45:38 AM
I have 10-15k that I want to do more with than earn 0.005% in the bank.
Barclays Online Savings (https://www.banking.barclaysus.com/online-savings.html) accounts have 1% APY.
Title: Re: Money Market Fund, Annuities, Etc
Post by: upside down on April 08, 2015, 10:47:26 AM
The T-notes seem risk free, am I missing something? Why not that at the very least?
online savings accounts offer better rates then short term (1 year) us t-notes
Title: Re: Money Market Fund, Annuities, Etc
Post by: sky121 on April 08, 2015, 11:00:56 AM
Synchrony has a 1 year CD at 1.23-1.25% depending on the offer you can find.
Title: Re: Money Market Fund, Annuities, Etc
Post by: bukin86 on April 08, 2015, 09:11:29 PM
Searching function on this forum is annoying at best

looking into the barclays and synchrony - thanks!

Looking to make more than the 0.05% in the bank as I mentioned - not being greedy
Title: Re: Money Market Fund, Annuities, Etc
Post by: DMYD on April 08, 2015, 10:40:17 PM
Searching function on this forum is annoying at best

looking into the barclays and synchrony - thanks!

Looking to make more than the 0.05% in the bank as I mentioned - not being greedy
What's your short term? 1-3 3-5?
Title: Re: Money Market Fund, Annuities, Etc
Post by: Cw3323 on April 09, 2015, 12:52:42 AM
If you are in nj Colombia  bank has a % 1.00 on checking
Title: Re: Money Market Fund, Annuities, Etc
Post by: Mountain Man on April 09, 2015, 03:48:38 PM
I have 10-15k that I want to do more with than earn 0.005% in the bank.
You can put into an amex or tiaa direct savings. Both offer 70 bp or better.
Title: Re: Money Market Fund, Annuities, Etc
Post by: bukin86 on April 12, 2015, 09:08:26 PM
I wouldn't mind 5 years...

Barclays has 2.25% for 60 months - looks very attractive
Title: Re: Money Market Fund, Annuities, Etc
Post by: skyguy918 on April 13, 2015, 01:01:30 AM
Annuities aren't short term investments

you could try CDs or 13 week US treasury notes
-1, there plenty of annuities with terms similar to CDs (FDAs). Not that I'd suggest one in this situation, but your statement was incorrect.
Title: Re: Money Market Fund, Annuities, Etc
Post by: bukin86 on April 16, 2015, 08:13:14 AM
Does anyone here have an account with Barclays online?
Title: Re: Money Market Fund, Annuities, Etc
Post by: ADG on April 21, 2015, 03:29:28 PM
Is that the best you can do with 15k ? whats the next step higher on the risk factor but below putting it all on red? (anything in the 8-10% yield range)
Title: Re: Money Market Fund, Annuities, Etc
Post by: aygart on April 21, 2015, 03:32:18 PM
Is that the best you can do with 15k ? whats the next step higher on the risk factor but below putting it all on red? (anything in the 8-10% yield range)
what time frame
Title: Re: Money Market Fund, Annuities, Etc
Post by: jack276156 on April 21, 2015, 07:45:44 PM
3 - 4  years
Title: Re: Money Market Fund, Annuities, Etc
Post by: AsherO on April 21, 2015, 07:50:14 PM
I have 10-15k that I want to do more with than earn 0.005% in the bank.

Keep in mind that 1% is $100-150, so if you're only putting your money away for six months then you'll get less than half that (since the interest rate is a compounded annualized yield).

Also, most funds/investment vehicles that have higher returns also have higher risk, and are thus more suitable for long term investment.

You might want to check out bankrate (or one of the other comparison sites) as there are banks that offer an intro rate or bonus that might get you more than $2-300 for the year.
Title: Re: Money Market Fund, Annuities, Etc
Post by: ADG on April 24, 2015, 04:50:35 PM
Would anyone recommend roth IRA account for someone who pays little taxes now. What yield range should i expect?
Title: Re: Money Market Fund, Annuities, Etc
Post by: skyguy918 on April 24, 2015, 06:39:10 PM
Would anyone recommend roth IRA account for someone who pays little taxes now. What yield range should i expect?
Yes. Depending where you open the account, you can invest in just about anything that platform allows trading in. So the yield is the yield on whatever you expect to invest in.
Title: Re: Money Market Fund, Annuities, Etc
Post by: Mountain Man on April 26, 2015, 05:23:01 PM
Is that the best you can do with 15k ? whats the next step higher on the risk factor but below putting it all on red? (anything in the 8-10% yield range)

You're not going to find anything with a firm commitment to pay that kind of return. It's not realistic in a world were negative yields for sovereign debt are considered normal.

Would anyone recommend roth IRA account for someone who pays little taxes now. What yield range should i expect?

Roth accounts can be fantastic for many people. If you're paying little to none in the way of taxes now you theoretically could put money in at a 10% tax rate and then qualify for a non-refundable savers credit of 50% of your deposit up to $2,000 and that would refund any tax you paid.

You're making a mistake focusing on yield, a very perilous mistake. I can name you plenty of funds with high yields. But when there is a grab for yield you will by necessity be buying into lower quality assets. This would greatly increase the odds of a loss of principal. There are REITs that can yield over 10% and there are numerous commodity stocks that yield over 5% (thank to recent pullbacks). All carry significant investment risks though.

If you have a very long term (10-20 years) horizon the typical number thrown out these days is to expect 6-8% return over time.

From your situation it sounds like you may need the money in a few years. Others can opine what you should invest in. I would strongly suggest that you consider putting the money into a Roth due to the aforementioned Saver's credit which can provide a "return" of as much as 50% of your contributed capital. This capital can be withdrawn tax free and any returns can be withdrawn for qualified expenses (typically education, healthcare or first time housing).

You could probably also throw some money into an HSA if you're planning to use the money anyway for healthcare expenses and that would provide a tax deduction if you move into a higher tax bracket in the coming year.
Title: Re: Money Market Fund, Annuities, Etc
Post by: ADG on April 28, 2015, 02:03:06 PM
You're not going to find anything with a firm commitment to pay that kind of return. It's not realistic in a world were negative yields for sovereign debt are considered normal.

Roth accounts can be fantastic for many people. If you're paying little to none in the way of taxes now you theoretically could put money in at a 10% tax rate and then qualify for a non-refundable savers credit of 50% of your deposit up to $2,000 and that would refund any tax you paid.

You're making a mistake focusing on yield, a very perilous mistake. I can name you plenty of funds with high yields. But when there is a grab for yield you will by necessity be buying into lower quality assets. This would greatly increase the odds of a loss of principal. There are REITs that can yield over 10% and there are numerous commodity stocks that yield over 5% (thank to recent pullbacks). All carry significant investment risks though.

If you have a very long term (10-20 years) horizon the typical number thrown out these days is to expect 6-8% return over time.

From your situation it sounds like you may need the money in a few years. Others can opine what you should invest in. I would strongly suggest that you consider putting the money into a Roth due to the aforementioned Saver's credit which can provide a "return" of as much as 50% of your contributed capital. This capital can be withdrawn tax free and any returns can be withdrawn for qualified expenses (typically education, healthcare or first time housing).

You could probably also throw some money into an HSA if you're planning to use the money anyway for healthcare expenses and that would provide a tax deduction if you move into a higher tax bracket in the coming year.

Why is that true? Isnt it just the same on any risk vs. reward scale

any recommendation as to what to invest in through a roth acount?
 
Title: Re: Money Market Fund, Annuities, Etc
Post by: Mountain Man on April 28, 2015, 02:08:06 PM
Why is that true? Isnt it just the same on any risk vs. reward scale

any recommendation as to what to invest in through a roth acount?
Exactly risk/reward. You said you didn't want to put it all on red.

I can't opine on particular investments. If your time horizon is long enough find a good low cost index fund.
Title: Re: Money Market Fund, Annuities, Etc
Post by: ADG on April 28, 2015, 02:24:51 PM
yes not everything on red. But i also find it pointless to lock up "little " amount even on "great" interest rates.

I am looking to make money but not put it on red. Looking for a risky but worth the risk kind of investment.

Thanks for your advice.
Sorry for my unprofessional terminology...:) 
Title: Re: Money Market Fund, Annuities, Etc
Post by: skyguy918 on April 28, 2015, 02:38:45 PM
yes not everything on red. But i also find it pointless to lock up "little " amount even on "great" interest rates.

I am looking to make money but not put it on red. Looking for a risky but worth the risk kind of investment.

Thanks for your advice.
Sorry for my unprofessional terminology...:)
You should take a look at Future Advisor (http://www.futureadvisor.com), see what they recommend. You put in your current age and 'retirement age' (think of that one as the age you plan to be using this money), as well as your risk tolerance. Then you should be able to just manually input that you have a Roth IRA and report the full amount you plan to invest as cash. Once it's all set up they'll suggest a portfolio, using exclusively commission free ETF's at Fidelity or TD Ameritrade.
Title: Re: Money Market Fund, Annuities, Etc
Post by: ADG on April 28, 2015, 02:40:29 PM
I wouldnt do index funds... thats kind of like giving up... Its meant for ppl like me that dont know what they are doing. I may fall into the category but i wont let my money fall into it.
 
Does 15k justify hiring a firm to manage my money?
 
Title: Re: Money Market Fund, Annuities, Etc
Post by: 12HRS on April 28, 2015, 02:44:14 PM
I wouldnt do index funds... thats kind of like giving up... Its meant for ppl like me that dont know what they are doing. I may fall into the category but i wont let my money fall into it.
 
Does 15k justify hiring a firm to manage my money?

say what?
Title: Re: Money Market Fund, Annuities, Etc
Post by: ADG on April 28, 2015, 02:45:23 PM
http://www.investopedia.com/terms/i/indexfund.asp

what google says
Title: Re: Money Market Fund, Annuities, Etc
Post by: 12HRS on April 28, 2015, 02:50:52 PM
why is outperforming most funds in the market giving up?
Quote
"Indexing" is a passive form of fund management that has been successful in outperforming most actively managed mutual funds.
Title: Re: Money Market Fund, Annuities, Etc
Post by: skyguy918 on April 28, 2015, 02:57:04 PM
I wouldnt do index funds... thats kind of like giving up... Its meant for ppl like me that dont know what they are doing. I may fall into the category but i wont let my money fall into it.
 
Does 15k justify hiring a firm to manage my money?
That's an extremely ignorant comment. First of all, index funds just means they're meant to track a 'basket' of other assets. So you can have an ETF tracking international REIT's, which would obviously be big risk/big reward. Future Advisor's approach is based on a ton of research, with foundations in modern portfolio theory and other major, data-driven investment theory. When they suggest the portfolio, they also show you the expected returns in various market conditions.
Title: Re: Money Market Fund, Annuities, Etc
Post by: srf60 on April 28, 2015, 03:00:32 PM
I wouldnt do index funds... thats kind of like giving up... Its meant for ppl like me that dont know what they are doing. I may fall into the category but i wont let my money fall into it.
 
Does 15k justify hiring a firm to manage my money?
For example , you will go with  those mutual funds...
Do you know that index funds outperform mutual funds by far????
Title: Re: Money Market Fund, Annuities, Etc
Post by: ADG on April 28, 2015, 03:04:54 PM
I read other articals that are against index funds . with proof showing that the only make money on 10-20 days of the year. while loosing on all the other. so yes if you would look at the anual history it may have made money but you have to be in on all the bad days aswell ... The name of thwe aurther was rick edelman in "the lies about money" . He disproves mutual funds...
Title: Re: Money Market Fund, Annuities, Etc
Post by: skyguy918 on April 28, 2015, 03:07:19 PM
Just to give you an example, my portfolio (mostly Roth money with a little Coverdell too) that I have invested based on Future Advisor's recommendations is sitting at a >9% return YTD, which has only been 4 months. Contrast that with the best performing of the major indices this year (S&P) at ~6.8% on the year. I'm paying no commissions or fees because of the ETF's they use.

Obviously this is a small (perhaps even tiny) sample size, and my investment horizon is extremely long, but it should give you some food for thought.
Title: Re: Money Market Fund, Annuities, Etc
Post by: skyguy918 on April 28, 2015, 03:08:16 PM
I read other articals that are against index funds . with proof showing that the only make money on 10-20 days of the year. while loosing on all the other. so yes if you would look at the anual history it may have made money but you have to be in on all the bad days aswell ... The name of thwe aurther was rick edelman in "the lies about money" . He disproves mutual funds...
So you're looking to be a day trader then? That's called putting it all on red.

ETA: Lol, just googled it.
Quote
Edelman summarizes the academic research on Modern Portfolio Theory (MPT) and the value of holding a portfolio of noncorrelated asset classes in Chapter 2. Chapters 3 and 4 cover the history of the mutual fund industry and its recent scandals. Chapters 5 and 6 explain the advantages of passive investing using low-cost institutional index funds, namely Dimemsion Fund Advisors and exchange-traded funds (ETFs).
So basically he wants you to have a portfolio of ETF's that are diversified according to MPT - exactly what Future Advisor's does for you. Except that they do it for fee, while his company charges for it.
Title: Re: Money Market Fund, Annuities, Etc
Post by: ADG on April 28, 2015, 03:12:19 PM
Just to give you an example, my portfolio (mostly Roth money with a little Coverdell too) that I have invested based on Future Advisor's recommendations is sitting at a >9% return YTD, which has only been 4 months. Contrast that with the best performing of the major indices this year (S&P) at ~6.8% on the year. I'm paying no commissions or fees because of the ETF's they use.

Obviously this is a small (perhaps even tiny) sample size, and my investment horizon is extremely long, but it should give you some food for thought.

Did you set up your protfolio by your self ( meaning just with future advisor)?
Title: Re: Money Market Fund, Annuities, Etc
Post by: skyguy918 on April 28, 2015, 03:15:42 PM
Did you set up your protfolio by your self ( meaning just with future advisor)?
Yes. I opened an account with TD, set up Roth IRA's for me and my wife (and later Coverdell's for the kids), and invested the money there in the ETF's suggested by Future Advisor.

Just remember that you're not supposed to be touching this kind of portfolio frequently, only to rebalance a few times a year max. With TD's commission free ETF's, you have to actually enroll in the 'program' before you start trading (otherwise you'll get hit with a commission), and keep whatever you buy for at least 30 days (if you sell something after holding it for less than that you get hit with a short term trading fee).
Title: Re: Money Market Fund, Annuities, Etc
Post by: ADG on April 28, 2015, 03:17:09 PM
whats TD?
Title: Re: Money Market Fund, Annuities, Etc
Post by: skyguy918 on April 28, 2015, 03:20:22 PM
whats TD?
TD Ameritrade. The other option is Fidelity. Both are solid online brokerages with excellent selections of commission free ETF's.
Title: Re: Money Market Fund, Annuities, Etc
Post by: ADG on April 28, 2015, 03:23:30 PM
thanks for your advice?

Because im doing this for a first time. Is there some place where i can go to double check my portfolio
Title: Re: Money Market Fund, Annuities, Etc
Post by: skyguy918 on April 28, 2015, 03:30:58 PM
thanks for your advice?

Because im doing this for a first time. Is there some place where i can go to double check my portfolio
Not sure what you mean. Once you've set up an account at TD Ameritrade or Fidelity, deposited the money and invested it, you can obviously check on the progress of your portfolio by logging into your account. If you're talking about checking whether, in the future, Future Advisor recommends a change, the answer is yes. You can link your brokerage account to your Future Advisor account so that it checks your portfolio and recommends changes if necessary.
Title: Re: Money Market Fund, Annuities, Etc
Post by: Mountain Man on April 28, 2015, 03:35:56 PM
I read other articals that are against index funds . with proof showing that the only make money on 10-20 days of the year. while loosing on all the other. so yes if you would look at the anual history it may have made money but you have to be in on all the bad days aswell ... The name of thwe aurther was rick edelman in "the lies about money" . He disproves mutual funds...

It's clear from your writing that you are not very familiar with investing. Index funds are a great way to buy market exposure as indicated by the index. It's a great way to have a diversified portfolio at very low cost. I can cite hundreds of pages on references discussing the pros and cons of index funds. However, for your purpose and because you don't want to risk all your capital I'd suggest the index fund or if you must invest on your own then something top shelf like AAPL. Just so you know though the  reason that Vanguard is so successful is because they focus on offering low cost low maintenance funds which cause their funds to consistently outperform.

Look if you're looking to make a little extra then an index fund can do that for you primarily by lowering your expense ratio and trading costs.

If on the other hand you're looking to become the next Buffet or Druckenmiller then by all means open a paper trading account and read up on the market first. You won't be doing yourself any favors by just buying stocks, bonds, options, futures, commodities, currencies, etc. willy nilly. There's someone way smarter than you on the other side of the trade who probably knows something you don't.

I've found good place to start with a paper portfolio might be trademonster.
Title: Re: Money Market Fund, Annuities, Etc
Post by: skyguy918 on April 28, 2015, 03:38:34 PM
It's clear from your writing that you are not very familiar with investing. Index funds are a great way to buy market exposure as indicated by the index. It's a great way to have a diversified portfolio at very low cost. I can cite hundreds of pages on references discussing the pros and cons of index funds. However, for your purpose and because you don't want to risk all your capital I'd suggest the index fund or if you must invest on your own then something top shelf like AAPL. Just so you know though the  reason that Vanguard is so successful is because they focus on offering low cost low maintenance funds which cause their funds to consistently outperform.

Look if you're looking to make a little extra then an index fund can do that for you primarily by lowering your expense ratio and trading costs.

If on the other hand you're looking to become the next Buffet or Druckenmiller then by all means open a paper trading account and read up on the market first. You won't be doing yourself any favors by just buying stocks, bonds, options, futures, commodities, currencies, etc. willy nilly. There's someone way smarter than you on the other side of the trade who probably knows something you don't.

I've found good place to start with a paper portfolio might be trademonster.

With a little editing, I'd give that a +1  ;D
Title: Re: Money Market Fund, Annuities, Etc
Post by: Mountain Man on April 28, 2015, 03:40:39 PM
Does 15k justify hiring a firm to manage my money?

Using a simple Time Value of Money equation your 15k at an average market return of 8% over 40 years would be $325,868. As the saying goes Think before you Swim.
Title: Re: Money Market Fund, Annuities, Etc
Post by: Mountain Man on April 28, 2015, 03:42:48 PM
With a little editing, I'd give that a +1  ;D
I'm just helping him understand that if he wants to go down a certain road there are still right ways and wrong ways. I'm not against investing. I do it myself and I enjoy it. But it's a passion and I know that in order for me to beat the market I need to take on added risk primarily leverage. I also have multiple index funds which are very well and consistently funded.
Title: Re: Money Market Fund, Annuities, Etc
Post by: ADG on April 28, 2015, 04:02:33 PM
I'm just helping him understand that if he wants to go down a certain road there are still right ways and wrong ways. I'm not against investing. I do it myself and I enjoy it. But it's a passion and I know that in order for me to beat the market I need to take on added risk primarily leverage. I also have multiple index funds which are very well and consistently funded.

I appreciate the advice...




Using a simple Time Value of Money equation your 15k at an average market return of 8% over 40 years would be $325,868. As the saying goes Think before you Swim.

Ill take that option!!! how do i do that?
Title: Re: Money Market Fund, Annuities, Etc
Post by: Mountain Man on April 28, 2015, 04:10:28 PM
The TVM option is really just buying an index fund and getting market returns which over time have been 8%. It's not a guarantee by any means but it's probably your best bet at long term sustainable returns. Follow skyguy918's advice and just open an account, follow the advice given by the broker, buy either multiple index funds or a fund of funds. Just do your best to pick funds that have at least 3 morningstar or lipper stars and stick to funds with expense ratios well under 50 bps. You could also buy etfs like SPY or IWM.

I'm sure you'll find once your invested that you'll read more and develop a stronger financial knowledge base and by being careful with your money now it'll still be there when you're ready for it.
Title: Re: Money Market Fund, Annuities, Etc
Post by: ADG on April 28, 2015, 04:17:42 PM
Thanks
Title: Re: Money Market Fund, Annuities, Etc
Post by: dpk4588 on April 28, 2015, 05:46:42 PM
Does anyone here have an account with Barclays online?
I do, that's why I suggested it. They also have a "Dream Account" which gets 1.05% but has a deposit limit of $1k per month, but you can put your money in the regular online savings and have it automatically transfer the $1k monthly. And there are bonuses for depositing the max and not withdrawing for 6 months.

See more here (https://www.banking.barclaysus.com/dream-account.html).
Title: Re: Money Market Fund, Annuities, Etc
Post by: Got a clue on June 17, 2015, 05:22:40 PM
Can anyone here recommend a good paper trading website?