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DansDeals Forum => Up In The Air => Topic started by: yitzboy on January 24, 2018, 04:22:06 PM

Title: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: yitzboy on January 24, 2018, 04:22:06 PM
Yesterday evening I boarded a plane from Florida to Newark that was set to leave at the scheduled departure time. Everyone boarded the plane, but six people were stuck in the center aisle without a seat. The stewardesses were confounded and double checked that they didn't over-book. Finally, they discovered someone had seated their one year old in an unauthorized seat and were able to free one seat. The plane was loaded with families and children. The pilot then made an announcement that anyone who didn't purchase a seat for their children under two, must put their children on their lap. Nothing happened. Now the crew had to go down the plane row by row until they discovered the remaining five offenders. Sadly, all the perpetrators of this tremendous  chillul Hashem were all frum families. The plane took off 40 minutes late as a result. People, please put an end to this madness and realize that we must always strive to act in the highest moral possible, even if it means we will be inconvenienced.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: sky121 on January 24, 2018, 04:23:28 PM
Oy. Stories like this make me cringe.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: ExGingi on January 24, 2018, 04:25:48 PM
I can't fathom what might have been going through those people's minds.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: Yaalili on January 24, 2018, 04:28:02 PM
Oy. Stories like this make me cringe.

True. Though did this really delay the flight 37 minutes? It seems the inbound aircraft landed 26 minutes late from BUF.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: Dan on January 24, 2018, 04:41:07 PM
I can't fathom what might have been going through those people's minds.
1. I can get the seat for free.
2. Let someone else hold their kid for 3 hours until they come and force me.

But I've long been an advocate for: https://www.dansdeals.com/more/dans-commentary/advice/todays-aeroflot-flight-incident-shows-why-we-buy-a-seat-for-our-kids/
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: yitzboy on January 24, 2018, 04:42:44 PM
@Yaalili

Here is the email from Southwest:

Hello from Southwest Airlines:
 
This is a flight status change regarding your trip.

The estimated departure time for Flight 5389 on January 23 from FLL has changed to 8:05PM. We encourage you to check Flight Status at www.southwest.com/status or the SWA Mobile App.
 
Thank you for flying Southwest Airlines.

The plane was supposed to take off at 7:35 and left at 8:10 instead.  You are probably talking about a different flight.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: ExGingi on January 24, 2018, 04:43:17 PM
1. I can get the seat for free.
2. Let someone else hold their kid for 3 hours until they come and force me.

But I've long been an advocate for: https://www.dansdeals.com/more/dans-commentary/advice/todays-aeroflot-flight-incident-shows-why-we-buy-a-seat-for-our-kids/
But in this case it was obvious that there weren't enough seats available (based on story as described). So #2 makes no sense, but then again, many times people make no sense.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: Yaalili on January 24, 2018, 04:45:43 PM
The plane was supposed to take off at 7:35 and left at 8:10 instead.  You are probably talking about a different flight.

I am not talking about a different flight. The plane left 37 minutes late, as the inbound flight #9011 was 26 minutes late in landing from Buffalo.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: Dan on January 24, 2018, 04:47:25 PM
But in this case it was obvious that there weren't enough seats available (based on story as described). So #2 makes no sense, but then again, many times people make no sense.
Maybe they were embarrassed to raise their hands at that point?
Or maybe they still hoped their would be enough for their kid if the crew asked others?
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: henche on January 24, 2018, 05:02:29 PM


But I've long been an advocate for: https://www.dansdeals.com/more/dans-commentary/advice/todays-aeroflot-flight-incident-shows-why-we-buy-a-seat-for-our-kids/

Except when https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2017/07/06/mom-has-carry-boy-flight-after-united-takes-his-seat-and-resells/454585001/

(And I've heard similar stories anecdotally)
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: Dan on January 24, 2018, 05:04:57 PM
Except when https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2017/07/06/mom-has-carry-boy-flight-after-united-takes-his-seat-and-resells/454585001/

That wasn't an infant, that was a 2 year old. Either way, the mother should have asked for a manager or gate agent. Never happened to me in over 100 flights with kids.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: ADG on January 24, 2018, 05:43:26 PM
new account to post the story... whats up with that?
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: TimT on January 24, 2018, 05:46:05 PM
new account to post the story...
-1
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: shlonx on January 24, 2018, 07:25:21 PM
new account to post the story... whats up with that?

He opened it in September 2014...
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: farmbochur on January 24, 2018, 07:27:40 PM


over 100 flights with kids.
Hang on, have Rafi/Talia really been on 100+ flights?
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: smart man on January 24, 2018, 08:10:28 PM
That wasn't an infant, that was a 2 year old. Either way, the mother should have asked for a manager or gate agent. Never happened to me in over 100 flights with kids.
How many of them were in economy class?
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: Iz on January 24, 2018, 08:41:58 PM
How many of them were in economy class?
smart man ;)
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on January 24, 2018, 09:32:14 PM
If I was on the flight I would have pointed out the guilty parties right away.  :)
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: TimT on January 24, 2018, 09:40:03 PM
People, please put an end to this madness
You're telling this to DDF’ers who generally purchase lie-flats even for an unborn.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: Dan on January 24, 2018, 10:47:01 PM
Hang on, have Rafi/Talia really been on 100+ flights?
http://forums.dansdeals.com/index.php?topic=17753
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: ckmk47 on January 25, 2018, 12:15:29 AM
I have a problem with the original details.
If my boarding pass says my seat is 23B, then I go there and say, "Excuse me, you're in my seat."  Or I the flight attendant can do it for me.
Why the confusion on which seats were being used without the right to do so?
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: mmgfarb on January 25, 2018, 12:16:48 AM
I have a problem with the original details.
If my boarding pass says my seat is 23B, then I go there and say, "Excuse me, you're in my seat."  Or I the flight attendant can do it for me.
Why the confusion on which seats were being used without the right to do so?
It was a WN flight....
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: A3 on January 25, 2018, 12:21:33 AM
On  Southwest do the tickets say lap child or just infant?
Kids fly free, maybe in a seat...
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: 12HRS on January 25, 2018, 12:28:25 AM
On  Southwest do the tickets say lap child or just infant?
Kids fly free, maybe in a seat...

lap child does not get a seat
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: a good yeshiva bachur on January 25, 2018, 12:54:23 AM
If I was on the flight I would have pointed out the guilty parties right away.  :)
Hater!
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: Yehuda57 on January 25, 2018, 08:38:43 AM
A couple of times I've been approached at the gate before boarding starts for WN flights and been told it's full and my child will need to be on a lap (of course, they're extremely apologetic when I say the kid has a seat). This is obviously a common issue.

Before you say it, no, it has nothing to do with me looking obviously Jewish. These have been Midwest airports without many Chassidim flying.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on January 25, 2018, 09:03:16 AM
Hater!
I use Israel security type of profiling.  :)
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: henche on January 25, 2018, 09:12:10 AM
A couple of times I've been approached at the gate before boarding starts for WN flights and been told it's full and my child will need to be on a lap (of course, they're extremely apologetic when I say the kid has a seat). This is obviously a common issue.

Before you say it, no, it has nothing to do with me looking obviously Jewish. These have been Midwest airports without many Chassidim flying.

I've been rudely approached and told I can't bring on my car seat and then when I explain that the baby has a ticket, they get ruder and make up a million stories about how there's still a problem
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: mmgfarb on January 25, 2018, 09:26:22 AM
I use Israel security type of profiling.  :)
Having never been there yourself, how would you know what that's like?
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: Myccrabbi on January 25, 2018, 10:07:00 AM
I have a problem with the original details.
If my boarding pass says my seat is 23B, then I go there and say, "Excuse me, you're in my seat."  Or I the flight attendant can do it for me.
Why the confusion on which seats were being used without the right to do so?
Good question.

It was a WN flight....
Which means there is no assigned seating and therefore it's a first come first serve.

And there i would think...



1. I can get the seat for free.
2. Let someone else hold their kid for 3 hours until they come and force me.

Now I'm not trying to give a free pass and say they were 100% fine, what I am saying is that it can be understood and I don't see the big sin here, because if there would have been assigned seating this situation wouldn't happen so WN sort of has a part in this as well.

Okay okay I get it i should not turn this on WN they are a good airline but there is no perfect in this world.

P.s. in my WN flight recently I sat next to a 400 lb(i think, maybe KG) man, I guarantee that you had a better flight then me mister chillul hashem.

Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: yelped on January 25, 2018, 10:22:20 AM
Huh? Because there's no assigned seating doesn't mean that someone who paid for a seat has to stand, while people are putting kids in seats that they didn't pay for.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on January 25, 2018, 10:32:25 AM
Having never been there yourself, how would you know what that's like?
I actual read once in a while.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: bermo on January 25, 2018, 10:41:44 AM
I've been rudely approached and told I can't bring on my car seat and then when I explain that the baby has a ticket, they get ruder and make up a million stories about how there's still a problem
I experienced this a few times.
It's crazy how power gets to these people's heads.
They can't handle the fact that they made a mistake.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: A3 on January 25, 2018, 11:09:16 AM
lap child does not get a seat
Some tickets just say infant, not LAP child... Sit em down.
Maybe there were 10 kids in seats and only 5 needed to move... See who is going to move, maybe you'll get Lucky...

Maybe force everyone to take a middle seat first as well.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: henche on January 25, 2018, 11:14:27 AM
Some tickets just say infant, not LAP child... Sit em down.
Maybe there were 10 kids in seats and only 5 needed to move... See who is going to move, maybe you'll get Lucky...

Maybe force everyone to take a middle seat first as well.

Maybe there were 30 kids in seats and only 5 needed to move.

And maybe the gate agents told people there's 30 extra seats so it's fine to take a seat. And didn't realize there were 30 infants
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on January 25, 2018, 11:17:05 AM
Have some flights adult only.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: Dan on January 25, 2018, 11:28:59 AM
Have some flights adult only.
https://www.google.com/search?q=hooters+air&oq=hooters+air
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: Myccrabbi on January 25, 2018, 11:35:55 AM
Huh? Because there's no assigned seating doesn't mean that someone who paid for a seat has to stand, while people are putting kids in seats that they didn't pay for.
Huh? No one ended up standing.

And technically any seat that they put there kids can be empty so why not suit themselves until push comes to shove?

You never sat in the isle when you were assigned a middle praying the person wouldn't come? And then he came and then you moved over.

Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on January 25, 2018, 11:38:35 AM
You never sat in the isle when you were assigned a middle praying the person wouldn't come? And then he came and then you moved over.
No
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: Dan on January 25, 2018, 11:39:28 AM
No
+1
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: henche on January 25, 2018, 11:39:56 AM


You never sat in the isle when you were assigned a middle praying the person wouldn't come? And then he came and then you moved over.

Why would you do that? Either he comes, or he doesn't. If he comes, why you sitting in his seat and making him awkwardly ask you to move? If he not come, then you move over after they close the door.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: Myccrabbi on January 25, 2018, 11:41:15 AM
No
No to the moving over or praying?
Jkjk :)
Its Irrelevant i was just using an example to put it in perspective.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: lubaby on January 25, 2018, 11:41:29 AM
Why would you do that? Either he comes, or he doesn't. If he comes, why you sitting in his seat and making him awkwardly ask you to move? If he not come, then you move over after they close the door.
Someone else with a different middle seat might wait to board last and take the empty aisle instead of you.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on January 25, 2018, 11:46:14 AM
No to the moving over or praying?
No to moving but yes to pray he doesn't show up so I can have the seat.  :)
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: TimT on January 25, 2018, 11:46:19 AM
Someone else with a different middle seat might wait to board last and take the empty aisle instead of you.
Now showing “The War of the Aisles”
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: henche on January 25, 2018, 11:51:07 AM
On WN, I have sat in window and aisle, and then held baby in aisle seat, on assumption that nobody will take seat unless is last seat on plane.  But I held the baby.

Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: Redbull3 on January 25, 2018, 11:58:28 AM
Huh? No one ended up standing.

And technically any seat that they put there kids can be empty so why not suit themselves until push comes to shove?
Per the story, the pilot made the announcement while people stood in the aisle with nowhere to sit.. if nothing else that's when push came to shove. Not when they were approached.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: henche on January 25, 2018, 12:05:47 PM
Per the story, the pilot made the announcement while people stood in the aisle with nowhere to sit.. if nothing else that's when push came to shove. Not when they were approached.

Maybe they all knew from the gate agents that there were 30 extra seats.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: ADG on January 25, 2018, 12:06:02 PM
-1

How would you know if he doesnt have another account? Yes I know your a mod and your awesome but how would you know?
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: TimT on January 25, 2018, 12:08:36 PM
How would you know if he doesnt have another account? Yes I know your a mod and your awesome but how would you know?
I never said I’m a mod. But yes, mods know these things :)
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: Dan on January 25, 2018, 12:11:07 PM
Per the story, the pilot made the announcement while people stood in the aisle with nowhere to sit.. if nothing else that's when push came to shove. Not when they were approached.
My guess is at that point people were too embarrassed to stand up and waited to be embarrassed row by row.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: Redbull3 on January 25, 2018, 12:14:54 PM
Maybe they all knew from the gate agents that there were 30 extra seats.
Right so after they saw every seat taken, people in the aisle and heard announcements, what's the excuse?
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: aygart on January 25, 2018, 12:17:23 PM
How would you know if he doesnt have another account? Yes I know your a mod and your awesome but how would you know?
IP address for the first step.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: Dan on January 25, 2018, 12:18:01 PM
Right so after they saw every seat taken, people in the aisle and heard announcements, what's the excuse?
My guess is at that point people were too embarrassed to stand up and waited to be embarrassed row by row.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: henche on January 25, 2018, 12:18:05 PM
Right so after they saw every seat taken, people in the aisle and heard announcements, what's the excuse?

Excuse was they knew there were 30 ppl with babies, and only 5 needed to hold them
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: aygart on January 25, 2018, 12:21:43 PM
+1
When was the last time you sat in a row where there even was a middle seat?
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: Redbull3 on January 25, 2018, 12:24:09 PM
Excuse was they knew there were 30 ppl with babies, and only 5 needed to hold them
That's not a valid excuse imo.
My guess is at that point people were too embarrassed to stand up and waited to be embarrassed row by row.
Neither is this...
Light unto the nations. Let's step up people!
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: henche on January 25, 2018, 12:28:23 PM
That's not a valid excuse imo.

Yah, ok. 

Even if not valid excuse, it goes part of way toward explaining.

OTOH, I'm making up the facts.  While I'm at it, maybe all the ppl really paid for the infants to have a seat, and the airline just decided to take them away, like the link I posted earlier and like we've all heard stories.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: myi on January 25, 2018, 12:37:40 PM
So it seems It's a win-or-lose situation whether you buy a seat or you don't buy a seat, just a better chance getting a guaranteed seat when paying for it.
  What I can't understand is if you paid for a full-fare ticket for your child why is he getting bumped from his seat, the airline knows how many seats they have that was purchased ,why were they over book a flight knowing a few people are going to have to go off the fight?
   I would suggest that maybe they know about a few seats where infants / children are occupying it and can get an adult to sit there instead of the child , but then again if your booking your child has a 15 year old or 10 year old there's no way to know if it was booked for an infant.
   If an infant paid for a seat why does an adult get priority over an infant ,the airline's are not losing any money as that seat was paid in full?
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on January 25, 2018, 12:40:23 PM
Does WN overbook?
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: TimT on January 25, 2018, 12:41:49 PM
why were they over book a flight knowing a few people are going to have to go off the fight?
Careful there, Dr. Dao had the same question :)
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: Torkay on January 25, 2018, 12:42:08 PM
Does WN overbook?
Yes
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: Dan on January 25, 2018, 12:43:38 PM
Does WN overbook?
Southwest does not overbook as part of the selling process (Effective May 8, 2017). While we no longer “overbook” flights, there will be operational instances where we will be over available seating capacity resulting in an oversale. Operational instances that may create an oversale include weight restrictions and aircraft type changes.

Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: Myccrabbi on January 25, 2018, 12:43:55 PM
No to moving but yes to pray he doesn't show up so I can have the seat.  :)
Keep praying you won't get that middle seat

Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on January 25, 2018, 12:44:38 PM
Yes
The reason I ask is because I have been on many full flights and never heard them ask for volunteers.

ETA: Seen Dan's answer.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: Torkay on January 25, 2018, 12:46:36 PM
P.s. in my WN flight recently I sat next to a 400 lb(i think, maybe KG) man, I guarantee that you had a better flight then me mister chillul hashem.
I have an issue with this. Especially bc from what I know wn has to the most lenient overweight passenger policy that I know of. I have an issue with any overweight passenger that flies wn and doesn’t bother to get an extra seat
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: Dan on January 25, 2018, 12:46:57 PM
Did these people bring a carseat onboard or they just sat their 1 year olds into a seat?
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: TimT on January 25, 2018, 12:48:01 PM
Do they let a carseat on without a paid ticket ?
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on January 25, 2018, 12:48:45 PM
Keep praying you won't get that middle seat
Depends who is on the left/right of me.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: Dan on January 25, 2018, 12:49:35 PM
I have an issue with this. Especially bc from what I know wn has to the most lenient overweight passenger policy that I know of. I have an issue with any overweight passenger that flies wn and doesn’t bother to get an extra seat
They probably don't know about it.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: Dan on January 25, 2018, 12:50:08 PM
Do they let a carseat on without a paid ticket ?
If there are extra seats they do. Of course they can also put a gate check sticker on it and people can still bring it onto the plane.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: aygart on January 25, 2018, 12:50:22 PM
Depends who is on the left/right of me.

You would never sit between two women, huh?
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: myi on January 25, 2018, 12:56:40 PM
In my WN flight recently I sat next to a 400 lb(i think, maybe KG) man, I guarantee that you had a better flight then me mister chillul hashem.
I wonder if you can get any type of compensation from the airline for this reason mentioned above?
  Love to know if there is any stories with an Airline where they issued a refund ‏ for such a scenario.( or better is it a valid reason for compensation?)
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: Yammer on January 25, 2018, 01:00:39 PM
Huh? No one ended up standing.

And technically any seat that they put there kids can be empty so why not suit themselves until push comes to shove?

You never sat in the isle when you were assigned a middle praying the person wouldn't come? And then he came and then you moved over.
Why would you do that? Either he comes, or he doesn't. If he comes, why you sitting in his seat and making him awkwardly ask you to move? If he not come, then you move over after they close the door.
Had that many times. It doesn't bother me.
My guess is at that point people were too embarrassed to stand up and waited to be embarrassed row by row.
While it helps understand it's far from an excuse
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: Torkay on January 25, 2018, 01:01:20 PM
They probably don't know about it.
Someone that big the gate agents should inform him of the policy
Title: Re: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: Yehuda57 on January 25, 2018, 01:42:23 PM
Do they let a carseat on without a paid ticket ?
Yes, if there are empty seats.
Title: Re: Re: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: TimT on January 25, 2018, 01:51:22 PM
Yes, if there are empty seats.
So if there are 3 empty seats they only let 3 carseats on ? First come first served ?
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: noturbizniss on January 25, 2018, 02:51:09 PM
Were the last 20 posts just deleted?
What happend to @chaimmoskowitz 2 's post?

I do call BS on the heilige people escaping prtizus in NY (wintertime? covered skin) by going to Orlando FL?
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: Yammer on January 25, 2018, 02:53:15 PM
Were the last 20 posts just deleted?
What happend to @chaimmoskowitz 2 's post?

I do call BS on the heilige people escaping prtizus in NY (wintertime? covered skin) by going to Orlando FL?
Yup looks like it.
It may have been moved.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on January 25, 2018, 02:58:08 PM
Order has been restored.  :)
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: Dan on January 25, 2018, 02:58:46 PM
Were the last 20 posts just deleted?
What happend to @chaimmoskowitz 2 's post?

I do call BS on the heilige people escaping prtizus in NY (wintertime? covered skin) by going to Orlando FL?
Obvious trolls are obvious. Duplicate account banned.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: henche on January 25, 2018, 03:06:31 PM
Were the last 20 posts just deleted?
What happend to @chaimmoskowitz 2 's post?


#Releasethememo
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on January 25, 2018, 03:11:26 PM
#Releasethememo
#fakenews
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: as2 on January 25, 2018, 03:36:22 PM
You would never sit between two women, huh?
He'd probably need you to rate them out of 10 before answering.
They say they have a full flight on practically every flight. I've heard them say it multiple times, yet somehow still had a seat for my kid. I always "take up space" professionally with my kid on WN flights, in hopes I will not be sat next to, but if someone has no other choice, I let them in. I don't travel looking particularly Jewish either way, but that's a whole different animal.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on January 25, 2018, 03:39:08 PM
He'd probably need you to rate them out of 10 before answering.
He likes asking questions he already knows the answer to.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: mercaz1 on January 25, 2018, 04:06:30 PM
to me this seems like going to a baseball game and if the row in front of you is empty you sit there till someone comes
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: Boruch999 on January 25, 2018, 04:17:20 PM
Obvious trolls are obvious. Duplicate account banned.

Both accounts?  :)
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: @Yehuda on January 25, 2018, 04:47:14 PM
No
What if it was a WN flight and you're with a second person. Have you sat window and aisle, hoping no one will sit in middle?
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on January 25, 2018, 04:49:47 PM
to me this seems like going to a baseball game and if the row in front of you is empty you sit there till someone comes
Two wrongs don't make a right.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on January 25, 2018, 04:51:56 PM
What if it was a WN flight and you're with a second person. Have you sat window and aisle, hoping no one will sit in middle?
No, we always take aisle/middle or aisle/aisle. I get pre-board with medical condition.  :)
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: Redbull3 on January 25, 2018, 04:52:47 PM
to me this seems like going to a baseball game and if the row in front of you is empty you sit there till someone comes
A couple of differences, it's more like taking up the seat in front of you + the seat you bought at the same time. Also a game can start even if some fans don't have a seat.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on January 25, 2018, 04:55:43 PM
For all those that think it is OK to take an empty seat you didn't pay for. Does that apply to E+ and F? If not why not?
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: @Yehuda on January 25, 2018, 04:56:47 PM
No, we always take aisle/middle or aisle/aisle. I get pre-board with medical condition.  :)
I take that too, but I can't say I haven't been tempted to sit aisle window and hope no one joins us. Pregnancy and little kids helps as well. :P
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on January 25, 2018, 05:03:25 PM
I take that too, but I can't say I haven't been tempted to sit aisle window and hope no one joins us. Pregnancy and little kids helps as well. :P
There is nothing wrong with that. Half the plane is that way during boarding.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: skyguy918 on January 25, 2018, 05:19:37 PM
...I always "take up space" professionally with my kid on WN flights, in hopes I will not be sat next to, but if someone has no other choice, I let them in...
Reminds me of the MTA express buses.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: ShlockDoc on January 25, 2018, 05:38:16 PM
It helps to be an oversized passenger on WN.  Nobody wants to sit next to the fat guy.  Add a little strategic coughing and I almost always have a seat empty next to me, even in the emergency exit row. 
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: yuneeq on January 25, 2018, 05:57:37 PM
No excuses for not giving up child seat when boarding is finished and people are still standing.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: henche on January 25, 2018, 06:11:50 PM
No excuses for not giving up child seat when boarding is finished and people are still standing.

If you'd been reading before the FBI texts were deleted, you'd see the real story.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on January 25, 2018, 06:19:35 PM
If you'd been reading before the FBI texts were deleted, you'd see the real story.
LOL
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: Yammer on January 25, 2018, 06:23:49 PM
If you'd been reading before the FBI texts were deleted, you'd see the real story.
LOL
+
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: ckmk47 on January 25, 2018, 08:13:46 PM
Obvious trolls are obvious. Duplicate account banned.
But his fake news was compelling. And very plausible. He should be a writer.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: Yehuda57 on January 25, 2018, 08:15:15 PM
Can we get a recap?
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: 159dallas on January 26, 2018, 12:40:50 AM
Southwest does not overbook as part of the selling process (Effective May 8, 2017). While we no longer “overbook” flights, there will be operational instances where we will be over available seating capacity resulting in an oversale. Operational instances that may create an oversale include weight restrictions and aircraft type changes.

I thought southwest all flies the same type of plane....
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: henche on January 26, 2018, 01:16:33 AM
Can we get a recap?

Basically, the passengers without seats were FAs who were deadheading, so nobody realized they were looking for seats, even after pilot announced.

Obvious troll, but doesn't mean it's not what happened.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: Yaalili on January 26, 2018, 06:56:26 AM
I thought southwest all flies the same type of plane....

They fly the 737 which has 143 seats and the 738 which has 175.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: Dan on January 26, 2018, 07:56:05 AM
Basically, the passengers without seats were FAs who were deadheading, so nobody realized they were looking for seats, even after pilot announced.

Obvious troll, but doesn't mean it's not what happened.
There are lots of things that could have happened.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: Yehuda57 on January 26, 2018, 08:10:50 AM
There are lots of things that could have happened.
I prefer OP's version, though it could do with more screaming, shouting and violence. And a plot twist.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: aygart on January 26, 2018, 08:12:38 AM
There are lots of things that could have happened.
Prove it didn't happen
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: Dan on January 26, 2018, 08:16:35 AM
Prove it didn't happen
Prove Henches made up story didn't happen?
There are a hundred stories I can make up. Onus is on an actual passenger to say what happened.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on January 26, 2018, 08:57:49 AM
Does anyone disagree that some kids were in seats they didn’t pay for.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: Boruch999 on January 26, 2018, 09:18:27 AM
Does anyone disagree that some kids were in seats they didn’t pay for.

I doubt any kids on the flight paid for their seats themselves.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: Yehuda57 on January 26, 2018, 09:46:25 AM
You've blown it wiiiiiide open, Jerry
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: ShlockDoc on January 26, 2018, 09:56:12 AM
Does anyone disagree that some kids were in seats they didn’t pay for.

Does anyone disagree that yidden, based Dan's popularity for example, like to get a deal?  So these people on the plane were hoping that the standing passengers would find somewhere else to sit and they'd get a free seat for there kid and they can brag to their friends when they get home about the shtick they used.   What's the big deal here?
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: Yammer on January 26, 2018, 09:58:08 AM
Does anyone disagree that yidden, based on the popularity of Dan for example, like to get a deal?  So these people on the plane were hoping that the standing passengers would find somewhere else to sit and they'd get a free seat for there kid and they can brag to their friends when they get home about the shtick they used.   What's the big deal here?
Does anyone disagree that all Americans like a deal based on the popularity of storming stores at 5 AM on Black Friday?
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: yuneeq on January 26, 2018, 10:00:33 AM
Does anyone disagree that yidden, based on the popularity of Dan for example, like to get a deal?  So these people on the plane were hoping that the standing passengers would find somewhere else to sit and they'd get a free seat for there kid and they can brag to their friends when they get home about the shtick they used.   What's the big deal here?

The big deal is that they made repeated announcements that people were sitting in unpaid for seats, and passengers are still standing holding up departure, yet no one got up to say a seat is open where their kid was sitting. It's absolutely disgusting, and the apologists here are making me even more disgusted.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: ShlockDoc on January 26, 2018, 10:05:49 AM
The big deal is that they made repeated announcements that people were sitting in unpaid for seats, and passengers are still standing holding up departure, yet no one got up to say a seat is open where their kid was sitting. It's absolutely disgusting, and the apologists here are making me even more disgusted.

Sorry, I misspoke.  I didn't mean what's the big deal, I meant what's the big news?  That the yiddishe world has a ben adom lichaveiro problem?  Duh!
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on January 26, 2018, 10:51:46 AM
Does anyone disagree that all Americans like a deal based on the popularity of storming stores at 5 AM on Black Friday?
"All"? More like a small minority.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: Dan on January 26, 2018, 10:53:59 AM
The big deal is that they made repeated announcements that people were sitting in unpaid for seats, and passengers are still standing holding up departure, yet no one got up to say a seat is open where their kid was sitting. It's absolutely disgusting, and the apologists here are making me even more disgusted.
I don't think anyone is apologizing. I'm saying that people might be too embarrassed in that situation to just stand up.

Personally I buy a seat for all my kids for safety and convenience reasons, but CH is clearly another reason to do so.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: henche on January 26, 2018, 10:57:19 AM
Prove Henches made up story didn't happen?
There are a hundred stories I can make up. Onus is on an actual passenger to say what happened.

We don't actually know that OP is not making up the whole thing from scratch either.

There were 150-175 ppl on that plane--where's the corroborating witnesses?

Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: henche on January 26, 2018, 10:57:49 AM
Does anyone disagree that some kids were in seats they didn’t pay for.

In the story? Or on an actual plane? Or ever in the history of the world?
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: Dan on January 26, 2018, 11:01:26 AM
We don't actually know that OP is not making up the whole thing from scratch either.

There were 150-175 ppl on that plane--where's the corroborating witnesses?
Shall I make a DDMS post and find them?
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: mercaz1 on January 26, 2018, 11:01:39 AM
did any of the kids end up getting a free seat or did they all need to move?
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: henche on January 26, 2018, 11:03:08 AM
Shall I make a DDMS post and find them?

Yes, but sticky it as an advertisement. @chaimmoskowitz 2 can pay.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: Yammer on January 26, 2018, 11:03:40 AM


"All"? More like a small minority.

And so is the percentage on DDMS of DDF. The point is everyone loves a good deal. The problem is what happens when ppl don't have where to sit.

I don't think anyone is apologizing. I'm saying that people might be too embarrassed in that situation to just stand up.

While your probably right that doesn't mean that it's a valid excuse.

Personally I buy a seat for all my kids for safety and convenience reasons, but CH is clearly another reason to do so.

I actually never buy a seat as my babies never sit nicely in the Car seat...
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: Yammer on January 26, 2018, 11:04:32 AM
Yes, but sticky it as an advertisement. @chaimmoskowitz 2 can pay.
Or @Henche 2 ....

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180126/314b03346940b657cb40a6ea808fb2be.jpg)
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: TimT on January 26, 2018, 11:28:04 AM
Shall I make a DDMS post and find them?
Or search social media. If it happened you’ll find it along with photos of suspects. (Or any of the self hating Jewish sewer sites)
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on January 26, 2018, 11:29:19 AM
Yes, but sticky it as an advertisement. @chaimmoskowitz 2 can pay.
You are volunteering to pay?
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: Dan on January 26, 2018, 11:30:08 AM
You are volunteering to pay?
Sounds like it.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: yelped on January 26, 2018, 11:34:29 AM
Shall I make a DDMS post and find them?
I would quote the "NO! " from UPS method thread, but I'm too lazy.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: henche on January 26, 2018, 11:34:44 AM
You are volunteering to pay?

I'm pretty sure you owe me at least 5 DO payings, based on various wagers I've imposed on you, and POUSUs.  We can just deduct it from the cheshbon.


ETA: We for reallies need to do Kens Diner before I leave town.  I'm hoping to be gone within 2-3 weeks.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on January 26, 2018, 11:36:46 AM
I'm pretty sure you owe me at least 5 DO payings, based on various wagers I've imposed on you, and POUSUs.  We can just deduct it from the cheshbon.


ETA: We for reallies need to do Kens Diner before I leave town.  I'm hoping to be gone within 2-3 weeks.
You said CM2 should pay. Now you are backing down from that? You are not paying?
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: Dan on January 26, 2018, 11:37:14 AM
ETA: We for reallies need to do Kens Diner before I leave town.  I'm hoping to be gone within 2-3 weeks.
Boo lead pipes.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: shmebeble on January 26, 2018, 11:42:29 AM
I'm pretty sure you owe me at least 5 DO payings, based on various wagers I've imposed on you, and POUSUs.  We can just deduct it from the cheshbon.


ETA: We for reallies need to do Kens Diner before I leave town.  I'm hoping to be gone within 2-3 weeks.
Kens Diner 2pm on Sunday?
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: etech0 on January 26, 2018, 11:44:14 AM
I would quote the "NO! " from UPS method thread, but I'm too lazy.
NO!
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: as2 on January 26, 2018, 02:09:26 PM


Boo asbestos.

FTFY. Get with the program
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: henche on January 26, 2018, 02:18:25 PM

FTFY. Get with the program

As anyone at this morning's Lincoln Cafe DO would know.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: moko on January 26, 2018, 02:19:18 PM
Boo lead pipes.
I thought it was lead paint
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: Dan on January 26, 2018, 02:20:57 PM
Boo lead pipes.
Boo asbestos.
I thought it was lead paint
Clearly @henche knows how to troll even when it's in person.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: as2 on January 26, 2018, 02:25:54 PM


As anyone at this morning's Lincoln Cafe DO would know.

ALOL


Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: as2 on January 26, 2018, 02:26:32 PM
Clearly @henche knows how to troll even when it's in person.
I'm pretty confident in the fact I wasn't trolled, but you never really know with @henche
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: henche on January 26, 2018, 02:27:47 PM
It's complicated.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: Yehuda57 on January 27, 2018, 07:08:10 PM
It's complicated.
But it is a relationship.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: Yammer on January 27, 2018, 08:51:37 PM
But it is a relationship.
That's usually how a relationship works...
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: henche on January 27, 2018, 09:31:08 PM
Lincoln cafe do tomorrow am?
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: as2 on January 27, 2018, 10:05:27 PM
Lincoln cafe do tomorrow am?
IN.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: sammy n on January 27, 2018, 11:17:10 PM
Lincoln cafe do tomorrow am?
After the 945 minyan at the shteible then maybe.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: shmebeble on January 27, 2018, 11:55:12 PM
Lincoln cafe do tomorrow am?
I prefer pm
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: henche on January 28, 2018, 12:25:12 AM
I prefer pm

Hmmmm

But I might be hungry in am
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: as2 on January 28, 2018, 12:44:48 AM
Hmmmm

But I might be hungry in am
Ken's in the PM ;D
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: David Smith on January 28, 2018, 04:19:11 AM
There are a hundred stories I can make up. Onus is on an actual passenger to say what happened.

Is that true halachicly?
Does anyone disagree that some kids were in seats they didn’t pay for.
Did you never put your bag ect down in an empty seat next to you on a flight? Did that belonging of yours pay for a seat? Do you know Southwest's policy regarding overweight passengers that book and take up an extra seat when there are extra seats available on the flight?

Sorry, I misspoke.  I didn't mean what's the big deal, I meant what's the big news?  That the yiddishe world has a ben adom lichaveiro problem?  Duh!

No comment necessary.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on January 28, 2018, 06:09:17 AM
Did you never put your bag ect down in an empty seat next to you on a flight? Did that belonging of yours pay for a seat? Do you know Southwest's policy regarding overweight passengers that book and take up an extra seat when there are extra seats available on the flight?
Instead of trying to defect the question just say you don't disagree and be done with it.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: David Smith on January 28, 2018, 06:12:18 AM
Instead of trying to defect the question just say you don't disagree and be done with it.
Pot...
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: ChaimMoskowitz on January 28, 2018, 06:22:16 AM
Pot...
If you are afraid to answer the question why even respond?
The problem is you asked the wrong guy your question. No I don't use the empty seat next to me. 99% of the time there is no empty seat.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: Geshmak25 on January 28, 2018, 09:47:14 AM
When I had lap child I brought on a car seat. If there was an extra seat then I would put the lap child into the car seat, if there were no extra seats I put my 3 yr old into the car seat.

There was only 1 time where I had to put the 3 yr old into the car seat. Another time there was 1 extra seat on the whole flight and the stewardess has rachmanus on us and made sure that we got the extra seat.
Title: Re: Colossal Chillul Hashem on Southwest Flight to Newark
Post by: Dan on January 28, 2018, 09:54:07 AM
Is that true halachicly?
Wow, talk about missing the point.

I already was dan lkaf zchus earlier and took flak for that. Mind you it wasn't an excuse, but just trying to put myself in their shoes.

But you can't pretend to have been on the plane and state what happened and expect to have me leave it published as fact for the gullible.