Author Topic: Mezuzah Fraud  (Read 73267 times)

Offline Yehuda57

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Re: Mezuzah Fraud
« Reply #20 on: January 03, 2019, 01:10:10 PM »
If the guy told you it is kosher l'chatchila then he stole from you, but when people ask for the cheapest possible mezzuzah, then it is going to be b'dieved (and anyone who didn't know that before now was burying their own head in the sand). The fact that one sofer who checked them said they are passul does not mean that the one who sold them agrees.

Again, I agree that passul mezzuzas being sold and the ones who sell them should answer for their actions, but this video went to far to the other extreme by using a sofer that is more machmir.

I'm just calling for a little bit of nuance.
Firstly he says a second sofer checked them.

See upthread - I 100% was expecting a kosher mezuzah l'chatchilah. I even discussed it with the salesman (who is a sofer) and he made no mention that they would not be 100% kosher.

If you tell me it costs $35, that's what I think it should cost. Don't accuse people of burying their heads in the sand when you're not telling people that if you only spend $35 the mezuzah is not going to be kosher l'chatchila.

Machon Stam charges $42 for their cheapest mezuzahs. (according to their website) They were all kosher, even according to this extremely machmir sofer.

I'm all for nuance. But this is theft. Plain and simple.

ETA: apparently he is not willing to have these mezuzahs checked by independent sofrim. But I stand by claim that they all selling these mezuzahs under false pretenses based on personal experience.
« Last Edit: January 03, 2019, 01:33:53 PM by Yehuda57 »

Offline yitzgar

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Re: Mezuzah Fraud
« Reply #21 on: January 03, 2019, 01:31:05 PM »
Firstly he says a second sofer checked them.

See upthread - I 100% was expecting a kosher mezuzah l'chatchilah. I even discussed it with the salesman (who is a sofer) and he made no mention that they would not be 100% kosher.

If you tell me it costs $35, that's what I think it should cost. Don't accuse people of burying their heads in the sand when you're not telling people that if you only spend $35 the mezuzah is not going to be kosher l'chatchila.

Machon Stam charges $42 for their cheapest mezuzahs. (according to their website) They were all kosher, even according to this extremely machmir sofer.

I'm all for nuance. But this is theft. Plain and simple.
The mocher should tell buyers whether it is lechatchila or bdieved, but buyers should ask if he doesn't.

Offline ushdadude

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Re: Mezuzah Fraud
« Reply #22 on: January 03, 2019, 01:37:21 PM »
what's more concerning to me is that a lot of these cheaper mezuzos have eraser marks. a mezuza has to b written in order. there is no way to know if a mistake was corrected as it was written (kosher) or if it was noticed later and corrected (pasul)

Offline zh cohen

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Re: Mezuzah Fraud
« Reply #23 on: January 03, 2019, 01:40:11 PM »
Firstly he says a second sofer checked them.

ETA: apparently he is not willing to have these mezuzahs checked by independent sofrim.

And many sofrim have questioned those sofrim based on the pictures.

I agree with you for the most part.

Offline skyguy918

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Re: Mezuzah Fraud
« Reply #24 on: January 03, 2019, 02:21:25 PM »
And many sofrim have questioned those sofrim based on the pictures.

I agree with you for the most part.
No self respecting sofer would give a real opinion based on a low quality picture like what you can pull from the video.

Offline gozalim

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Re: Mezuzah Fraud
« Reply #25 on: January 03, 2019, 02:56:10 PM »
apparently the 'psulim' he mentions might be so according to AR but not necessarily  according to all poskim.

but the mocher should not have agreed to sell to 'anash' personal use...

Offline skyguy918

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Re: Mezuzah Fraud
« Reply #26 on: January 03, 2019, 03:37:19 PM »
apparently the 'psulim' he mentions might be so according to AR but not necessarily  according to all poskim.

but the mocher should not have agreed to sell to 'anash' personal use...
Where are you getting your apparently? Which of the psulim?

Offline Yehuda57

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Re: Mezuzah Fraud
« Reply #27 on: January 03, 2019, 03:51:20 PM »
Where are you getting your apparently? Which of the psulim?

Lubavitch WhatsApp today is using up all of the available bandwidth in the world on voice notes.

Offline bestwatchman

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Re: Mezuzah Fraud
« Reply #28 on: January 03, 2019, 03:53:53 PM »
Lubavitch WhatsApp today is using up all of the available bandwidth in the world on voice notes.
and don't forget the video itself. 60mb. Being forqarded on every group... Wish there was a way to see how many times a whatsapp video was viewed.

Offline skyguy918

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Re: Mezuzah Fraud
« Reply #29 on: January 03, 2019, 04:14:37 PM »
Lubavitch WhatsApp today is using up all of the available bandwidth in the world on voice notes.
Nu, so someone can probably share what it is that apparently the velt is arguing with the video on specifically.

Offline zh cohen

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Re: Mezuzah Fraud
« Reply #30 on: January 03, 2019, 04:19:08 PM »
No self respecting sofer would give a real opinion based on a low quality picture like what you can pull from the video.

I acknowledged the limitations of a picture here -

Many other sofrim have reviewed these pictures and (taking into account the limitations of the pictures) said that many of those he said are passul, are actually kosher (bedieved).



Offline Yehuda57

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Re: Mezuzah Fraud
« Reply #31 on: January 03, 2019, 04:42:23 PM »
Nu, so someone can probably share what it is that apparently the velt is arguing with the video on specifically.
In short, the issues described in the video do not pasul the mezuzah. Some issues are problematic according to the Alter Rebbe, but there is plenty to rely on that they are kosher.

This is not from examining the exact mezuzahs in the video, but from experience checking mezuzahs from the same sources.

My issue remains that it is dishonest to sell such a mezuzah to a Lubavitcher without informing the buyer that it is likely not kosher according to the Alter Rebbe.

Offline googwallet

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Re: Mezuzah Fraud
« Reply #32 on: January 03, 2019, 05:25:59 PM »
Seems like this guy has an agenda. I'm not sure exactly what it is, maybe to make his name known? Maybe to boost sales for Machon Stam?
He goes way too far by listing the name of each sofer behind the stores and showing the pictures of each. He's a total fraud in my opinion.

Offline skyguy918

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Re: Mezuzah Fraud
« Reply #33 on: January 03, 2019, 05:42:54 PM »
In short, the issues described in the video do not pasul the mezuzah. Some issues are problematic according to the Alter Rebbe, but there is plenty to rely on that they are kosher.

This is not from examining the exact mezuzahs in the video, but from experience checking mezuzahs from the same sources.

My issue remains that it is dishonest to sell such a mezuzah to a Lubavitcher without informing the buyer that it is likely not kosher according to the Alter Rebbe.
Letters touching is not a universal psul?

Offline Yehuda57

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Re: Mezuzah Fraud
« Reply #34 on: January 03, 2019, 05:51:56 PM »
Letters touching is not a universal psul?

IANAS, but according to one sofer I heard, not a psul according to the Rashb"a, Rada"ch and others.

Offline zh cohen

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Re: Mezuzah Fraud
« Reply #35 on: January 03, 2019, 06:29:28 PM »
Letters touching is not a universal psul?

I'm not a sofer, but the alter Rebbe brings an opinion that if the letter would still be kosher after scratching out the part that connects, the mezzuza is kosher even before it's fixed.

Offline koplonko

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Re: Mezuzah Fraud
« Reply #36 on: January 03, 2019, 06:39:18 PM »
IANAS, but according to one sofer I heard, not a psul according to the Rashb"a, Rada"ch and others.
lchatchila?
I'm not a sofer, but the alter Rebbe brings an opinion that if the letter would still be kosher after scratching out the part that connects, the mezzuza is kosher even before it's fixed.
lchatchila?

Offline hvaces42

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Re: Mezuzah Fraud
« Reply #37 on: January 03, 2019, 07:11:01 PM »
How does one correct a mezuzah? Doesnt it have to be written כסדרם? Or is that tefillin? Or does Chabad have a different view of that?
Fair warning - Any PMs sent in response to forum posts are fair game for ridicule in public.

Offline zh cohen

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Re: Mezuzah Fraud
« Reply #38 on: January 03, 2019, 08:01:38 PM »

Offline zh cohen

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Re: Mezuzah Fraud
« Reply #39 on: January 03, 2019, 08:02:30 PM »
How does one correct a mezuzah? Doesnt it have to be written כסדרם? Or is that tefillin? Or does Chabad have a different view of that?

Certain psulim can be fixed (maybe those that are kosher bedieved?)