Author Topic: Any day traders in the forum?  (Read 15343 times)

Offline hvaces42

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Re: Any day traders in the forum?
« Reply #40 on: January 22, 2019, 12:08:08 AM »
Geez get a Gamblers Anonymous room :)
FTFY.

If you don't mind me asking, do you have a % max loss per day or more like a total max money loss when you say I stop for today?

If the answer is more than zero...
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Offline miles lover

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Re: Any day traders in the forum?
« Reply #41 on: January 22, 2019, 02:07:49 AM »
FTFY.If the answer is more than zero...
Why the hate ? Day trading is a normal job. True, it’s not meant for most people but if a person has gamble in him and at the same time has discipline it can be a good job and fun as well with adrenaline mixed in.

Offline ludmila

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Re: Any day traders in the forum?
« Reply #42 on: January 22, 2019, 02:13:12 AM »
Why the hate ? Day trading is a normal job. True, it’s not meant for most people but if a person has gamble in him and at the same time has discipline it can be a good job and fun as well with adrenaline mixed in.
100%, I do some day trading, but most of my trades are intermediate term, I found this from experience , bigger profits are made trading the intermediate trend-days to weeks. I think each trader or investor has to find the time frame that suits their personality.
« Last Edit: January 22, 2019, 02:30:27 AM by ludmila »
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Offline hvaces42

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Re: Any day traders in the forum?
« Reply #43 on: January 22, 2019, 07:18:10 AM »
Why the hate ? Day trading is a normal job. True, it’s not meant for most people but if a person has gamble in him and at the same time has discipline it can be a good job and fun as well with adrenaline mixed in.
If you read what I wrote above, its not hate at all. Its these exact statements that I, and people that I am familiar with, made when day trading to rationalize my and our gambling addiction. Every statement made is a statement I am intimately familiar. I too thought I had a _________ problem with my trading strategy (fill in your excuse for losing trades). I too did not see myself as a compulsive gambler. Until that day that it all came crashing down for me. I can introduce you to 100 others with similar stories.   
100%, I do some day trading, but most of my trades are intermediate term, I found this from experience , bigger profits are made trading the intermediate trend-days to weeks. I think each trader or investor has to find the time frame that suits their personality.
From what I am reading the "time frame" is minutes. Smaller time frames = more frequent dopamine hits. Trading and investing are 2 different animals.

Again, this is no personal hit on anyone. I wish someone would have laid it out to me so clearly when I was "day trading". I probably wouldnt have listened or reacted the same way ("Why the hate?") but I never stood a chance without someone actually saying this to me. If it helps even one person be a tiny bit more cautious so that their day trading doesnt lead to disaster my work is done.   
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Offline Ephraimh

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Any day traders in the forum?
« Reply #44 on: January 22, 2019, 10:59:16 AM »
Not gonna hate on day traders, if humans figured out a way to get to the Moon and how to cause unspeakable destruction with little Atoms, then there is definitely a way to figure out how to make money day trading... its probably not rocket science.

That being said though, go ahead and take a look at the Forbes 100 richest list, you’re not gonna find any day traders there.. instead you’re gonna find the likes of Warren Buffett, Ray Dalio, and Carl Icahn who made their money through regular investing, (should probably add Bill Gates, Mark Zuckerberg, Jeff Bezos, etc. as well as I don’t think they’d be on that list if they’d be switching in and out of their own stock).

Is short, can you make money day trading? Yeah, with the right skill set, I guess. Is it the superior way to make lots and lots of money? No.

Offline LoLo

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Re: Any day traders in the forum?
« Reply #45 on: January 22, 2019, 11:04:11 AM »
That's like saying 'don't open a grocery, because the rich people open chain stores'.

Trading is a job (gambling job according to some, but still.), While investing is not.

I know people making 3-5k daily on average from day trading.

Offline miles lover

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Re: Any day traders in the forum?
« Reply #46 on: January 22, 2019, 11:08:16 AM »
That's like saying 'don't open a grocery, because the rich people open chain stores'.

Trading is a job (gambling job according to some, but still.), While investing is not.

I know people making 3-5k daily on average from day trading.
Well said

Offline hvaces42

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Re: Any day traders in the forum?
« Reply #47 on: January 22, 2019, 11:21:40 AM »
That's like saying 'don't open a grocery, because the rich people open chain stores'.

Trading is a job (gambling job according to some, but still.), While investing is not.

I know people making 3-5k daily on average from day trading.
Over how long a period of time? And I know people who lost 50-100k a day doing it too. Proprietary trading for a financial firm is a job. Not a gambling job at all. But to think that you can beat a Fortune 500 financial company's multi-million dollar HFT algorithm on your desktop is a bit delusional. If it was so easy the big companies would be all over it, and they are, at your expense.

I get it. In the short term there is money to be made. With prudence and a system there is money to be made as well. But what was written in this thread about emotional trading and learning to control emotions and acceptable loss percentages etc. thats downright scary.   
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Offline Ephraimh

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Re: Any day traders in the forum?
« Reply #48 on: January 22, 2019, 11:22:14 AM »
That's like saying 'don't open a grocery, because the rich people open chain stores'.

Trading is a job (gambling job according to some, but still.), While investing is not.

I know people making 3-5k daily on average from day trading.
Bad analogy.
Are you suggesting that 3-5k is average return for a day trader or even a plausible fantasy for most people? Successful day trading isn’t comparable to opening a grocery, or to any other traditional way of making money for that matter, and you know it.

Offline hvaces42

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Re: Any day traders in the forum?
« Reply #49 on: January 22, 2019, 11:24:33 AM »
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Offline LoLo

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Re: Any day traders in the forum?
« Reply #50 on: January 22, 2019, 11:27:45 AM »
We can go on and on with this discussion, and it will never end, we are all aware of your position on this topic.

Can we please leave this thread on topic for those who decide they still want to do it, instead of pointless arguments?

Offline hvaces42

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Re: Any day traders in the forum?
« Reply #51 on: January 22, 2019, 11:52:27 AM »
We can go on and on with this discussion, and it will never end, we are all aware of your position on this topic.

Can we please leave this thread on topic for those who decide they still want to do it, instead of pointless arguments?
If it ends with someone having information they didnt have before it is not pointless. And they thread is titled Any day traders in the forum. I was one. Now I get to ask the question, why the hate?
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Offline callmepaul

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Re: Any day traders in the forum?
« Reply #52 on: January 22, 2019, 12:00:02 PM »
If it ends with someone having information they didnt have before it is not pointless. And they thread is titled Any day traders in the forum. I was one. Now I get to ask the question, why the hate?

I didn't sense hate from anyone in this thread so far. But you seem to be stubbornly focused in showing your point of view and not letting it be discussed otherwise. We already understood that you think that day trading is the same as going to the casino and that you think it's not a real job.
I think that's already clear and you do not have to keep repeating it.

In the last posts we were discussing about day trading until someone made fun of a posting and then you continued doing it.

There are thousands of topics in this forum, if talking about day trading (in all its forms) is not your thing, surely there are other topics that may interest you.
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Offline Ephraimh

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Re: Any day traders in the forum?
« Reply #53 on: January 22, 2019, 12:09:01 PM »
We can go on and on with this discussion, and it will never end, we are all aware of your position on this topic.

Can we please leave this thread on topic for those who decide they still want to do it, instead of pointless arguments?
I’m actually agreeing with you that day trading can be profitable, i wasn’t arguing.. I was just pointing out that regular investing is generally more profitable, (and btw I know it’s not a “job”, this isn’t an employment thread).

Also that grocery analogy was bad, very bad, small grocery vs chain store has no parallel to day trading vs investing.. 

But you’re right, should probably move on.

Offline stv17

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Re: Any day traders in the forum?
« Reply #54 on: January 22, 2019, 12:39:26 PM »
That being said though, go ahead and take a look at the Forbes 100 richest list, you’re not gonna find any day traders there.. instead you’re gonna find the likes of Warren Buffett, Ray Dalio, and Carl Icahn who made their money through regular investing, (should probably add Bill Gates, Mark Zuckerberg, Jeff Bezos, etc. as well as I don’t think they’d be on that list if they’d be switching in and out of their own stock).

Most of the "successful" daytraders earn around $150-250k a year.. this is not a job to make millions. It's for someone who prefers to be self employed and enjoy the freedom of not being tied to a 9-6 job.

Offline yakrot

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Re: Any day traders in the forum?
« Reply #55 on: January 22, 2019, 12:55:06 PM »
Most of the "successful" daytraders earn around $150-250k a year.. this is not a job to make millions. It's for someone who prefers to be self employed and enjoy the freedom of not being tied to a 9-6 job.
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Offline S209

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Re: Any day traders in the forum?
« Reply #56 on: January 22, 2019, 02:06:37 PM »
Most of the "successful" daytraders earn around $150-250k a year.. this is not a job to make millions. It's for someone who prefers to be self employed and enjoy the freedom of not being tied to a 9-6 job.
I imagine the actual dollar amount is relative to the amount you’re willing to risk/spend, not a specific universal dollar amount.

But the real question is, what percentage of day traders are “successful”?  Even if you say 75% (HINT: It’s way lower), that brings that 150K figure down ALOT...
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Offline stv17

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Re: Any day traders in the forum?
« Reply #57 on: January 22, 2019, 02:46:18 PM »
But the real question is, what percentage of day traders are “successful”?  Even if you say 75% (HINT: It’s way lower), that brings that 150K figure down ALOT...

I'd say that only about 40% of daytraders are “successful” (the rest make less). But my point was primarily to state that daytraders don't make millions. it's a regular job.

Offline ludmila

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Re: Any day traders in the forum?
« Reply #58 on: January 22, 2019, 04:44:47 PM »
Not gonna hate on day traders, if humans figured out a way to get to the Moon and how to cause unspeakable destruction with little Atoms, then there is definitely a way to figure out how to make money day trading... its probably not rocket science.

That being said though, go ahead and take a look at the Forbes 100 richest list, you’re not gonna find any day traders there.. instead you’re gonna find the likes of Warren Buffett, Ray Dalio, and Carl Icahn who made their money through regular investing, (should probably add Bill Gates, Mark Zuckerberg, Jeff Bezos, etc. as well as I don’t think they’d be on that list if they’d be switching in and out of their own stock).

Is short, can you make money day trading? Yeah, with the right skill set, I guess. Is it the superior way to make lots and lots of money? No.
Agree, but the names you mentioned, 2 are hedge fund managers and corporate raiders, Warren Buffett made most his money buying companies. There are many like them Steve Cohen net worth $15 billion,George Soros $26 billion,Paul Tudor Jones , Stanley Druckenmiller, Bruce Kovner etc. These are in a league of their own, some of them are traders like Paul Tudor Jones and Bruce Kovner  who trade the intermediate trend and others like Warren Buffet are very long term investors, they trade and invest billions $ of theirs and other people's money, they have hundreds of researchers, tech analysts, employees who can reach CEOs any day, statisticians , AI etc, which is not available to the average person.
As for short term traders, Martin Schwartz featured in the New Market Wizards ran his account day trading his own money from $40000 to $22 million, he trades his own money,not a hedge fund.Another is Ed Seykota, who stressed that his success came from  strong money management and his ability to know when to cut his losses. He also says that public market information is of little use, since this is already accounted for in the prices. Last but not least is the legendary Trader Vic,  who made profits 18 years in a row using technical analysis. Over this period, he managed to generate an average annual return of 72%. He stresses that he only takes risk when he sees that the odds are with him.
As a trader, you might never make the millions these guys made but you may improve your performance by paying attention to some of the lessons they learnt about money management.
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Offline ludmila

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Re: Any day traders in the forum?
« Reply #59 on: January 22, 2019, 04:51:25 PM »
That's like saying 'don't open a grocery, because the rich people open chain stores'.

Trading is a job (gambling job according to some, but still.), While investing is not.

I know people making 3-5k daily on average from day trading.
Very very few can make $5k /day trading. Some do but might lose it all in one trade gone bad, but definitely a few will make that much and more.It is a hard job, you need to make split second decisions without any hesitation, monitor your screen non stop while watching hundreds of stocks , forex pairs and commodities .
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