Author Topic: Adding Financial Literacy Courses In Yeshivas  (Read 72544 times)

Offline CS1

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Adding Financial Literacy Courses In Yeshivas
« on: March 04, 2019, 11:30:27 PM »
Zev Brenner interview:
https://www.mixcloud.com/zev-brenner/talkline-with-zev-brenner-on-credit-card-scams-affecting-the-orthodox-jewish-community/

I just heard this interview. Excellent job. it's a start. As Dan said, "financial literacy" is a TOP priority to teach our children in school.
« Last Edit: March 05, 2019, 10:12:56 AM by Dan »
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Offline Definitions

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Re: Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #1 on: March 05, 2019, 02:23:44 AM »
As Dan said, "financial literacy" is a TOP priority to teach our children in school.
I respectfully disagree. Its important but it doesn't belong in a yeshiva. A yeshiva isn't business school.

You'll ask me so why is it worse than math science...? I'll answer that those don't take away from the goal of a frum person. They're there for various reasons. To give more structure to the day of a child. To make the child sharper. And possibly also to qualify for government funding.

That's just my feelings about it.

ETA: Just to clarify a little. I feel like the math, science... isn't being taught to learn it. It's being taught for the reasons stated above. On the other hand if you're teaching financial literacy it's being taught for itself. Which I think is a problem.
« Last Edit: March 05, 2019, 02:48:19 AM by Definitions »
My Tapatalk notifications don't always work.

Offline Boruch999

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Re: Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #2 on: March 05, 2019, 02:26:09 AM »
I respectfully disagree. Its important but it doesn't belong in a yeshiva. A yeshiva isn't business school.

You'll ask me so why is it worse than math science...? I'll answer that those don't take away from the goal of a frum person. They're there for various reasons. To give more structure to the day of a child. To make the child sharper. And possibly also to qualify for government funding.

That's just my feelings about it.

Financial literacy takes away from the goal of a frum person?!?!


Offline Definitions

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Re: Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #3 on: March 05, 2019, 02:41:58 AM »
Financial literacy takes away from the goal of a frum person?!?!
It's hard for me to explain exactly why I feel that way. It could be I'm wrong.

I'm too tired now to think properly I'll try to respond tomorrow.
My Tapatalk notifications don't always work.

Offline mmgfarb

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Re: Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #4 on: March 05, 2019, 02:44:35 AM »
I respectfully disagree. Its important but it doesn't belong in a yeshiva. A yeshiva isn't business school.

You'll ask me so why is it worse than math science...? I'll answer that those don't take away from the goal of a frum person. They're there for various reasons. To give more structure to the day of a child. To make the child sharper. And possibly also to qualify for government funding.

That's just my feelings about it.
Lol, I don't know who taught you what the "goals of a frum person" are but maybe you should go back to them and tell them they missed a few parts.
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Offline Emkay

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Re: Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #5 on: March 05, 2019, 07:01:47 AM »
I respectfully disagree. Its important but it doesn't belong in a yeshiva. A yeshiva isn't business school.

You'll ask me so why is it worse than math science...? I'll answer that those don't take away from the goal of a frum person. They're there for various reasons. To give more structure to the day of a child. To make the child sharper. And possibly also to qualify for government funding.

That's just my feelings about it.

ETA: Just to clarify a little. I feel like the math, science... isn't being taught to learn it. It's being taught for the reasons stated above. On the other hand if you're teaching financial literacy it's being taught for itself. Which I think is a problem.
Huh?
Edit: Huh?

Offline Yehuda57

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Re: Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #6 on: March 05, 2019, 07:02:55 AM »
I respectfully disagree. Its important but it doesn't belong in a yeshiva. A yeshiva isn't business school.

You'll ask me so why is it worse than math science...? I'll answer that those don't take away from the goal of a frum person. They're there for various reasons. To give more structure to the day of a child. To make the child sharper. And possibly also to qualify for government funding.

That's just my feelings about it.

ETA: Just to clarify a little. I feel like the math, science... isn't being taught to learn it. It's being taught for the reasons stated above. On the other hand if you're teaching financial literacy it's being taught for itself. Which I think is a problem.
Bless your heart

Offline Yehuda57

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Re: Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #7 on: March 05, 2019, 07:35:47 AM »
And that’s when you know it’s time to stop posting.
So you've just been sleeping for all this time?

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Re: Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #8 on: March 05, 2019, 07:54:52 AM »
I respectfully disagree. Its important but it doesn't belong in a yeshiva. A yeshiva isn't business school.

You'll ask me so why is it worse than math science...? I'll answer that those don't take away from the goal of a frum person. They're there for various reasons. To give more structure to the day of a child. To make the child sharper. And possibly also to qualify for government funding.

That's just my feelings about it.

ETA: Just to clarify a little. I feel like the math, science... isn't being taught to learn it. It's being taught for the reasons stated above. On the other hand if you're teaching financial literacy it's being taught for itself. Which I think is a problem.
Huh?
Edit: Huh?
My thoughts exactly.

One thing i can tell you is that I have seen numerous people misunderstand sugyos and issue wrong piskei halacha due to their lack of understanding of math and science. For many years people came to me in bais eliyahu and its successors to explain mathematical aspects of sugyos.
Feelings don't care about your facts

Offline cmey

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Re: Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #9 on: March 05, 2019, 07:58:34 AM »
My thoughts exactly.

One thing i can tell you is that I have seen numerous people misunderstand sugyos and issue wrong piskei halacha due to their lack of understanding of math and science. For many years people came to me in bais eliyahu and its successors to explain mathematical aspects of sugyos.

What are you advocating? That everyone take math and science courses before learning halacha lemaaseh?

Offline gingyguy

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Re: Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #10 on: March 05, 2019, 08:05:57 AM »
It's hard for me to explain exactly why I feel that way. It could be I'm wrong.

I'm too tired now to think properly I'll try to respond tomorrow.
oib es felt in hasbarah . es felt in havanah
May you slide down the banister of happiness & get many splinters of success up your career.

Offline EJB

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Re: Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #11 on: March 05, 2019, 08:09:53 AM »
What are you advocating? That everyone take math and science courses before learning halacha lemaaseh?
Why is it one or the other?

Offline ExGingi

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Re: Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #12 on: March 05, 2019, 08:11:30 AM »
My thoughts exactly.

One thing i can tell you is that I have seen numerous people misunderstand sugyos and issue wrong piskei halacha due to their lack of understanding of math and science. For many years people came to me in bais eliyahu and its successors to explain mathematical aspects of sugyos.
If they never spent a good few months in Cheder (probably 5th or 6th grade) learning פרשת משפטים, you would be lacking fundamentals required for סדר נזיקין.
I've been waiting over 5 years with bated breath for someone to say that!
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Offline Boruch999

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Re: Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #13 on: March 05, 2019, 08:11:45 AM »
What are you advocating? That everyone take math and science courses before learning halacha lemaaseh?

You can not learn anything lemaaseh if you don't know metzius.  Math is metzius.  Lot's of halacha depends on a metzius which nowadays is covered by science.   While every community decides for themselves how and to what extent to teach them, to say that knowledge of math and science is the antithesis of being a frum Jew is not just wrong, it is ludicrous.

Offline EJB

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Re: Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #14 on: March 05, 2019, 08:12:30 AM »
You can not learn anything lemaaseh if you don't know metzius.  Math is metzius.  Lot's of halacha depends on a metzius which nowadays is covered by science.   While every community decides for themselves how and to what extent to teach them, to say that knowledge of math and science is the antithesis of being a frum Jew is not just wrong, it is ludicrous.
Unless it’s the math of cheating on taxes and against banks then it’s torah

Offline bznt

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Re: Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #15 on: March 05, 2019, 08:13:54 AM »
Looks like a mod needs to split this thread again

Offline EJB

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Re: Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #16 on: March 05, 2019, 08:16:14 AM »
Looks like a mod needs to split this thread again
Or just move it to the amazon deals thread.

Offline sky121

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Re: Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #17 on: March 05, 2019, 08:27:41 AM »
I respectfully disagree. Its important but it doesn't belong in a yeshiva. A yeshiva isn't business school.

You'll ask me so why is it worse than math science...? I'll answer that those don't take away from the goal of a frum person. They're there for various reasons. To give more structure to the day of a child. To make the child sharper. And possibly also to qualify for government funding.

That's just my feelings about it.

ETA: Just to clarify a little. I feel like the math, science... isn't being taught to learn it. It's being taught for the reasons stated above. On the other hand if you're teaching financial literacy it's being taught for itself. Which I think is a problem.

Since when is financial literacy only about business and not about life?


Also, financial literacy provides information to one to be able to live a proper life and includes many topics of doing things in a straight and honest way.  And many topics which should be important to oneself such as tzedakah, not doing illegal activities etc fall under financial literacy as well.    It's an especially important topic in a frum community where we choose to send our kids to private schools even though many can't really afford it.
"Not all who wander are lost"

Offline Menachem613

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Re: Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #18 on: March 05, 2019, 08:30:29 AM »
Looks like a mod needs to split this thread again

Every discussion of Halacha needs to be split off.

Offline ExGingi

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Re: Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #19 on: March 05, 2019, 08:41:19 AM »
You can not learn anything lemaaseh if you don't know metzius.  Math is metzius.  Lot's of halacha depends on a metzius which nowadays is covered by science.   While every community decides for themselves how and to what extent to teach them, to say that knowledge of math and science is the antithesis of being a frum Jew is not just wrong, it is ludicrous.
"Math" as an integral part of Torah is definitely not an antithesis to being a frum Jew. תנאים, אמוראים, ראשונים and אחרונים all knew "math". All you need to do is open up a Chumash with Rashi, Mishnayos and Gemara to see that. The question is whether the knowledge was acquired as part of learning Torah, or as a separate curriculum.

To that end, my SIL developed a curriculum that teaches the "math" in Torah (not sure if it goes to 6th or 8th grade) called הייליקע נומערן. Upon completion of the curriculum students should be able to master math to a level that will allow them to create a Jewish calendar (based on calculations explained by the Rambam in הלכות קידוש החודש).
I've been waiting over 5 years with bated breath for someone to say that!
-- Dan