Poll

Who are you leaning towards?

Likud
5 (17.2%)
Blue and White
0 (0%)
Shas
0 (0%)
Charedi Parties(UTJ Aguda)
15 (51.7%)
Labor
2 (6.9%)
Zeut
1 (3.4%)
Meretz
0 (0%)
Yisroel Bateinu
0 (0%)
New Right (Bennet, Shaked)
1 (3.4%)
Kahane Parties
5 (17.2%)

Total Members Voted: 29

Voting closed: April 09, 2019, 05:19:44 AM

Author Topic: 2019-2021 Israeli Election (See Also: Definition Of Insanity)  (Read 97295 times)

Offline Pad18

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Re: 2019 Israeli election
« Reply #400 on: September 22, 2019, 02:35:20 PM »
Do I think Israeli politicians turn to DDF for suggestions? Absolutely not!

Lol

Offline Dan

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Re: 2019 Israeli election
« Reply #401 on: September 22, 2019, 03:19:38 PM »
Do you actually believe the things you write?
#DDFShockJock
Save your time, I don't answer PM. Post it in the forum and a dedicated DDF'er will get back to you as soon as possible.

Offline Ergel

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Re: 2019 Israeli election
« Reply #402 on: September 22, 2019, 03:48:40 PM »
Life isn't about checking the boxes. Nobody cares.

Offline Dan

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Re: 2019 Israeli election
« Reply #403 on: September 22, 2019, 04:08:00 PM »
https://www.theyeshivaworld.com/news/featured/1788604/significant-development-joint-arab-list-recommends-gantz-to-form-government.html
Amazing they can't even get the facts correct in a simple article like this
Why would this be different than any other article?
Save your time, I don't answer PM. Post it in the forum and a dedicated DDF'er will get back to you as soon as possible.

Offline Dan

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Re: 2019 Israeli election
« Reply #404 on: September 22, 2019, 04:08:44 PM »
they tried that years ago from '96 to '01
Not sure why they changed back
Anyone know why they changed it?
Save your time, I don't answer PM. Post it in the forum and a dedicated DDF'er will get back to you as soon as possible.

Offline gingyguy

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Re: 2019 Israeli election
« Reply #405 on: September 22, 2019, 04:12:34 PM »
https://www.theyeshivaworld.com/news/featured/1788604/significant-development-joint-arab-list-recommends-gantz-to-form-government.html
Amazing they can't even get the facts correct in a simple article like this
lol , Nothing they write amazes me any more
just look at the like count on this post
Friends don't let friends fly spirit.
« Last Edit: September 22, 2019, 04:21:31 PM by gingyguy »
May you slide down the banister of happiness & get many splinters of success up your career.

Online ExGingi

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Re: 2019 Israeli election
« Reply #406 on: September 22, 2019, 06:08:28 PM »
Anyone know why they changed it?

FWIW, per Wikipedia it resulted in a weaker PM as people might have voted for him and not his party.

Quote
חוק הבחירה הישירה הביא למצב בו רבים שקודם לחוק הצביעו למפלגתו של מי שרצו שיהיה ראש הממשלה (אחת המפלגות הגדולות), הצביעו בפתק הצהוב לראש הממשלה ובפתק השני הצביעו למפלגה אחרת ששיקפה יותר את השקפת עולמם או למפלגה שייצגה את המגזר שלהם. תוצאה זו גרמה להחלשת כוחו של ראש הממשלה הנבחר, שמצא את עצמו עומד בראש מפלגה קטנה יחסית. עובדה זו הייתה הגורם העיקרי להחזרת השיטה הקודמת של משטר פרלמנטרי טהור.
I've been waiting over 5 years with bated breath for someone to say that!
-- Dan

Offline Dan

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Re: 2019 Israeli election
« Reply #407 on: September 22, 2019, 06:16:13 PM »
FWIW, per Wikipedia it resulted in a weaker PM as people might have voted for him and not his party.

Perhaps, but it seems like a way out of this mess.
A unity government would be more feasible if PM was off the table.
Save your time, I don't answer PM. Post it in the forum and a dedicated DDF'er will get back to you as soon as possible.

Online ExGingi

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Re: 2019 Israeli election
« Reply #408 on: September 22, 2019, 06:40:56 PM »
Perhaps, but it seems like a way out of this mess.
A unity government would be more feasible if PM was off the table.
That seems logical, and was the reason for the initial enactment.

However, no system is perfect, and the pendulum swings.

The other problem is that deep down, people know that there is no 'solution' to the conflict with the "Palestinians", or with the Jihadists (of various flavors). So the geopolitical options range from a delusional (but rooted in aspirations) attitude of unilateral concessions and withdrawals (an interesting video of what might have been the last meeting between Shimon Peres and R' Ovadia Yosef, with the former trying to convince the latter to support one of his delusional solutions, has recently surfaced), through the pragmatic and long horizon approach of Netanyahu of managing the situation locally, while getting regional focus away from the "Palestinians", or better yet rejecting their issue as a pan-Arabian one, to the extreme Zionist attitude of forcefully crushing any "Palestinian" aspirations.

This has just brought about the so-called "center left" B&W party, that doesn't really offer much of an alternative to Netanyahu's methods (though with less experience and talent). They have folded into their ranks some people who are proposing slightly different geopolitical approaches, but once reality hits, they will be no different (other than likely not being able to withstand major pressure from outside).

There hasn't been one poll in which Netanyahu hasn't trounced Gantz (or anyone else) in being seen fit to lead the country.

Lieberman did identify the one issue that ostensibly does highlight differences of approach, which is the anti religious establishment and laws vs pro such laws. Unfortunately, I think UTJ and Shas didn't use a correct strategy in this area. While they did energize their base, I think they should have put a lot more effort in reaching out to people outside of their base, who wouldn't vote for them, but try to get them to reject the Lieberman/Lapid approach.

The bottom line is, that we can write and suggest whatever we want, but:

Do I think Israeli politicians turn to DDF for suggestions? Absolutely not!

All I do here is report things as I see them and offer my analysis and/or point of view. Some like to call that
#DDFShockJock

« Last Edit: September 22, 2019, 08:01:51 PM by ExGingi »
I've been waiting over 5 years with bated breath for someone to say that!
-- Dan

Online ExGingi

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Re: 2019 Israeli election
« Reply #409 on: September 22, 2019, 07:59:38 PM »
Rivlin and Netanyahu are old foes. No one suspects Rivlin of any favoritism towards Netanyahu. As a matter of fact, while in the Knesset he was considered a right wing hawk. As soon as he became president, he began pandering to the left wing.

https://www.israelhayom.co.il/article/694195

Notice the last paragraph, they don't mince words as to how they see the Rivlin Netanyahu relationship.

Quote
לא מן הנמנע כי נשיא המדינה, המונע מתאוות נקם בראש הממשלה, ישקול מהו המעשה שהכי יפגע בנתניהו, להיות ראשון או שני, ועל פי זה יקבל את החלטתו. הנימוקים לכל החלטה הרי כבר ידועים מראש.
I've been waiting over 5 years with bated breath for someone to say that!
-- Dan

Offline Ergel

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Re: 2019 Israeli election
« Reply #410 on: September 23, 2019, 01:46:10 AM »
https://www.timesofisrael.com/after-withholding-nomination-for-pm-liberman-to-meet-gantz/
Lieberman says they should flip a coin. Craziest thing is he's right

And this
“The Joint List are our enemies,” said Liberman. “Wherever they are, we will be on the other side.”
He's actually talking sense. What's going on?
Life isn't about checking the boxes. Nobody cares.

Offline Dan

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Re: 2019 Israeli election
« Reply #411 on: September 23, 2019, 01:50:30 AM »
https://www.timesofisrael.com/after-withholding-nomination-for-pm-liberman-to-meet-gantz/
Lieberman says they should flip a coin. Craziest thing is he's right

And this
“The Joint List are our enemies,” said Liberman. “Wherever they are, we will be on the other side.”
He's actually talking sense. What's going on?
Why does a B&W/Likud government need Liberman?
Save your time, I don't answer PM. Post it in the forum and a dedicated DDF'er will get back to you as soon as possible.

Offline Ergel

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Re: 2019 Israeli election
« Reply #412 on: September 23, 2019, 02:39:13 AM »
It doesn't, though larger coalitions are usually stronger (operative word being usually, don't think it applies here)
Would be really funny if they offer him nothing and he's still forced to join the coalition to avoid looking like a bigger fool
Life isn't about checking the boxes. Nobody cares.

Online ExGingi

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Re: 2019 Israeli election
« Reply #413 on: September 23, 2019, 06:16:17 AM »
https://www.israelhayom.co.il/article/694277

Netanyahu gets 55 MK recommending vs Gantz 54. This gives Rivlin the OK to throw the hot potato at Netanyahu first.
I've been waiting over 5 years with bated breath for someone to say that!
-- Dan

Offline Boruch Parnes

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Re: 2019 Israeli election
« Reply #414 on: September 23, 2019, 07:16:34 AM »
https://www.israelhayom.co.il/article/694277

Netanyahu gets 55 MK recommending vs Gantz 54. This gives Rivlin the OK to throw the hot potato at Netanyahu first.
Lets see if he can pull it off or #NewElections  cant see him giving up and giving Gantz a turn to try

Online ExGingi

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Re: 2019 Israeli election
« Reply #415 on: September 23, 2019, 07:25:53 AM »
Lets see if he can pull it off or #NewElections  cant see him giving up and giving Gantz a turn to try

IMHO the key is waiting until after the AG hearing, and coming out without an indictment.
I've been waiting over 5 years with bated breath for someone to say that!
-- Dan

Offline Boruch Parnes

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Re: 2019 Israeli election
« Reply #416 on: September 23, 2019, 07:28:03 AM »
IMHO the key is waiting until after the AG hearing, and coming out without an indictment.
Bibi is scared of an indictment  if he wouldnt be scared he wouldnt push off the hearing

Online ExGingi

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Re: 2019 Israeli election
« Reply #417 on: September 23, 2019, 07:36:59 AM »
Bibi is scared of an indictment  if he wouldnt be scared he wouldnt push off the hearing
-1
I've been waiting over 5 years with bated breath for someone to say that!
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Offline Ergel

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Re: 2019 Israeli election
« Reply #418 on: September 23, 2019, 07:41:27 AM »
IMHO the key is waiting until after the AG hearing, and coming out without an indictment.
The odds of there not being an indictment are infinitesimally small. Not sure why you think that's a likely outcome.



Quote
“If you task Gantz with forming the government, we will not negotiate with him,” Shaked said. “We are committed to the head of the national camp, Prime Minister Netanyahu.

“I do want to tell you, Mr. President, that you may need to act like a kindergarten teacher and tell the other party leaders to stop the boycotts,” she added. “There are ideological boycotts and there are also personal boycotts. And it needs to stop, both the personal and the ideological boycotts, and to try and get to some form of unity government.
Do you think she realized how hypocritical that is?
Life isn't about checking the boxes. Nobody cares.

Offline Yonah

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Re: 2019 Israeli election
« Reply #419 on: September 23, 2019, 09:42:48 AM »
Perhaps, but it seems like a way out of this mess.
A unity government would be more feasible if PM was off the table.

You'd think that. But imagine you are the leader of the Party with the most seats and you lost the direct prime minister election. That would be a huge disincentive to work with the PM to form a unity coalition.

IIRC, prior to the experiment of the directly elected prime minister, Likud Labor would regularly get Mandates into the 40's  - because back then people felt voting for a party was essentially a proxy for voting for prime minister. Then after/during the direct election, people realized that it was probably just better to vote for the party that aligns with their political interests, and hope that they'll back the correct candidate for PM