Author Topic: Over The Top Purim Parties  (Read 37965 times)

Offline Naftuli19

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Re: Over The Top Purim Parties
« Reply #180 on: March 26, 2019, 02:33:46 PM »
DUI is the issue, not general driving.
Similarly, problematic parties are the issue, not general parties with family and friends.
so problematic party's is ur issue not that rich people are making party's ???
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Offline Shkop

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Re: Over The Top Purim Parties
« Reply #181 on: March 26, 2019, 02:34:18 PM »
That is exactly the point. A wealthy person spending a lot on an extravagant party is not the issue at all.

Good point. But the article was not about wealthy people living lavishly. I bet you never read the letter, or have comprehension issues.
For example, it said this:
At a different Shul party, Hatzolah had to be there so many times it is not possible to count. One kid after the next was carried out, as children of all ages managed to get toasted on all types of hard liquor.
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Offline ExGingi

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Re: Over The Top Purim Parties
« Reply #182 on: March 26, 2019, 02:34:43 PM »
More than keeping mum.

But as @Dan so eloquently pointed out way upthread, when various issues are conflated, there's actually no message that comes across coherently. One needs to decide what the real issue is, and coherently focus on that. So the "more" that you are writing about is actually a case of "more is less".
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Offline Shkop

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Re: Over The Top Purim Parties
« Reply #183 on: March 26, 2019, 02:36:45 PM »
so problematic party's is ur issue not that rich people are making party's ???
By the way, one of my issues is people jumping into conversations without reading the thread. You have no idea what my position is, but that does not stop you from arguing against it.
A democracy is a form of government, not an intrinsic truth

Offline Shkop

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Re: Over The Top Purim Parties
« Reply #184 on: March 26, 2019, 02:43:20 PM »
Of all the million discussions why did you choose this one?

Just curios, you've been here a while and you're only speaking up now and on this particular subject.
Because I found it interesting. I took a position which I still stand by and am happy to defend it.
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Offline mmgfarb

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Re: Over The Top Purim Parties
« Reply #185 on: March 26, 2019, 02:44:06 PM »
This thread has dissolved into "he said, she said" and bickering about stupidities and for that reason, I'm out.
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Offline stooges44

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Re: Over The Top Purim Parties
« Reply #186 on: March 26, 2019, 02:48:39 PM »
This thread has dissolved into "he said, she said" and bickering about stupidities and for that reason, I'm out.

You sound like the guys on shark tank
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Offline yitzgar

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Re: Over The Top Purim Parties
« Reply #187 on: March 26, 2019, 02:48:56 PM »
Good point. But the article was not about wealthy people living lavishly. I bet you never read the letter, or have comprehension issues.
For example, it said this:
At a different Shul party, Hatzolah had to be there so many times it is not possible to count. One kid after the next was carried out, as children of all ages managed to get toasted on all types of hard liquor.
I read the article, and I don't think I have comprehension issues, thanks for your concern. The article gave a clear negative connotation towards the wealthy party makers for making parties and towards Rabbonim for not banning, not towards the drunken kids. It was as though the gvirim and rabbonim were at fault for irresponsible teenagers, which I think pretty much everyone on this thread doesn't agree with. i think these points have been made enough times on this thread, so I wish you luck with your campaign.

Offline Shkop

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Re: Over The Top Purim Parties
« Reply #188 on: March 26, 2019, 02:49:34 PM »
This thread has dissolved into "he said, she said" and bickering about stupidities and for that reason, I'm out.
Sounds like Shark Tank. Enjoy.
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Re: Over The Top Purim Parties
« Reply #189 on: March 26, 2019, 02:49:54 PM »
More than keeping mum.

More of what?
I took a position which I still stand by and am happy to defend it.

I think half the issue is that you don't even know what you are trying to accomplish or how what you are advocating would accomplish anything.

Why would a Rov or Rosh Yeshiva or anyone write an open letter sure to embarrass someone when it has no clear and meaningful purpose? How would that even be mutar to be mivayesh someone birabim like that?
Feelings don't care about your facts

Offline Shkop

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Re: Over The Top Purim Parties
« Reply #190 on: March 26, 2019, 03:01:34 PM »
I read the article, and I don't think I have comprehension issues, thanks for your concern. The article gave a clear negative connotation towards the wealthy party makers for making parties and towards Rabbonim for not banning, not towards the drunken kids. It was as though the gvirim and rabbonim were at fault for irresponsible teenagers, which I think pretty much everyone on this thread doesn't agree with. i think these points have been made enough times on this thread, so I wish you luck with your campaign.
Actually, the article wasn't a clear negative connotation towards wealthy party makers in general. It pinpointed specific issues, like lavish over the top parties that result in Hatzaloh being called in, inappropriate mingling, smashing windows of homes, marijuana, and more. And yes, it was as though certain wealthy people are at fault for irresponsible teenagers assuming they are the ones creating the problem in the first place. 

I'm happy to continue arguing my position as long as you present yours.
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Offline Shkop

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Re: Over The Top Purim Parties
« Reply #191 on: March 26, 2019, 03:10:24 PM »
More of what?I think half the issue is that you don't even know what you are trying to accomplish or how what you are advocating would accomplish anything.

Why would a Rov or Rosh Yeshiva or anyone write an open letter sure to embarrass someone when it has no clear and meaningful purpose? How would that even be mutar to be mivayesh someone birabim like that?

I am not trying to accomplish anything. I am just presenting my view.

Your second question is a new one. It's interesting that you point it out here because this forum is full of people bringing up issues of all kinds, as do many periodicals and websites. It's a general question that applies to thousands of letters and articles and blog pieces. I bet that some of them are assur and some aren't.
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Re: Over The Top Purim Parties
« Reply #192 on: March 26, 2019, 03:32:16 PM »
I am not trying to accomplish anything. I am just presenting my view.

Your second question is a new one. It's interesting that you point it out here because this forum is full of people bringing up issues of all kinds, as do many periodicals and websites. It's a general question that applies to thousands of letters and articles and blog pieces. I bet that some of them are assur and some aren't.
I would expect rabbonim to care about that before writing an open letter.
Feelings don't care about your facts

Offline Shkop

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Re: Over The Top Purim Parties
« Reply #193 on: March 26, 2019, 03:42:13 PM »
I would expect rabbonim to care about that before writing an open letter.

Where did you get that rabbonim wrote that open letter? Maybe it was by a non-rabbinic individual.
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Offline doodle

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Re: Over The Top Purim Parties
« Reply #194 on: March 26, 2019, 03:58:32 PM »
What do you expect the open letter and awareness to accomplish?
Is this the standard you use ??
 Is this the standard most Rabbinical letters are held to ??
This is a way more important issue than most of the nonsense people get inundated with
On a daily basis .
You know this as well ! What is your agenda?
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Offline sguitarist18

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Re: Over The Top Purim Parties
« Reply #195 on: March 26, 2019, 03:58:58 PM »
One more point - the letter/article does not deign to mention any names or actually call anyone out, but it wants OTHER people do so.

#hypocrite?

Offline doodle

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Re: Over The Top Purim Parties
« Reply #196 on: March 26, 2019, 04:00:52 PM »
One more point - the letter/article does not deign to mention any names or actually call anyone out, but it wants OTHER people do so.

#hypocrite?
No it does not . Read it slowly and carefully.
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Offline churnbabychurn

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Re: Over The Top Purim Parties
« Reply #197 on: March 26, 2019, 04:27:13 PM »
One more point - the letter/article does not deign to mention any names or actually call anyone out, but it wants OTHER people do so.

#hypocrite?
He does call out Rabbis

Offline sguitarist18

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Re: Over The Top Purim Parties
« Reply #198 on: March 26, 2019, 04:32:43 PM »
No it does not . Read it slowly and carefully.

I did. Here are some sample quotes:

Quote
and not a word from the Rabbonim...The Roshei Yeshiva and Rabbonim should ban every one of these parties.

Translation: I'm not going to actually call anyone out, that seems a bit risky for my own taste, I'm going to write an anonymous letter. But I would like all rabbanim to take a public stance against all the things I think are wrong with the world.

An added note - he's basically disrespecting all daas torah, despite the fact that there may be many rabbanim who do make statements to their kehillah about what they should or should not be doing. But because it's not loud enough for this letter-writer, he saying that "all rabbanim" (a heterogeneous group, as we all know) are culpable.

He does call out Rabbis

LOL. How about calling out specific people making parties that horrify him so?

Offline doodle

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Re: Over The Top Purim Parties
« Reply #199 on: March 26, 2019, 04:43:17 PM »
I did. Here are some sample quotes:

Translation: I'm not going to actually call anyone out, that seems a bit risky for my own taste, I'm going to write an anonymous letter. But I would like all rabbanim to take a public stance against all the things I think are wrong with the world.

An added note - he's basically disrespecting all daas torah, despite the fact that there may be many rabbanim who do make statements to their kehillah about what they should or should not be doing. But because it's not loud enough for this letter-writer, he saying that "all rabbanim" (a heterogeneous group, as we all know) are culpable.

LOL. How about calling out specific people making parties that horrify him so?
He is asking the Rabbonim to get involved.
That’s the right way to do it . Why are you bashing the Shliach/messenger??
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