PC friday question of the day.

[zh cohen]

SPOILER ALERT
And for the record Jesus Christ is the Jewish messiah who is prophesied in the Hebrew Bible. 

While I appreciate a good troll, it is extremely disrespectful to co-opt (read - steal) the Jewish Bible and claim that you know better than the Jews what it means.

If you want to say that you have a Bible that is similar to the Jewish Bible that means what you say it means that is a different story but the claim you posted is just flat out wrong.

[zh cohen]

Um, not really.
https://www.catholicculture.org/culture/library/view.cfm?recnum=1340
“Our Catholic teaching that the Eucharist is the Body and Blood of Jesus, not bread and wine, is clearly taught in the Bible and throughout the 2,000-year tradition of the Church“

That’s why other branches of Christianity call Catholics idol worshipers.

Not such a great idea to argue with a Catholic about what he believes...

[yerushabubby]

That would be impossible. There are so many religions with different beliefs. You believe what your religion teaches you and I and others believe what our religions teach us.

True.  That is why I stated that it needs to be taken into account, to some extent, not that the laws should be according to any religion.

Example - during prohibition, the law took into account religious uses of wine, while regular wine sales and use were outlawed.  The law was not according to our religious beliefs, but did take them into account.

[CountValentine]

While I appreciate a good troll, it is extremely disrespectful to co-opt (read - steal) the Jewish Bible and claim that you know better than the Jews what it means.

If you want to say that you have a Bible that is similar to the Jewish Bible that means what you say it means that is a different story but the claim you posted is just flat out wrong.

Ouch!!! The Holy Bible consists of the Old Testament and New Testament. You have no more right than I do to claim what is in either.

Now the spoiler alert is a core belief for my religion. I would take @AsherO advice.

[CountValentine]

Example - during prohibition, the law took into account religious uses of wine, while regular wine sales and use were outlawed.  The law was not according to our religious beliefs, but did take them into account.

What if one religion beliefs was that alcohol was a sin? Should they take that religions belief into account? This would never end.

[yerushabubby]

That was taken into account - outlawing regular wine use.  The whole prohibition movement was started by those who had a religious objection to alcohol, and it snowballed from there.

When religions are in total conflict over certain issues, taking them into account is difficult, but under normal circumstances it can be done.

[EliJelly]

What if one religion beliefs was that alcohol was a sin? Should they take that religions belief into account? This would never end.

Take into account by? Not forcing them to buy alcohol?

[CountValentine]

Take into account by? Not forcing them to buy alcohol?

Should they take into account religious beliefs when deciding if homosexual acts are illegal? The are not forcing them to engage in these acts.
The point is you are going to offend some religion with just about every law. You have to separate the two.

[Yo ssi]

This discussion reminds me of a fascinating lecture / article
https://www.simpletoremember.com/articles/a/proof-torah-true/

(Pays to hear it, if you've got the time)

[yzj]

@yzj  I recommend you stay away from the Pandora’s box you’re opening. This might not be the best place for you to debate the Count’s theology with him...

True. I couldn’t resist that line about Jews being embarrassed to express the idea that homosexuals are supposed to face the death penalty coming from a religion that believes that some bread and wine are actually flesh and blood, but this isn’t the place for a theological debate.

[EliJelly]

Should they take into account religious beliefs when deciding if homosexual acts are illegal? The are not forcing them to engage in these acts.
The point is you are going to offend some religion with just about every law. You have to separate the two.

You certainly did not understand what @yerushabubby was saying here;

True.  That is why I stated that it needs to be taken into account, to some extent, not that the laws should be according to any religion.

Example - during prohibition, the law took into account religious uses of wine, while regular wine sales and use were outlawed.  The law was not according to our religious beliefs, but did take them into account.

[CountValentine]

You certainly did not understand what @yerushabubby was saying here;

Saying laws should not be according to any religion but should take them into account means the religion will influence what the law will be.

[CountValentine]

True. I couldn’t resist that line about Jews being embarrassed to express the idea that homosexuals are supposed to face the death penalty coming from a religion that believes that some bread and wine are actually flesh and blood, but this isn’t the place for a theological debate.

I guess you feel there is no different to a belief that doesn't hurt anyone and one that is murder.

I try my best to not try not to offend ones religion but it seems I fail sometimes.

[zh cohen]

Ouch!!! The Holy Bible consists of the Old Testament and New Testament.

You said Hebrew Bible and Jewish Messiah. Just like you do not appreciate Jews telling you what Catholic teachings mean, don't tell us what Jewish teachings mean.

Ouch!!! The Holy Bible consists of the Old Testament and New Testament.

The "Old Testament" is not the same as the Jewish Bible. It is very similar, but has several differences that change the meaning significantly.

[yerushabubby]

Saying laws should not be according to any religion but should take them into account means the religion will influence what the law will be.

Since most people do subscribe to, or at least are influenced by religion, it will always influence what the law will be.  Separation of church and state is also allowing religion (or lack thereof)to influence how laws are made.  It is unavoidable, so the best we can do is to take religion into account in order to keep the law from making it difficult to act according to one's religious beliefs (as much as possible).

[CountValentine]

Since most people do subscribe to, or at least are influenced by religion, it will always influence what the law will be.  Separation of church and state is also allowing religion (or lack thereof)to influence how laws are made.  It is unavoidable, so the best we can do is to take religion into account in order to keep the law from making it difficult to act according to one's religious beliefs (as much as possible).

I just feel you should keep religion out of the equation as much as humanly possible.

[JlmBoi]

I just feel you should keep religion out of the equation as much as humanly possible.

Seems to be the best way to go. When views are so polarized someone's toes will always be stepped on.

[yerushabubby]

Since most people do subscribe to, or at least are influenced by religion, it will always influence what the law will be.  Separation of church and state is also allowing religion (or lack thereof)to influence how laws are made.  It is unavoidable, so the best we can do is to take religion into account in order to keep the law from making it difficult to act according to one's religious beliefs (as much as possible).

I just feel you should keep religion out of the equation as much as humanly possible.

That is also allowing religion to influence the laws.  Since most people's views on morality and justice are heavily influenced by religion - even for those with no religious background, it is impossible to deny the fact that most laws are based on religious norms in some way - there is no way to keep it out of the equation.

[CountValentine]

You said Hebrew Bible and Jewish Messiah. Just like you do not appreciate Jews telling you what Catholic teachings mean, don't tell us what Jewish teachings mean.

The spoiler alert was a joke but you are correct I should have not used the words "Hebrew & Messiah".

[CountValentine]

That is also allowing religion to influence the laws.  Since most people's views on morality and justice are heavily influenced by religion - even for those with no religious background, it is impossible to deny the fact that most laws are based on religious norms in some way - there is no way to keep it out of the equation.

What about abortion? I would say religion has been kept out of that equation.