Author Topic: Israel's good friend Obama...  (Read 122679 times)

Offline CZ60

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Re: Israel's good friend Obama...
« Reply #220 on: December 26, 2016, 01:01:27 PM »
Maybe it is because I look at the UN as a joke.

Its all fun and games until someone gets hurt...

Offline JTZ

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Re: Israel's good friend Obama...
« Reply #221 on: December 26, 2016, 01:06:59 PM »
Its all fun and games until someone gets hurt...
It case you haven't seen some of my comments over the years Israel is the one who decides their own faith in these situations. Not the US or the UN. To many believe because you take an opposing view on a single item that makes you anti something.
"LESS IS MORE" It is the cumulative effect that kills deals!!! How many times do I have to say this?  >:(

Online AsherO

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Re: Israel's good friend Obama...
« Reply #222 on: December 26, 2016, 01:11:56 PM »
Just Liberalism and a big ego.

Aren't those two the same thing? :D



If Obama's actions will hinder the piece (sic) process, then why is everyone here who's against that process so up in arms?
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Offline aygart

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Re: Israel's good friend Obama...
« Reply #223 on: December 26, 2016, 01:14:45 PM »
Maybe it is because I look at the UN as a joke.
The one and only time there is influence is when it is against Israel. Then all the murderous dictators complain that a civilian may have been killed when they bombed a weapons cache.
Feelings don't care about your facts

Offline Sammy82

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Re: Israel's good friend Obama...
« Reply #224 on: December 26, 2016, 02:26:58 PM »
Reminds me of this one from a few years ago

Offline JTZ

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Re: Israel's good friend Obama...
« Reply #225 on: December 26, 2016, 02:34:35 PM »
That was some painful singing.  :)
"LESS IS MORE" It is the cumulative effect that kills deals!!! How many times do I have to say this?  >:(

Offline zh cohen

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Re: Israel's good friend Obama...
« Reply #226 on: December 26, 2016, 02:50:39 PM »

If Obama's actions will hinder the piece (sic) process, then why is everyone here who's against that process so up in arms?

No one is against peace (except Hamas). People are against the idea that Israel should give away land for peace.

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Re: Israel's good friend Obama...
« Reply #227 on: December 26, 2016, 03:47:07 PM »
No one is against peace (except Hamas). People are against the idea that Israel should give away land for peace.

When did I say anyone is against peace?

I referred to the process, which historically has been land for "piece" (more precisely, land for nothing). And in case the reader wouldn't get it, I preferred to it as the piece process. And in case the reader thought I misspelled peace, I added (sic).

With that in mind, please go back, reread my post, and feel free to add what you'd like :D

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Offline Yehuda57

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Re: Israel's good friend Obama...
« Reply #228 on: December 26, 2016, 04:08:53 PM »
When did I say anyone is against peace?

I referred to the process, which historically has been land for "piece" (more precisely, land for nothing). And in case the reader wouldn't get it, I preferred to it as the piece process. And in case the reader thought I misspelled peace, I added (sic).

With that in mind, please go back, reread my post, and feel free to add what you'd like :D

I actually think that this might have a positive outcome if it makes negotiations a non-starter.

However, this resolution may have more far reaching effects than just negotiations. For instance, is it now the policy of the Democratic Party that the Jews have no rights to the Kosel? If you don't believe it far fetched to have IDF soldiers and Israeli politicians to be arrested for war crimes for simply guarding Jerusalem, this resolution helps redefine the parameters of those laws.

Bibi is clearly using this for local political gains, so it is very possible this is a huge over-reaction based on him blowing it out of proportion. Or it is a really bad indicator of US support for Israel, which has larger ramifications than land for peace negotiations.

Either way, the topic of this thread is not necessarily the resolution itself, but Obama's attitude toward Israel. I think it is more than fair to call it downright hostile with this resolution, and not just "liberal."

Offline JTZ

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Re: Israel's good friend Obama...
« Reply #229 on: December 26, 2016, 04:18:01 PM »
There seems to be two different issues here. The peace process and US support for Israel. The US has always supported Israel and that will not change. Is there any other country that stands up for Israel as much as the US does?
"LESS IS MORE" It is the cumulative effect that kills deals!!! How many times do I have to say this?  >:(

Offline churnbabychurn

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Re: Israel's good friend Obama...
« Reply #230 on: December 26, 2016, 04:46:56 PM »
There seems to be two different issues here. The peace process and US support for Israel. The US has always supported Israel and that will not change. Is there any other country that stands up for Israel as much as the US does?
Well, they didn't here. And they probably wouldn't much going forward if it was up to Bo.

Offline Yehuda57

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Re: Israel's good friend Obama...
« Reply #231 on: December 26, 2016, 04:58:08 PM »
There seems to be two different issues here. The peace process and US support for Israel. The US has always supported Israel and that will not change. Is there any other country that stands up for Israel as much as the US does?
It *did* change

Offline zh cohen

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Re: Israel's good friend Obama...
« Reply #232 on: December 26, 2016, 05:18:10 PM »
When did I say anyone is against peace?

I referred to the process, which historically has been land for "piece" (more precisely, land for nothing). And in case the reader wouldn't get it, I preferred to it as the piece process. And in case the reader thought I misspelled peace, I added (sic).

With that in mind, please go back, reread my post, and feel free to add what you'd like :D

If it disrupts the "peace process" I believe that is a good thing.

The problem is that together with that it makes peace less likely because it emboldens the Arabs, by allow IMG them to think that if they continue with their terror, they will eventually get whatever they want.

Also, being that it is so clear that this will not further the "peace process" many assume that that is not Obama's objective.

Offline Yammer

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Re: Israel's good friend Obama...
« Reply #233 on: December 26, 2016, 05:44:24 PM »
It also makes no sense to attack BO so vehemently. They can pass more resolutions still. Once these resolutions get passed it will be impossible to reverse them.
Unless



Bibi believes that coming out so strong against Obama will create pressure on Obama not to continue down this path, from both sides of the isle. ( If he's correct is something else..)


Offline PlatinumGuy

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Re: Israel's good friend Obama...
« Reply #234 on: December 26, 2016, 05:52:56 PM »
Now that annexation is on the table I think the right wingers (particularly ideologically zionist) are going to start realizing it's much worse.

Did Israel ever suggest a viable long term arrangement?
״וזה כלל גדול: שישנא אדם כל דבר שקר. וכל מה שיוסיף שנאה לדרכי השקר – יוסיף אהבה לתורה.״ - אורחות צדיקים

Offline zh cohen

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Re: Israel's good friend Obama...
« Reply #235 on: December 26, 2016, 06:05:21 PM »
https://mobile.twitter.com/IsraeliPM/status/774212345463791616/video/1

I'd honestly like to here a response to this from a (left wing) two state solution supporter.

(The reason I'm asking for a left wing perspective is because I think the right wing supporter does not believe the Palestinians deserve a state, they just think this is the only way to stop them from killing Jews.)

Offline JTZ

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Re: Israel's good friend Obama...
« Reply #236 on: December 27, 2016, 12:25:44 AM »
This is why Bibi should take a break from his attacks on BO.

Israel’s government is now turning its attention to a conference planned for Jan. 15 in Paris, concerned the international community could seek to impose a resolution to the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. According to a senior Israeli official, who spoke on condition of anonymity because the issue is sensitive, the government fears foreign ministers in Paris will draft parameters Israel considers unfavorable, and will seek to impose them through the Security Council before Obama leaves office five days later.
"LESS IS MORE" It is the cumulative effect that kills deals!!! How many times do I have to say this?  >:(

Offline Yehuda57

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Re: Israel's good friend Obama...
« Reply #237 on: December 27, 2016, 12:35:46 AM »
This is why Bibi should take a break from his attacks on BO.

Israel’s government is now turning its attention to a conference planned for Jan. 15 in Paris, concerned the international community could seek to impose a resolution to the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. According to a senior Israeli official, who spoke on condition of anonymity because the issue is sensitive, the government fears foreign ministers in Paris will draft parameters Israel considers unfavorable, and will seek to impose them through the Security Council before Obama leaves office five days later.
Maybe he knew that was the plan all along? Kerry already said publicly they would use the security council. It's not like this resolution was a surprise attack.

I think it's fair to say Bibi is not the bumbling politician you make him out to be, even if you disagree with his opinions.

Offline JTZ

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Re: Israel's good friend Obama...
« Reply #238 on: December 27, 2016, 12:43:53 AM »
Maybe he knew that was the plan all along? Kerry already said publicly they would use the security council. It's not like this resolution was a surprise attack.

I think it's fair to say Bibi is not the bumbling politician you make him out to be, even if you disagree with his opinions.
They should have know back with the 2011 veto vote that this resolution was a strong possibility. How times were they warned to stop the settlements? I am not playing sides here just agreeing that this was no big surprise they are making it out to be.

I have no idea what type of politician Bibi. What I do know it is a big mistake to keep attacking BO when he can do so much more. Tone it down and wait for the new guy.
"LESS IS MORE" It is the cumulative effect that kills deals!!! How many times do I have to say this?  >:(

Offline Yehuda57

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Re: Israel's good friend Obama...
« Reply #239 on: December 27, 2016, 12:47:42 AM »
They should have know back with the 2011 veto vote that this resolution was a strong possibility. How times were they warned to stop the settlements? I am not playing sides here just agreeing that this was no big surprise they are making it out to be.

I have no idea what type of politician Bibi. What I do know it is a big mistake to keep attacking BO when he can do so much more. Tone it down and wait for the new guy.
Or maybe he knows that BO is gonna do whatever he is going to do, and won't go down without a fight?

I don't know that he's right, I'm just saying it's not as simple as you make it