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Q: Hi, I searched all over the internet for an active link of the Chase American Airlines credit card and couldn't find one. How did you guys manage to get this card?
A: Ha ha... There's (currently) no co-branded Chase AA credit card, this thread is discussing 'Chase Adverse Action'. As a general rule, AA refers to 'American Airlines', while A/A refers to 'Adverse Action'.

Q: What does Chase A/A look like? Can I do something to prevent that from happening? And once I'm hit, is there anything I can do to get back in the game?
A: To better address all the questions and concerns, we'll divide it in three sections:

1) What Are The Triggers?
2) What Happens?
3) How To Get Back

What Are The Triggers?

Basically, there are two possibilities that might trigger a Chase A/A:
Credit Related Risk
-Opening too many new cards in a short period of time, (even from other banks, and even being added as an additional user is considered as opening a new account, even a spike in your total CL even from being  additional user has been a trigger for many people - Dec 2013);
-A sudden excessive use of your cards;
-Maxing out your available credit limit.
-Buying large amounts of Chase GC (most people didn't have problems but lately some people are getting shut down for this).
Of course, there is no general rule with these things, it mostly varies by your particular credit file and worthiness.

Perk Abuse
-Transferring Ultimate Rewards points to someone else's account other than your spouse or domestic partner;
 both, the sender and the recipient, are at risk of A/A.
-Abuse of the 5% cashback bonus on the AARP card.

What Happens?

Q: What does a Chase A/A look like? How do I know whether I was shut down or not?
A: If you can't access your online account on chase.com, this is not A/A.
    When you encounter such a thing it could be because 1) the website is undergoing maintenance - wait till the site is back up; 2) a sever error - try using
    different browser
; 3) you didn't log in to your account for a while - call the number on the back of your card; 4) a security concern (resulted by a large QuickPay
    transfer or similar - call the number on the back of your card.
    When you get hit by A/A, you'll see a message above your account "Your account is closed and no longer available for use. If you have a balance remaining on the account, please continue to
    make monthly payments by the due date."; your card will no longer work; and within 7 days you'll receive a letter in the mail notifying you of the closure and the reason to it.
Q: Do they close down all my cards or just one?
A: If your shutdown was a result of 'credit related risk', they usually close all your credit card accounts, while with 'perk abusers' they used to shut down all of your cards (April '12), but lately, it is limited to the accounts involved in the abuse.
Q: Do they shut down other accounts such as checking, savings or investment accounts?
A: Lately people are reporting getting their checking account closed when getting A/A'd.
Q: Once my card is closed, can I still access my points?
A: Again there's a difference whats the reason your account was closed. Ironically, if its because of 'credit risk', your points will be forfeited, (and that used to be the case with 'perk abusers' during the April '12 A/A wave), but if its because of 'perk abuse', you'll get a certain amount of time (from 2 to 90 days - as specified on your letter) to transfer or redeem your points.

How To Get Back

Q: Once one was shut down, is there any point of calling  customer service or any other department and try to convince them to reopen the closed accounts?
A: If your account was closed due to 'perk abuse' there is -almost- no way to convince them to reopen it (unless there was an error, and you really didn't commit any violations of the
     terms and conditions).
     But if your account was closed for credit related reasons, you might have luck by calling the executive dept. 1888-622-7547 and trying to explain them why it might've looked like your at risk of default, but in fact, there is nothing to worry about. But of course YMMV with this.
Q: Can I apply for a new credit card after my accounts were closed?
A: Yes. There are a multiple reports of people being approved for a new Chase card after waiting a few months and applying again. But some were not that lucky, and some had their new accounts closed a few days after approval.
« Last edited by Iz on March 22, 2017, 11:26:51 PM »

Poll

Have You Been A/A'ed?

Yes, I've Been Shut Down And Received 1 Cent Per Point :(
10 (1.6%)
Yes, I've Been Shut Down And Received Nothing For My Points >:(
62 (10%)
No (Bli Ayin Horah)
455 (73.4%)
I Was Shut Down But Was Able To Get Reopened After Appeal
24 (3.9%)
Yes, I've Been Shut Down But Was Able To Transfer Points To Miles
69 (11.1%)

Total Members Voted: 618

Author Topic: Chase A/A Master Thread (Now With Poll)  (Read 1687106 times)

Offline HelpMe

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Re: Chase A/A Master Thread (Now With Poll)
« Reply #400 on: March 14, 2012, 04:55:10 PM »
The risk models and scoring systems they use are probably so complex that I doubt even their own managers could explain if these two factors alone could cause closure. They probably have a system that does indeed look at dozens of data relationships that may even include merchant-type purchase behavior in a variance risk scoring system. Although no one would ever be able to prove a definitive link between having too much credit vs stated income, it still would seem to make more sense to consider it a factor than not. How would the issuer be at an advantage to not consider this relationship into their analysis? Banks probably have some of the most sophisticated protocols used next to terrorism analysis with the CIA.
..but the evidence suggests there is no link. Where are all the account closures from members that have done AOR’s for the past ten years? Some have 10X there stated income in total CL’s. We should see hundreds if not thousands of post in this regard. Look at the AARP card. When Chase takes action you see many reports right away. Please point me to all these account closures by Chase due to CL’s greater than stated income.   
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Re: Chase A/A Master Thread (Now With Poll)
« Reply #401 on: March 14, 2012, 05:05:58 PM »
If it was just due to 3bms and total credit lines exceeding income I'd have been shut down many years ago already...
Thousands would be right with you. Hopefully this will put an end to the notion accounts are getting shut down due to CL’s greater than stated income.
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Re: Chase A/A Master Thread (Now With Poll)
« Reply #402 on: March 14, 2012, 05:07:31 PM »
I'm not going to say it's not a factor, but it's definitely not the only factor.
Same goes for F/R, I think it takes many different factors until they decide to F/R or A/A you.
Save your time, I don't answer PM. Post it in the forum and a dedicated DDF'er will get back to you as soon as possible.

Offline Drago

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Re: Chase A/A Master Thread (Now With Poll)
« Reply #403 on: March 14, 2012, 05:09:37 PM »
..but the evidence suggests there is no link. Where are all the account closures from members that have done AOR’s for the past ten years? Some have 10X there stated income in total CL’s. We should see hundreds if not thousands of post in this regard. Look at the AARP card. When Chase takes action you see many reports right away. Please point me to all these account closures by Chase due to CL’s greater than stated income.   
But what's to say it's not a new policy being instituted now? The past isn't always an indicator of the future.

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Re: Chase A/A Master Thread (Now With Poll)
« Reply #404 on: March 14, 2012, 05:10:03 PM »
Thousands would be right with you. Hopefully this will put an end to the notion accounts are getting shut down due to CL’s greater than stated income.

You consistently are missing the point. No one has said that it alone will cause an A/A.

For your reference:

Those that think lenders do not consider it a risk/red flag to have access to $100,000 in monthly credit with only $50,000 of stated annual income are incredibly naive.
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Offline scwam

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Re: Chase A/A Master Thread (Now With Poll)
« Reply #405 on: March 14, 2012, 05:32:55 PM »
..but the evidence suggests there is no link. Where are all the account closures from members that have done AOR’s for the past ten years? Some have 10X there stated income in total CL’s. We should see hundreds if not thousands of post in this regard. Look at the AARP card. When Chase takes action you see many reports right away. Please point me to all these account closures by Chase due to CL’s greater than stated income.

"Open to income comes up as well."

Anonymous said...
In a former career I was a credit analyst and risk detection analyst with MBNA, 12-15 years ago range. My unit's job was to identify and assess risk of open, high credit lines in relation to total amount of open revolving lines and shut them down if the situation looked like a house of cards. It wasn't fun, but in hind sight I get what they were searching for - Houses made from cards. They were eliminating hefty risks before they got to be one. This situation sound like the account hit an algorithm Chase didn't like and risk hit the button. D/I isn't the only thing they reassess. Open to income comes up as well. Though shutting down all of his cards sounds extreme; lower lines perhaps, but shut down shouldn't happen if credit worthiness still exists. -Mike H
(http link removed, sorry about that. We might know who FG is for reference)
I guess you could take his word for what it's worth. I would assume Open mean available credit.

"I see. Well the interesting thing is that I asked Amex for a CLI at 8 months which they denied b/c my credit to income was sufficient in their eyes. I was surprised b/c my history with them (and in general) is good"

"The CSR said I should not expect any CLI until my income changes"
http://ficoforums.myfico.com/t5/Credit-Cards/Available-credit-to-income-and-CLIs/td-p/1237377

Putting down that one owns property/investment assets does help in reducing this type of closure.
« Last Edit: March 14, 2012, 05:53:35 PM by scwam »

Offline HelpMe

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Re: Chase A/A Master Thread (Now With Poll)
« Reply #406 on: March 14, 2012, 07:35:31 PM »
But what's to say it's not a new policy being instituted now? The past isn't always an indicator of the future.
You are 100% correct. Did their policy change yesterday? We can only go by what is currently happening.
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Offline dans fan

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Re: Chase A/A Master Thread (Now With Poll)
« Reply #407 on: March 15, 2012, 11:39:38 PM »
got a letter from chase they lowered cl from 15k to 1k on opp and 5k to 1k on sp. i am not sure if i got close to  aa or this is somthing dif
 ( btw sp was lowered to 1k this can be dif than moving cl from one card to another)
a little nervous i have 5 ppl at same address with 200k ur

Offline AsherO

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Re: Chase A/A Master Thread (Now With Poll)
« Reply #408 on: March 15, 2012, 11:47:52 PM »
got a letter from chase they lowered cl from 15k to 1k on opp and 5k to 1k on sp. i am not sure if i got close to  aa or this is somthing dif
 ( btw sp was lowered to 1k this can be dif than moving cl from one card to another)
a little nervous i have 5 ppl at same address with 200k ur

How much income did you report? Any idea what triggered this?

200k UR each, or total?
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Offline dans fan

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Re: Chase A/A Master Thread (Now With Poll)
« Reply #409 on: March 15, 2012, 11:48:53 PM »
reading thru the thread, why is it that i see comments that x is not a reason to flag aa because mr a got aa and he didnt do x. y is not a flag because mr b didnt do y and got flagged. as if we are looking for 1 common cause for all cases, but when it comes to amex fr we have a long long list of risk and many ppl got fried for all sorts of reasons

Offline AsherO

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Re: Chase A/A Master Thread (Now With Poll)
« Reply #410 on: March 15, 2012, 11:51:14 PM »
reading thru the thread, why is it that i see comments that x is not a reason to flag aa because mr a got aa and he didnt do x. y is not a flag because mr b didnt do y and got flagged. as if we are looking for 1 common cause for all cases, but when it comes to amex fr we have a long long list of risk and many ppl got fried for all sorts of reasons

You're going to have to be more specific with some examples of what was suggested is not an A/A trigger.
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Re: Chase A/A Master Thread (Now With Poll)
« Reply #411 on: March 15, 2012, 11:52:35 PM »
How much income did you report? Any idea what triggered this?

200k UR each, or total?
200k total. it said due to recent review of cr, new accounts  and inq (i did aor  so they didnt see it till a month later when the new account and inq posted to cr)
100k income (total cl form all banks was 35% of stated incom)
« Last Edit: March 16, 2012, 12:01:38 AM by dans fan »

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Re: Chase A/A Master Thread (Now With Poll)
« Reply #412 on: March 15, 2012, 11:56:27 PM »
You're going to have to be more specific with some examples of what was suggested is not an A/A trigger.
i thought i saw ppl trying to shoot down aor being a risk , high cl being a risk , using/abusing signup offers, (or like helpme would refer to it maximizing benefits) . they can all be risks

Offline 123ablack

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Re: Chase A/A Master Thread (Now With Poll)
« Reply #413 on: March 16, 2012, 12:09:38 AM »
i thought i saw ppl trying to shoot down aor being a risk , high cl being a risk , using/abusing signup offers, (or like helpme would refer to it maximizing benefits) . they can all be risks
100% right!

Another factor I've recently came across somewhere on the web, freezing your credit reports.. Don't know how much of sense this makes but I can see it raise another batch of suspicions (imagine urself being an auditor for chase and when u find something fishy u'd first wanna take a look at that person's credit reports - only to find that this person has frozen his credit reports... Not the best impression..

Perhaps an other string to attach to this funky fadey a/a issue

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Re: Chase A/A Master Thread (Now With Poll)
« Reply #414 on: March 16, 2012, 12:15:23 AM »
100% right!

Another factor I've recently came across somewhere on the web, freezing your credit reports.. Don't know how much of sense this makes but I can see it raise another batch of suspicions (imagine urself being an auditor for chase and when u find something fishy u'd first wanna take a look at that person's credit reports - only to find that this person has frozen his credit reports... Not the best impression..

Perhaps an other string to attach to this funky fadey a/a issue

Current creditors have access to your credit reports, even frozen ones.
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Re: Chase A/A Master Thread (Now With Poll)
« Reply #415 on: March 16, 2012, 12:42:08 AM »
Current creditors have access to your credit reports, even frozen ones.

From what i know, To a certain degree. But limited though.

And they can def see that you froze it which doesn't make them happy I assume.

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Re: Chase A/A Master Thread (Now With Poll)
« Reply #416 on: March 16, 2012, 12:47:39 AM »
From what i know, To a certain degree. But limited though.

And they can def see that you froze it which doesn't make them happy I assume.

Not sure why you think it would be limited in any way, shape, or form.

Also, I don't agree that a frozen report would indicate to them anything nefarious or suspicious.
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Offline AsherO

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Re: Chase A/A Master Thread (Now With Poll)
« Reply #417 on: March 16, 2012, 01:24:34 AM »
Not sure why you think it would be limited in any way, shape, or form.

Also, I don't agree that a frozen report would indicate to them anything nefarious or suspicious.

+1

The only time they even know you froze it is when you're applying for new/additional credit. With soft pulls they probably don't even know. I doubt it's a flag.

200k total. it said due to recent review of cr, new accounts  and inq (i did aor  so they didnt see it till a month later when the new account and inq posted to cr)
100k income (total cl form all banks was 35% of stated incom)

Did you call and ask about the CL cuts? What did they say?

i thought i saw ppl trying to shoot down aor being a risk , high cl being a risk , using/abusing signup offers, (or like helpme would refer to it maximizing benefits) . they can all be risks

The latter two are definitely risky IMHO, the first one is probably a factor when they review you, but I don't think it's  flag.

There's a major difference between Chase A/A and Amex F/R (which is indicated by their respective names, action vs. review):

With Amex everyone who is F/R'd knows they are under F/R. With Chase, since they don't notify you unless they're actually taking adverse action, you don't even know if you're being reviewed. So theoretically many people are being reviewed (e.g. after AOR or even 3BM) and passing with flying colors.
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Offline scwam

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Re: Chase A/A Master Thread (Now With Poll)
« Reply #418 on: March 16, 2012, 01:59:49 AM »
From what i know, To a certain degree. But limited though.

And they can def see that you froze it which doesn't make them happy I assume.

As others stated,
I don't believe current creditors would be limited in any way either. I have 2 of mine frozen. I just checked tonight and 6 of my creditors all did account reviews on me in January. Whether this is a marketing review, risk review, I don't know. I believe they show up as soft pulls but could easily be full blown bureaus if they are A/R's. Amex and Amex 2(what is that?) checked me 3 times in January(??).

I also logged onto USAA tonight and find a preapproval for 25k with 17mnths no interest on convenience checks and fee waived if 'electronically deposited' into a USAA account. Pretty tempting just to get a decent chunk of utilization over the next few month and become attractive to other issuers in the future. But that amount is = to 3 of my highest cards. Might be too much to risk.

Offline HelpMe

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Re: Chase A/A Master Thread (Now With Poll)
« Reply #419 on: March 16, 2012, 02:39:58 AM »
i thought i saw ppl trying to shoot down aor being a risk , high cl being a risk , using/abusing signup offers, (or like helpme would refer to it maximizing benefits) . they can all be risks
Almost everything we do creates some kind of risk. Some base their opinion on their personal experience. My approach is to base it on as many different opinions I can find. You then evaluate the risk you feel comfortable with from there.

A great example was during the AOR days. I had close to 400k in outstanding debt at 0% earning me 4-5%. I can’t tell you how many times at CB they told me I was crazy. They did not have all the data points that were available from other sources. It turned out just great for me. Was I lucky or was it because I made an informed decision?

The bottom line is get as much information you can no matter if it comes from DDF or another forum.
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