COVID-19 (Wuhan Novel Coronavirus) Pandemic Master Thread

[4yourinfo]

can't tell if your serious or joking.... At the very basic level, insist on or at least promote mask wearing. Pretty sure there's close to a medical consensus that it would help stop the spread

Look at florida Texas Arizona they all had their spikes after the mask wearing promotion of the CDC. Mask wearing does very little to contain this monster. In Israel they shut down which was able to contain the virus until they got tired of it and they opened up and it went down hill from there. What makes you think the USA would have been any different. Let's say Trump would have said how dangerous this virus is (I'm sure the Democrats wouldv'e listened) and he would have promoted a shut down - how long would've it lasted before things get opened up and it would spiral out of control? So you'll tell me there is a way to open up - but that is not what Trump or anyone would know 3 months in... You claim had Trump not downplayed the virus lives would've been definitely saved - That is incorrect - who says after 3 months of saying how dangerous the virus is anyone will be paying attention and there would not have been an opening like Israel?

[S209]

Look at florida Texas Arizona they all had their spikes after the mask wearing promotion of the CDC. Mask wearing does very little to contain this monster. In Israel they shut down which was able to contain the virus until they got tired of it and they opened up and it went down hill from there. What makes you think the USA would have been any different. Let's say Trump would have said how dangerous this virus is (I'm sure the Democrats wouldv'e listened) and he would have promoted a shut down - how long would've it lasted before things get opened up and it would spiral out of control? So you'll tell me there is a way to open up - but that is not what Trump or anyone would know 3 months in... You claim had Trump not downplayed the virus lives would've been definitely saved - That is incorrect - who says after 3 months of saying how dangerous the virus is anyone will be paying attention and there would not have been an opening like Israel?

I hear there are other countries besides the US and Israel?

[4yourinfo]

My point is just by Trump warning us how dangerous the virus is does not guarantee any lives saved. Many other unknown correct steps would had to have been taken to save lives.

[S209]

My point is just by Trump warning us how dangerous the virus is does not guarantee any lives saved. Many other unknown correct steps would had to have been taken to save lives.

Of course not. But to claim Trump’s response was perfect is absurd, as is of course the claim that Cuomo and Murphy were perfect in their response.

[aygart]

Of course not. But to claim Trump’s response was perfect is absurd, as is of course the claim that Cuomo and Murphy were perfect in their response.

Does a perfect response exist?

[4yourinfo]

Of course not. But to claim Trump’s response was perfect is absurd, as is of course the claim that Cuomo and Murphy were perfect in their response.

At the time with all the knowledge we had, it may have been the correct approach. Only now after we see different results do we know all the correct turns to take. Had we shut down we would never know what the next correct turn should be, it would end being a guessing game - why close down the country and play a guessing game with the likelihood of ending up with the same results....

[S209]

Does a perfect response exist?

Maybe not. But it seems many countries have thus far fared much better than the US and Israel. Of course there are many factors in all of them.

[aygart]

Maybe not. But it seems many countries have thus far fared much better than the US and Israel. Of course there are many factors in all of them.

Also the book is not yet written. Will we see when all is said and done that Sweden was the best of all? Maybe. I don't see that the full lockdown regimes have fared better over the long term. They just had their outbreak later as soon as they reopned.

[S209]

Also the book is not yet written. Will we see when all is said and done that Sweden was the best of all? Maybe. I don't see that the full lockdown regimes have fared better over the long term. They just had their outbreak later as soon as they reopned.

Many countries have not. As you said though, the book is not yet written.

But it seems many countries have thus far fared much better than the US and Israel.

[PlatinumGuy]

Also the book is not yet written. Will we see when all is said and done that Sweden was the best of all? Maybe. I don't see that the full lockdown regimes have fared better over the long term. They just had their outbreak later as soon as they reopned.

Plenty of countries haven't had an outbreak at all.

[yuneeq]

Look at florida Texas Arizona they all had their spikes after the mask wearing promotion of the CDC. Mask wearing does very little to contain this monster. In Israel they shut down which was able to contain the virus until they got tired of it and they opened up and it went down hill from there. What makes you think the USA would have been any different. Let's say Trump would have said how dangerous this virus is (I'm sure the Democrats wouldv'e listened) and he would have promoted a shut down - how long would've it lasted before things get opened up and it would spiral out of control? So you'll tell me there is a way to open up - but that is not what Trump or anyone would know 3 months in... You claim had Trump not downplayed the virus lives would've been definitely saved - That is incorrect - who says after 3 months of saying how dangerous the virus is anyone will be paying attention and there would not have been an opening like Israel?

There was so much we knew in February that would’ve saved lives if Trump (and every governor and mayor) did not downplay the virus.

1. We knew masks were effective. Yeh the CDC said they aren’t, but that was a political play, so the politicians are also responsible. Trump knew what every country was doing but let the CDC make up crap.

2. We didn’t order or stock any PPE, in fact in February all the PPE in the US was being bought out and shipped to China, Hong Kong. Which meant that a lockdown was all we had left to fight the spread of this unknown virus.

3. We encouraged people to socialize, said the virus was going to disappear, and that we should live life as normal until mid-March.

4. We didn’t perform any testing, allowing ourselves to be fooled by the low numbers until it was way too late.

5. Delaying the spread of corona, or flattening the curve, would’ve have saved at least 25k lives just in NY/NJ.

[4yourinfo]

There was so much we knew in February that would’ve saved lives if Trump (and every governor and mayor) did not downplay the virus.

1. We knew masks were effective. Yeh the CDC said they aren’t, but that was a political play, so the politicians are also responsible. Trump knew what every country was doing but let the CDC make up crap.

2. We didn’t order or stock any PPE, in fact in February all the PPE in the US was being bought out and shipped to China, Hong Kong. Which meant that a lockdown was all we had left to fight the spread of this unknown virus.

3. We encouraged people to socialize, said the virus was going to disappear, and that we should live life as normal until mid-March.

4. We didn’t perform any testing, allowing ourselves to be fooled by the low numbers until it was way too late.

5. Delaying the spread of corona, or flattening the curve, would’ve have saved at least 25k lives just in NY/NJ.

Let's rewind - Trump tells the American people this virus is extremely dangerous everyone must wear masks - Will people listen probably some - so we have this slow spread of a virus give it a couple of weeks and people start questioning what is this? enough with the masks! and we end up with what we had.. Another choice Trump decides let's lock down.. so we lock down for a couple of months and there's a slow virus moving around and we say ok enough let's open up and everything slowly opens and the virus comes roaring at us.. my point is had Trump given us a dire warning don't kid yourself that people would be social distancing wearing masks lockdowns for six months straight with a very low transmission rate. People are only listening and continuing to listen as they see the consequences - (we would not have seen this had people been wearing masks sd etc.) It's a Catch 22. Could you have saved 25k people if everyone would sd for 6 months then yes - but it never would've worked! Which brings me to my point "had Trump just warned the American people not necessarily would any lives been saved.... And btw the reason why people died in NY had nothing to do with the overwhelmed hospitals, there were hundreds of empty beds on the ship, field hospitals etc.- it was panic what was going to come....

[ckmk47]

And btw the reason why people died in NY had nothing to do with the overwhelmed hospitals, there were hundreds of empty beds on the ship, field hospitals etc.- it was panic what was going to come....

Disagree with this point.
Hospitals in every boro except Manhattan were overwhelmed.
They didn't run out of respirators, but ran short of feeding pumps and dialysis machines.
Most importantly, they ran short of personnel! The hospitals were All Covid, All The time.  So all the doctors and nurses were working on covid patients;  even surgeons and others who have no experience with pneumonia were put in charge of scores of patients.
The doctors were just figuring covid out.  Pulmonologists and other qualified doctors were testing out what worked and what didn't improve the patients condition. They then passed this information to all the doctors in their hospital and beyond.  Doctors, nurses and others were sharing information between hospitals.
The medical teams were scared of catching covid, so they had to fully dress in PPE to go into patient rooms to do each bit of patient care and then undress as they left and redress into new PPE for the next patient.  This added time to their already overwhelming patient duties.
In one hospital they moved the controls for many of the patient machines such as respirators  into the hallway so the doctors could make adjustments without having to gown up.  This ideas was quickly passed to other hospitals and everyone set it up.


The empty ship and field hospital remained empty partly for political reasons - they were sent by Trump to a Democratic city in a Democratic state.  Also, noone had a vision of how to use it.  Just dump excess patients? The sickest that can't travel? Or the simple ones that are well enough to go home in a day or 2?  Whoops one of the simple ones has now deteriorated and needs minute by minute care- should we move him now?

[Euclid]

Disagree with this point.
Hospitals in every boro except Manhattan were overwhelmed.
They didn't run out of respirators, but ran short of feeding pumps and dialysis machines.
Most importantly, they ran short of personnel! The hospitals were All Covid, All The time.  So all the doctors and nurses were working on covid patients;  even surgeons and others who have no experience with pneumonia were put in charge of scores of patients.
The doctors were just figuring covid out.  Pulmonologists and other qualified doctors were testing out what worked and what didn't improve the patients condition. They then passed this information to all the doctors in their hospital and beyond.  Doctors, nurses and others were sharing information between hospitals.
The medical teams were scared of catching covid, so they had to fully dress in PPE to go into patient rooms to do each bit of patient care and then undress as they left and redress into new PPE for the next patient.  This added time to their already overwhelming patient duties.
In one hospital they moved the controls for many of the patient machines such as respirators  into the hallway so the doctors make adjustments without having to gown up.  This ideas was quickly passed to other hospitals and everyone set it up.


The empty ship and field hospital remained empty partly for political reasons - they were sent by Trump to a Democratic city in a Democratic state.  Also, noone had a vision of how to use it.  Just dump excess patients? The sickest that can't travel? Or the simple ones that are well enough to go home in a day or 2?  Whoops one of the simple ones has now deteriorated and needs minute by minute care- should we move him now?

IINM the field hospitals were set up by the state, not the fed

[avromie7]

IINM the field hospitals were set up by the state, not the fed

They were set up by the state with money they begged the President for.

[Essen est zich]

Forward from WhatsApp

This is Sarah Dukes.  Her husband Yudi Dukes was in icu with covid 19 complications for 5.5 months.  This is the longest icu stay with covid 19 IN THE WORLD! When he was released to rehab last week, this event was covered by major mainstream media.  Below is what she has to say about _masks and social distancing._ *Read carefully.*


It's a strange feeling how everyone is talking about a potential second  wave of covid19 and discussing the precautionary steps needed to prevent it, while my husband is still in the hospital from the first round- back in March!
 
I believe that we have the choice with who we choose to surround ourselves with and the choice of who we allow into our inner circles. I was taught this from a very young age, and it became my inner voice, "Surround yourself with positive people. With people who believe in you and in what you have to offer. Believe in yourself and you can achieve anything...".  (This is actually the inspiration behind my song "Just by Being You". Not kol isha. Link below). 

I try to be so careful with which type of people I surround myself and consciously choose to be around those who are positive and encouraging. I want to thank you- because you have been that for me. You have been completely supportive and loving in every way and in every step I took. You lifted me up when I was down and you celebrated each and every milestone with me, no matter how small they seemed. You kept me strong and empowered. You believed for me and in me.  "We are here for you and we have you and Yudi's back no matter what" was your underlying message to me. Always. No judgement, only love and respect. To have such an incredibly large supportive and loving network is one of the biggest blessings that G-d gave me to help get me through this trauma, and I want to thank you for being part of this blessing. Thank you for allowing this to be a safe platform for me to make myself vulnerable and express my deepest emotions. Thank you for being you. 

Yudi's journey (actually our family's journey) has been getting much more publicity with articles and news coverage (Fox News, CBS News etc.)- and well deserved. We all worked hard, and especially Yudi, to get to this point and the miraculous good that came out of something so terrifying deserves to be recognized and celebrated. This, however, opens the door for thousands of others to share their thoughts on the story as well. 

It's ok for everyone to have their opinion on things. I don't judge anyone. And that being said, I received enough new opinionated comments for me to need to put up some boundaries and respectfully take a stand and share what I am not comfortable with. 

A few have reached out to me requesting or suggesting that I and/or Yudi should make a video or declaration about the importance of social distancing and wearing masks. They feel that our story illustrates how serious Covid19 really is, and that we should use our experience to promote appropriate precautions. 
 
Again, without judging, it's important for people to know that I will NOT turn our journey into a political statement.  My husband will NOT be the poster boy for what will happen if you don't social distance or wear masks. My husband WILL be (and IS!) the poster boy to show the world the power of positivity, prayer, unity, strength, perseverance and love for one another. 

I don't feel like it's necessary to defend ourselves at all, but I think at this point it's important to highlight an important fact: When Yudi first got sick, we were social distancing. We were quarantined. We were wearing masks, washing hands, and being so careful. And yet, he still got it. And got hit harder than most people in. the. world. 

I know with absolute certainty that Yudi got covid19 to this degree only because this is what G-d wanted for Yudi's life journey, for our family's, and for the world. This did NOT happen to Yudi because of a lack of social distancing or mask wearing. This happened because G-d wanted it to happen. *There is NOTHING we could have, should have, or would have done differently to prevent Yudi from getting covid19.*
 
Very little is known about the coronavirus. No one really understands it. There are many people who are super careful and still manage to get it.  Others are not careful at all and don't get it. Some people are asymptomatic, others have mild symptoms, some have a full recovery, some have long lasting effects, and others, tragically, don't make it through. Some have antibodies, some do not (like me!), some test positive on the carrier test only to get a negative on the next one.
  
It can be scary to see so much chaos happening around us and how there are no clear answers- about anything.  But that's why it's so comforting to know that G-d is in control and that there IS an ultimate purpose and reason behind the chaos.

Like everything else in life, we have a responsibility to put in the effort. We have to do our part to stay safe and healthy emotionally, mentally and physically. 

Us trying to control everything and everyone has created a significant amount of anxiety. And so is the complete lack of control and the unknown. It makes it so much easier when we are OK with doing our part and leaving the rest up to G-d. He can handle what we cannot. He knows exactly what He's doing. We need to trust that He is "All Good", and take a deep breath, let go, and let G-d. 

If you look at the back of an embroidery, it often looks like one big mess. There are knots and loose strings everywhere. However, when you turn it around, you see that it's specifically this "mess" that makes up a beautiful embroidered image. So too, what can often seem like a complete chaos down here in our lives, actually creates a masterpiece from above.

We are in good hands. Trust. 

Thank you again for completely surrounding Yudi and I with such love, acceptance, and respect. It means more to us than you will ever know.
 
May we continue hearing good news, see revealed miracles and beauty in every aspect of our lives, and may Chaim Schneur Zalman Yehuda ben Hinda Yocheved get stronger and healthier- even more than before- so he can come home and be reunited with his family again! 

https://open.spotify.com/album/3DLiADtWKiu6Zt27vffetd?si=qZ6ArHvmQ5mD3kGSa7F-9g

[yuneeq]

Again, without judging, it's important for people to know that I will NOT turn our journey into a political statement.  My husband will NOT be the poster boy for what will happen if you don't social distance or wear masks. My husband WILL be (and IS!) the poster boy to show the world the power of positivity, prayer, unity, strength, perseverance and love for one another.

I don't feel like it's necessary to defend ourselves at all, but I think at this point it's important to highlight an important fact: When Yudi first got sick, we were social distancing. We were quarantined. We were wearing masks, washing hands, and being so careful. And yet, he still got it. And got hit harder than most people in. the. world.

Very nice message.
But this particular point saying that encouraging people to wear a mask/social distancing is making "a political statement", is literally a political statement. Also there is no reason for them to feel guilty about this, but let's get real - he got sick within a couple weeks of Purim when people just started taking precautions, I highly doubt he caught COVID from sitting at home.

[shaulyaakov]

I wonder if that person understands that the point of the precautions are to prevent the spread at a communal level, such that a casual trip to the supermarket (even while wearing a mask) doesn't carry a high risk of getting sick.

[Jerseysteve]

https://www.statnews.com/2020/09/14/bill-gates-slams-mismanaged-u-s-response-to-covid-19-pandemic/

[Jerseysteve]

I did not realize he is in אבילות

https://vosizneias.com/2020/09/15/bill-gates-sr-father-of-microsoft-co-founder-dies-at-94/