Corona virus and your shul

[S209]

They closed 1-2 weeks too late

Forget 1-2 weeks. Considering cases were presumably doubling every day or two at the peak, 3 days means we could have avoided more than half of the infections that took place. Factor in anyone who then went on to infect family members, and we’re talking tens of thousands of infections from those “3 days”.. I think every single day wasted was a huge tragedy.

[yesitsme]

R Pinchos Frankel resignation speech
file:///C:/Users/nachman/Downloads/Rabbi%20Pinchos%20Frankel.mp3

post RDP login info please, thanks

[ari3]

https://www.theyeshivaworld.com/news/featured/1862407/breaking-pm-netanyahu-announces-shuls-can-open-tomorrow-in-israel.html

Iy"h by us all

[avromie7]

They closed 1-2 weeks too late

The government didn't help solve that.

[chinagel]

post RDP login info please, thanks

IDK what that is

[S209]

https://www.theyeshivaworld.com/news/featured/1862407/breaking-pm-netanyahu-announces-shuls-can-open-tomorrow-in-israel.html

Iy"h by us all

That a secular politician should decide when we can daven in shul?

[EliJelly]

That a secular politician should decide when we can daven in shul?

Great. Finally you're promoting two weeks earlier

[S209]

Great. Finally you're promoting two weeks earlier

?

[ari3]

That a secular politician should decide when we can daven in shul?

C'mon

Btw that's already happening here too

[chevron]

There's a frum / yeshivish element here who are making a mockery of the karbabos.

Thank God, things are getting better, doctors got better with treatment.

For example, some people on immunosuppressants like jakafi who should have gotten very sick from covid19 were just moderately sick.

It's helped doctors use immunosuppressants for covid19 and cytokine storms .

Bh the more everyone knows about Covid19 means the better things are. Prevention, treatment etc.

And yes, a few days earlier would have saved thousands.

I'm not sure where and when, but I mentioned sometime back, that simply going over time, would mean that those who get the disease later would get better treatment as doctors know more about it.

As time goes on I'm more optimistic. hoping healthy hygenie and social distance carries over, mortality rates will drop as people adapt and adopt, get your vitamin c and d etc.

https://www.kgw.com/article/news/local/very-encouraging-providence-doctor-provides-update-on-remesivir-trials-to-treat-covid-19/283-2a678629-1756-4436-8e58-6c1b60a83f3a

I actually know one of the top people at Gilead so that's cool

Now, let's go back to page 1. How much have things change with reopening shuls?

Are they taking this seriously or is it going to be like another joke and it's going to start all over again

[chevron]

https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2020/05/19/health/erin-bromage-risk-advice-wellness/index.html

CNN: Why are grocery stores, bike riders and inconsiderate runners less of a concern when compared to sharing enclosed spaces like an office or restaurant?

If your kids are acting out during the pandemic, they might just be sad
If your kids are acting out during the pandemic, they might just be sad
Bromage: It comes down to the concentration of the virus in the air and the length of exposure. In larger spaces with better ventilation or outdoors, the concentration of the virus can be diluted in the larger volume of the air. The lower the virus burden in the air, the longer you can be in that environment before receiving an infectious dose.

CNN: What is the difference between sneezing, talking loudly and singing in terms of virus transmission?

Bromage: Respiratory droplet emission follows this sequence. Talking loudly emits a lesser amount of droplets than singing. Sneezing emits the most. The more force by which a sound leaves your mouth, the more respiratory particles are emitted, and they travel a further distance.

[chevron]

Hence the shul dilemma

[S209]

the fact is that a lot of shuls are operating and there was BH no spike after Pesach. Some with more precaution and some without any. This is a fact. My theory is that by the time we were told to shut down it was waaaaaaay to late. The majority of victims was unavoidable. But at this time it is probably best to legally open with guidelines vs. Keeping everything officially closed. Had there been guidance how to safely open, most shuls would comply.

Way too late for what? You don’t think dozens or hundreds were saved?

[VacationLover]

Way too late for what? You don’t think dozens or hundreds were saved?

yeah, kind of it's never too late. But i meant in the context of losing so many community members, it was way too late.

[chevron]

yeah, kind of it's never too late. But i meant in the context of losing so many community members, it was way too late.

It's impossible to say honestly. There are so many factors involved.

But just simply cutting down the rush would have saved lives.  If 50% less were infected, could 75% more have been saved?

Now they intubate much less and mortality rates are dropping bh.
The whole severity of the virus is that we knew we couldn't handle pandemic numbers.

[Yard sale]

It's impossible to say honestly. There are so many factors involved.

But just simply cutting down the rush would have saved lives.  If 50% less were infected, could 75% more have been saved?

Now they intubate much less and mortality rates are dropping bh.
The whole severity of the virus is that we knew we couldn't handle pandemic numbers.

(The following assumes that ventilators are indeed contributing to mortality- this is not completely settled yet.)
There’s a fallacy in that argument in that they only intubate far less because they learned the hard way after so many thousands of patients have done so poorly on ventilators. One could just as easily make the other argument. If everyone had thrown caution to the winds, and gone on a herd immunity socialization binge, far less ventilators would have been available to treat the sudden sharp spike and many who fell victim to the 88% ventilator mortality rate (although some very recent data appears to show a far lower fatality rate) over the course of the six week surge might have been given oxygen supplementation instead to treat their “happy hypoxia” due to the resulting ventilator shortage.Many more of them may have survived.

The resultant difference in mortality between the patients who were ventilated and those who were oxygenated might have quickly alerted doctors to the danger of ventilation as a first line of treatment, further saving even more lives.

Of course I think it would have been a reckless course of action to follow without the benefit of hindsight, but the point is it is so difficult to predict what might have been since there are so many variables.

(One thing that doesn’t cease to amaze me if the data on ventilators is confirmed is that scientists, government leaders, and society at large put their faith in stockpiles of ventilators, believing that that would be their ישועה. Meanwhile G-d was “laughing” so to speak knowing that those very ventilators actually represented mortal peril for so many.)

[chevron]

It's a bit of both. I said early on, it's crazy to try to understand things in a pandemic.

The medical system always operates on near capacity. It's not a hotel, they can't just throw them up.

Each bed cost $, the actual room, bed, equipment.

Also hospitals have to have supporting equipment and infesreucture. So If they want to have 700 beds vs 600, they need much more resources.

They don't want this, It means investing more money in construction and equipment.

Our hospitals are not designed for pandemics. You really cannot expect the doctors to treat properly when they are overwhelmed.

I think that it came together because thank God all these doctors communicated, biologists, immunologists and virologists, infectious disease experts etc..

Necessity does often breed innovation too. Urgency is often the call to arm's

[VacationLover]

https://www.theyeshivaworld.com/news/featured/1862651/nypd-empties-hundreds-from-shul-in-williamsburg-videos.html

[stooges44]

[Chapshnell]

good for religious weddings..