Author Topic: Corona virus and your shul  (Read 368679 times)

Offline S209

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Re: Corona virus and your shul
« Reply #1340 on: April 24, 2020, 06:11:53 PM »
I think this conversation is pointless because everyone here is biased with their own opinions. But in any case if everyone can do it in a safe way there is absolutely no reason not to daven with a minyan. The fact that so many have come out against and so few rabbaonim are pro minyanim is pure politics, they were pressured big time to come out against all these things. If anyone here took a second to think about it they would realize that if everyone Davens from their own space there is no health risk. Obviously if your rabbonim say not to then don't. I personally have not davened with a minyan in weeks because my rov said not, but he also thinks there's no issue. To the people staying home good for u, and u should continue to do so. But fact is look all over the country, parks are full, stores are full, planes are flying, and cars are driving. So IMHO its unreasonable and senseless to go bashing people who daven with a minyan because you were told otherwise. As to shuls being open, that's pure irresponsibility.

I didn't compare anything to goyim. Rabbanim were not pressured by drs its by askanim. Could be your rav wasn't pressured, but I know  first hand numerous rabbanim in Brooklyn and 5 towns that have shuls with hundreds of missispalem that were.
::)
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Online mgarfin

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Re: Corona virus and your shul
« Reply #1341 on: April 24, 2020, 06:12:07 PM »
My shul...but for free. Just the Rov his family and 2 special people (and their families) who were designated essential by my (probably soon to be former) Rov.

I'm trying to digest switching a Rov for not doing as you understand.
I know there's different ways to look at it. I just need to process
« Last Edit: April 24, 2020, 06:15:30 PM by mgarfin »

Online EliJelly

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Re: Corona virus and your shul
« Reply #1342 on: April 24, 2020, 06:12:11 PM »
Let me remind you that many people davened with a minyan early on (before it was officially allowed), along with all of their normal activities, and many people died after that. Do you not think if we could go back in time we would have stopped that cold turkey? We would. Despite the fact that “other people were doing it too”.
Had the porch minynim start a week before the shuls were closed, things would be completely different. We didn't mess after the closures, we closed too late.

Online EliJelly

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Re: Corona virus and your shul
« Reply #1343 on: April 24, 2020, 06:13:54 PM »
I'm trying to digest firing a Rov for not doing as you understand.
I know there's different ways to look at it. I just need to process
He can post whatever he want's on his gate, he can start to daven in a different shul if he wants. No one talking of firing.

Offline S209

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Re: Corona virus and your shul
« Reply #1344 on: April 24, 2020, 06:14:01 PM »
I'm trying to digest firing a Rov for not doing as you understand.
I know there's different ways to look at it. I just need to process

I’m trying to digest not understanding why what the Rav has been doing was not morally and halachically bankrupt.
I know there's different ways to look at it. I just need to process

To be fair, I don’t know his Rav, but it sure sounds dangerous and misguided
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Offline S209

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Re: Corona virus and your shul
« Reply #1345 on: April 24, 2020, 06:15:23 PM »

I’m sure you have a point. Just don’t know what it is.

Are you saying you agree? A simple “like” would suffice ;)
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Online aygart

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Re: Corona virus and your shul
« Reply #1346 on: April 24, 2020, 06:16:28 PM »
I'm trying to digest switching a Rov for not doing as you understand.
I know there's different ways to look at it. I just need to process
Would you continue with a Rov whose judgement you feel you can't trust?
Feelings don't care about your facts

Online mgarfin

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Re: Corona virus and your shul
« Reply #1347 on: April 24, 2020, 06:18:04 PM »
I’m trying to digest not understanding why what the Rav has been doing was not morally and halachically bankrupt.
I know there's different ways to look at it. I just need to process

To be fair, I don’t know his Rav, but it sure sounds dangerous and misguided

Anyone know of prominent Rabonim in BP davening without a minyan?
I know over 50 that are davening with a minyan x 3 daily.

Online momo

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Re: Corona virus and your shul
« Reply #1348 on: April 24, 2020, 06:18:59 PM »
I'm trying to digest switching a Rov for not doing as you understand.
I know there's different ways to look at it. I just need to process
Firing? It’s his shul?! What hv means, is that he will no longer be davening there, as he doesn’t respect a safek rotzaich

Offline S209

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Re: Corona virus and your shul
« Reply #1349 on: April 24, 2020, 06:19:18 PM »
Would you continue with a Rov whose judgement you feel you can't trust?
+1

Not all Rabbanim are created equal.

Let me be clear, we do each have to follow our daas Torah. But it’s perfectly acceptable to decide (realize?) that your Rav does not jive with your standards and move on to someone closer to your Hashkafos.
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Online EliJelly

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Re: Corona virus and your shul
« Reply #1350 on: April 24, 2020, 06:19:56 PM »
I’m sure you have a point. Just don’t know what it is.

Are you saying you agree? A simple “like” would suffice ;)
I can sure give you as many likes you want :), but I disagree, the wave of people dying was due to the virus had spread before the shuls were closed, most likely on Purim, when mayor De Blasio said it's okay to visit the grandparents.

Online mgarfin

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Re: Corona virus and your shul
« Reply #1351 on: April 24, 2020, 06:20:00 PM »
Would you continue with a Rov whose judgement you feel you can't trust?

In order for me to judge my rov I need to be on his level.
If I can judge, it not a relationship from a Rov to a talmid

Offline yaakov35

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Re: Corona virus and your shul
« Reply #1352 on: April 24, 2020, 06:20:58 PM »
::)
You think none of them were Jewish? , I was talking about overall behavior. Not pertinent to anyone in particular.

Online momo

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Re: Corona virus and your shul
« Reply #1353 on: April 24, 2020, 06:22:23 PM »
In order for me to judge my rov I need to be on his level.
If I can judge it not a relationship from a Rov to a talmid
I’m sorry, but if a person loses repect for his Rov, whether he’s justified or not, it’s time to find somewhere else.

Online EliJelly

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Re: Corona virus and your shul
« Reply #1354 on: April 24, 2020, 06:23:02 PM »
In order for me to judge my rov I need to be on his level.
If I can judge it not a relationship from a Rov to a talmid
Not every Bneshek that opens a shteibel deserves a "from a Rov to a talmid" relationship :)

Offline S209

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Re: Corona virus and your shul
« Reply #1355 on: April 24, 2020, 06:25:40 PM »
In order for me to judge my rov I need to be on his level.
If I can judge, it not a relationship from a Rov to a talmid
That’s ridiculous. What does Asei Lecha Rav mean? Of course you can choose your Rav.
You think none of them were Jewish? , I was talking about overall behavior. Not pertinent to anyone in particular.
Ah. You meant the Jewish people doing it? Ok then, your argument is valid. Jews were going to the park so therefore it’s safe and the right thing to daven with a minyan.
I can sure give you as many likes you want :), but I disagree, the wave of people dying was due to the virus had spread before the shuls were closed, most likely on Purim, when mayor De Blasio said it's okay to visit the grandparents.
Exactly my point. We would go back and shut them down because we realize now that was the wrong thing to do. EVEN though DeBlasio said go visit your grandmother. Just because others were doing it, does not justify us doing it. Like now.
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Online mgarfin

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Re: Corona virus and your shul
« Reply #1356 on: April 24, 2020, 06:26:05 PM »
Not every Bneshek that opens a shteibel deserves a "from a Rov to a talmid" relationship :)
We are discussing a Rov
That's a different story

Online flyingace

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Re: Corona virus and your shul
« Reply #1357 on: April 24, 2020, 06:27:01 PM »
Someone once asked Rav Avigdor Miller who he should listen to if his Rav doesn't think he should follow his doctor's advice. Rav Miller said it depends who the doctor is and depends who the Rav is....

Online mgarfin

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Re: Corona virus and your shul
« Reply #1358 on: April 24, 2020, 06:28:21 PM »
That’s ridiculous. What does Asei Lecha Rav mean? Of course you can choose your Rav.

I understand one can choose but if every time he tells you something you don't like or does something you don't agree you change it loses it s purpose

Seems that it needs some balance

Offline S209

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Re: Corona virus and your shul
« Reply #1359 on: April 24, 2020, 06:31:37 PM »
I understand one can choose but if every time he tells you something you don't like or does something you don't agree you change it loses it s purpose

Seems that it needs some balance
Of course, you can’t go shopping for a new Rav every time you hear a psak you don’t like, but this is a massive fundamental choice the Rav seems to have made, whether right or wrong. Definitely wouldn’t blame @hvaces42 if he feels that is too much to have to accept going forward. I don’t know the full story but it certainly sounds like a grave error.
Someone once asked Rav Avigdor Miller who he should listen to if his Rav doesn't think he should follow his doctor's advice. Rav Miller said it depends who the doctor is and depends who the Rav is....
Like
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