Corona virus and your shul

[yuneeq]

Super spreader means that some are much more contagious than others, but I didn't see studies that showed that someone whose close presence other household members are in for hours every day may have never been contagious, and the fact that they never tested positive does not imply any element of temporary immunity.

First wave household members getting sick now is also not a proof. It seems likely that they had some sort of temporary immunity then, which they have since lost. This is not a foreign concept to us; that immunity from coronavirus colds lasts 4-6 months. It would be logical that many who had been immune then no longer are. These seem to be the main people driving the uptick these days.

1. Non-superspreaders can be not contagious at all. "For covid-19, this means 80% of new transmissions are caused by fewer than 20% of the carriers—the vast majority of people infect very few others or none at all"

2. Not all exposures are limited to household members.

[yelped]

Trying to find a way to say, "Your parlor, your rules," without sounding overly dark or dramatic.

You both made me laugh. Just giving you guys credit for making me feel better and get over this Covid business.

[Lurker]

You both made me laugh. Just giving you guys credit for making me feel better and get over this Covid business.

How's that going?

[drosenberg88429]

Oh you mean that immunity is only temporary? what would the ramifications of that be?

Are you asking facetiously? I'm not saying anything new, and you're probably preaching to the choir. At this point, the data on the ground seems to point to a very many people that were extremely significantly exposed in March and April and did not get sick then getting sick now, and a very few (but not unheard of) reinfections. We also know for a fact that antibodies levels wane after a few months for a lot of people. There are no reinfections people that currently have IgG antibodies, to the best of my knowledge. What do you think this means?

[yelped]

How's that going?

BH much better, though I was better on RH than today. I also lost my sense of smell today, although my other symptoms have basically gone away.

[PlatinumGuy]

Are you asking facetiously? I'm not saying anything new, and you're probably preaching to the choir. At this point, the data on the ground seems to point to a very many people that were extremely significantly exposed in March and April and did not get sick then getting sick now, and a very few (but not unheard of) reinfections. We also know for a fact that antibodies levels wane after a few months for a lot of people. There are no reinfections people that currently have IgG antibodies, to the best of my knowledge. What do you think this means?

Exposed means nothing. Covid positive patients are typically only contagious for a 6 hour period.

[aygart]

Are you asking facetiously? I'm not saying anything new, and you're probably preaching to the choir. At this point, the data on the ground seems to point to a very many people that were extremely significantly exposed in March and April and did not get sick then getting sick now, and a very few (but not unheard of) reinfections. We also know for a fact that antibodies levels wane after a few months for a lot of people. There are no reinfections people that currently have IgG antibodies, to the best of my knowledge. What do you think this means?

That the assumption of exposure equaling infection is bunk.

[Traveler718]

Exposed means nothing. Covid positive patients are typically only contagious for a 6 hour period.

Source?

[PlatinumGuy]

Source?

https://www.vox.com/21296067/coronavirus-covid-symptoms-superspreaders-superspreading-contagious-bars-restaurants

  The research suggests that people carrying this virus are potentially infectious for about two and a half days — and rise to a “moderate probability of transmission per contact” for “less than half a day,” the researchers write

[chevron]

There's a huge gray area here and it's pretty serious to see caution thrown in the wind for the sake of what some people consider critical.

It's just what you build off, we go from covid+ minyan where folks are walking to shul (due to false info, they may not wear a mask)

They may be stopped by a friend to say hi and figure it's outdoors, no big deal..

"But the Rav said it's ok for shmuli to go to shul, I can go see chani, her whole family got it"

Your arguments merely back the concern, humans are weak, someho people keep quoting daas Torah.

Who is daas Torah?!? What happened to everyone's fanatical chumros, this guy is crazy about possible gebrokhts and this guy spends 3 hours buying an esrog..

But man, infect other people? No big deal!

[PlatinumGuy]

There's a huge gray area here and it's pretty serious to see caution thrown in the wind for the sake of what some people consider critical.

It's just what you build off, we go from covid+ minyan where folks are walking to shul (due to false info, they may not wear a mask)

They may be stopped by a friend to say hi and figure it's outdoors, no big deal..

"But the Rav said it's ok for shmuli to go to shul, I can go see chani, her whole family got it"

Your arguments merely back the concern, humans are weak, someho people keep quoting daas Torah.

Who is daas Torah?!? What happened to everyone's fanatical chumros, this guy is crazy about possible gebrokhts and this guy spends 3 hours buying an esrog..

But man, infect other people? No big deal!

I agree with every word. It is distressing in the extreme.

[shaulyaakov]

If you beleive the rationale for a COVID + minyan is that otherwise people would go to regular minyanim positive, I'd posit that the adherence to Daas Torah is imaginary.

The same rabbonim could have issued a clear Psak that it's Assur to go to shul if you are positive.

If the reasoning is that it's not dangerous to be out an about as they are outside, I'd respectfully ask to see which medical professionals they consulted with, as I can't find any medical dispensation from any medical group saying that that's safe. If there are doctors out there that nobody else knows about, it would be a big service to the Klal to see that, as maybe this idea should take off in other communities.

[shaulyaakov]

That would require someone to go from place to place to place and blow over and over and over.

The person blowing would stand outside, reasonably distanced from the window of the house. The people who need to hear would open the window and stay inside. You've thereby reduced potential points of exposure to zero.

[Ergel]

That would require someone to go from place to place to place and blow over and over and over.

This happened in RBS without issue

[Yehuda57]

That would require someone to go from place to place to place and blow over and over and over.

You just described something hundreds of people do every year

[Lurker]

You just described something hundreds of people do every year

No, it would require a bunch of people to go to a few places each to blow. If Lubavitchers can walk for miles to blow for tens of thousands every year, I'm pretty sure Lakewood could figure it out.

[Euclid]

That would require someone to go from place to place to place and blow over and over and over.

Blowing a shofar isn't particularly hard, just takes a few days of practice. I'd reckon most people just haven't tried to do it themselves; a kosher shofar can be bought for <$100.

[Yehuda57]

Blowing a shofar isn't particularly hard, just takes a few days of practice. I'd reckon most people just haven't tried to do it themselves; a kosher shofar can be bought for <$100.

<$10

[Yard sale]

@shaulyaakov

[Euclid]

This would seem to be a reason not to have Covid+ minyanim.

The second time was more serious (12 days later).

https://twitter.com/BNODesk/status/1308883847640219649