Author Topic: SBA PPP and EIDL Small Business Loans (some money is forgivable)  (Read 342760 times)

Online zh cohen

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Platinum Elite
  • *******
  • Join Date: Dec 2013
  • Posts: 1326
  • Total likes: 1214
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 1
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
  • Location: Brooklyn
Re: SBA PPP and EIDL Small Business Loans (some money is forgivable)
« Reply #240 on: April 21, 2020, 11:18:26 PM »
I'm very surprised. The instructions clearly state "most people would use..." I suggest you call a banker who's done a few thousand of these.

Probably referencing new or seasonal businesses that have different rules.

Offline YesThatsMe

  • Dansdeals Platinum Elite + Lifetime Silver Elite
  • *****
  • Join Date: May 2017
  • Posts: 711
  • Total likes: 119
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 0
    • View Profile
Re: SBA PPP and EIDL Small Business Loans (some money is forgivable)
« Reply #241 on: April 21, 2020, 11:24:44 PM »
I'm very surprised. The instructions clearly state "most people would use..." I suggest you call a banker who's done a few thousand of these.

My experience - and I ended up getting approved and funded:

1) Used entire 2019 payroll off W3.
2) Add all federal & state employer taxes.
3) Add health insurance premiums.
4) Add all 401K employer contributions.
5) Subtract excess of $100K payroll per employee. Note - the taxes, health & 401K may take you over the $100K per employee, but thats ok. Only look to make "gross wages" limit at $100K.
6) Divide entire sum by 12
7) Multiply by 2.5

Submit W3 & 941's as proof.

Can you use Q2,3,4 2019 & Q1 2020? Yes, but good luck getting your bank to work with that, especially if you 941's are not ready

Offline cgr

  • Dansdeals Presidential Platinum Elite
  • ********
  • Join Date: Aug 2017
  • Posts: 3820
  • Total likes: 983
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 5
    • View Profile
Re: SBA PPP and EIDL Small Business Loans (some money is forgivable)
« Reply #242 on: April 21, 2020, 11:33:46 PM »

2) Add all federal & state employer taxes.


Federal? That's clearly excluded.

Offline shapsam

  • Dansdeals Presidential Platinum Elite
  • ********
  • Join Date: Feb 2017
  • Posts: 2678
  • Total likes: 469
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 10
    • View Profile
Re: SBA PPP and EIDL Small Business Loans (some money is forgivable)
« Reply #243 on: April 21, 2020, 11:35:51 PM »
Can the PPP loan be forgiven by paying your own salary?

Offline YesThatsMe

  • Dansdeals Platinum Elite + Lifetime Silver Elite
  • *****
  • Join Date: May 2017
  • Posts: 711
  • Total likes: 119
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 0
    • View Profile
Re: SBA PPP and EIDL Small Business Loans (some money is forgivable)
« Reply #244 on: April 21, 2020, 11:38:34 PM »
Federal? That's clearly excluded.

Excluded from the forgiveness, not the loan calculation

Offline cgr

  • Dansdeals Presidential Platinum Elite
  • ********
  • Join Date: Aug 2017
  • Posts: 3820
  • Total likes: 983
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 5
    • View Profile
Re: SBA PPP and EIDL Small Business Loans (some money is forgivable)
« Reply #245 on: April 21, 2020, 11:48:50 PM »
Excluded from the forgiveness, not the loan calculation

https://www.sba.com/funding-a-business/government-small-business-loans/ppp/loan-calculator/

What qualifies as ďpayroll costs?Ē

Payroll costs consist of compensation to employees (whose principal place of residence is the United States) in the form of salary, wages, commissions, or similar compensation; cash tips or the equivalent (based on employer records of past tips or, in the absence of such records, a reasonable, good-faith employer estimate of such tips); payment for vacation, parental, family, medical, or sick leave; allowance for separation or dismissal; payment for the provision of employee benefits consisting of group health care coverage, including insurance premiums, and retirement; payment of state and local taxes assessed on compensation of employees; and for an independent contractor or sole proprietor, wage, commissions, income, or net earnings from self-employment or similar compensation.

Online sillypainter

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Platinum Elite
  • *******
  • Join Date: Jan 2012
  • Posts: 1861
  • Total likes: 103
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 1
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: SBA PPP and EIDL Small Business Loans (some money is forgivable)
« Reply #246 on: April 21, 2020, 11:49:52 PM »
Can the PPP loan be forgiven by paying your own salary?

Sure. That's what most small business owners including me is doing. You need to keep the same head count I think, not sure about this though, saw conflicting reports.

Offline jackofall

  • Dansdeals Platinum Elite + Lifetime Silver Elite
  • *****
  • Join Date: Nov 2012
  • Posts: 722
  • Total likes: 35
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 2
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: SBA PPP and EIDL Small Business Loans (some money is forgivable)
« Reply #247 on: April 21, 2020, 11:50:48 PM »
Excluded from the forgiveness, not the loan calculation
Both, calc for obtaining and forgiveness, are calculated the same. Besides for 2.5 and 8 weeks.
If you focus on being a boss, you will never be a leader. Leaders lead people to growth and improvement.

Offline cgr

  • Dansdeals Presidential Platinum Elite
  • ********
  • Join Date: Aug 2017
  • Posts: 3820
  • Total likes: 983
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 5
    • View Profile
Re: SBA PPP and EIDL Small Business Loans (some money is forgivable)
« Reply #248 on: April 21, 2020, 11:51:12 PM »
Sure. That's what most small business owners including me is doing. You need to keep the same head count I think, not sure about this though, saw conflicting reports.

You need to retain payroll for the 8 weeks you are seeking forgiveness for. That's it.

Offline ilherman

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Presidential Platinum Elite
  • *********
  • Join Date: Jun 2013
  • Posts: 8862
  • Total likes: 164
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 35
    • View Profile
  • Location: Brooklyn
Re: SBA PPP and EIDL Small Business Loans (some money is forgivable)
« Reply #249 on: April 22, 2020, 12:10:11 AM »
Did you have non-payroll income before Q4? Schedule C or something similar? You can add that too
only k1
You can say what you think when you think what you say.

Offline cgr

  • Dansdeals Presidential Platinum Elite
  • ********
  • Join Date: Aug 2017
  • Posts: 3820
  • Total likes: 983
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 5
    • View Profile

Offline ilherman

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Presidential Platinum Elite
  • *********
  • Join Date: Jun 2013
  • Posts: 8862
  • Total likes: 164
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 35
    • View Profile
  • Location: Brooklyn
Re: SBA PPP and EIDL Small Business Loans (some money is forgivable)
« Reply #251 on: April 22, 2020, 12:30:51 AM »
You can say what you think when you think what you say.

Offline cgr

  • Dansdeals Presidential Platinum Elite
  • ********
  • Join Date: Aug 2017
  • Posts: 3820
  • Total likes: 983
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 5
    • View Profile

Offline chff

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Presidential Platinum Elite
  • *********
  • Join Date: Jul 2012
  • Posts: 5385
  • Total likes: 452
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 24
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
  • Location: NYC
  • Programs: All of them...
Re: SBA PPP and EIDL Small Business Loans (some money is forgivable)
« Reply #253 on: April 22, 2020, 12:40:33 AM »
Only because the richer chassidim will bail them out.
Not exactly. Those Yeshivas that get collage programs are usually money making and make a dinner only leshem mitzvah. They don't need rich chasidim to bail them out

Offline S209

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Presidential Platinum Elite
  • *********
  • Join Date: Jun 2016
  • Posts: 6675
  • Total likes: 2820
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 0
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
    • Gowns By Shevy
  • Location: Lakewood
  • Programs: Marriott Gold, Star Alliance Gold, Hyatt Explorist, Hertz PC, National EE, Rock Royalty Wild Card, Wyndham Diamond, MLife Gold, Caesars Diamond, Hilton Diamond, Uber VIP, IHG Platinum Elite, ANA Platinum, DDF Lifetime Prez Platinum Elite, AmEx Platinum
Re: SBA PPP and EIDL Small Business Loans (some money is forgivable)
« Reply #254 on: April 22, 2020, 01:22:53 AM »
Excluded from the forgiveness, not the loan calculation
Didnít you mention you were only applying for a loan amount you know will be forgiven? Just curious about that, if thereís something Iím missing
Quote from: YitzyS
Quotes in a signature is annoying, as it comes across as an independent post.

Offline S209

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Presidential Platinum Elite
  • *********
  • Join Date: Jun 2016
  • Posts: 6675
  • Total likes: 2820
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 0
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
    • Gowns By Shevy
  • Location: Lakewood
  • Programs: Marriott Gold, Star Alliance Gold, Hyatt Explorist, Hertz PC, National EE, Rock Royalty Wild Card, Wyndham Diamond, MLife Gold, Caesars Diamond, Hilton Diamond, Uber VIP, IHG Platinum Elite, ANA Platinum, DDF Lifetime Prez Platinum Elite, AmEx Platinum
Re: SBA PPP and EIDL Small Business Loans (some money is forgivable)
« Reply #255 on: April 22, 2020, 01:25:54 AM »
A) Being sarcastic with an Ad Hominem attack does not change the argument. You don't know how much I pay for Tuition or much I give in donations.

B) If parents knew there was a deficient every year and exactly how much, they would be much more willing to pay. I hardly think I would be "tempted to pull my kids out of the school". I would be more agreeable to the higher tuition costs.

C) Yes I understand that it's hard to raise money to cover costs for the yeshiva. But that doesn't mean that the same mosdos could acknowledge that we are in a difficult time. Are costs lower now? Yes. Are many of their expenses being paid for. Yes. Are families struggling more than usual? Also yes.

Just because I want the Yeshivas to acknowledge that we are going through a hard time doesn't mean that I don't understand that they usually have a hard time. I understand that the Yeshivas need to fundraise. Why are you getting all defensive when I ask the Yeshivas to acknowledge our hardships?
There is no equivalence. They send you a letter asking to chip in more because itís hard for THEM, so now YOU should contact them if youíre struggling, as I mentioned up thread. I hope they would work with you if you reached out and explained your predicament. Why should they reach out to offer you help you never indicated you need? Do you regularly volunteer extra funds to them without them asking?
Quote from: YitzyS
Quotes in a signature is annoying, as it comes across as an independent post.

Offline ilherman

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Presidential Platinum Elite
  • *********
  • Join Date: Jun 2013
  • Posts: 8862
  • Total likes: 164
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 35
    • View Profile
  • Location: Brooklyn
Re: SBA PPP and EIDL Small Business Loans (some money is forgivable)
« Reply #256 on: April 22, 2020, 01:29:07 AM »
That should work.
So if I dont have any payroll, just a k1, can i apply as well? or only when i have payroll can i add k1?
You can say what you think when you think what you say.

Offline ilherman

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Presidential Platinum Elite
  • *********
  • Join Date: Jun 2013
  • Posts: 8862
  • Total likes: 164
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 35
    • View Profile
  • Location: Brooklyn
Re: SBA PPP and EIDL Small Business Loans (some money is forgivable)
« Reply #257 on: April 22, 2020, 01:49:28 AM »
Q:           What are my payroll costs?

A:           

Compensation to employees, employer portion of payments for group health insurance, retirement, state taxes on compensation (State unemployment (very small amount of money here)), and your net income from being self-employed (Limited to $100,000) (does not include 1120S K-1 income)

 
Says clearly does not include k1 income
You can say what you think when you think what you say.

Online TBD

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Platinum Elite
  • *******
  • Join Date: Nov 2014
  • Posts: 1156
  • Total likes: 150
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 1
    • View Profile
  • Location: United States
Re: SBA PPP and EIDL Small Business Loans (some money is forgivable)
« Reply #258 on: April 22, 2020, 02:08:37 AM »
Don't think so. The question is "what is your average monthly payroll", and then they explain how you should go about figuring that out. Talk to your bank but my guess is they'll let you use Q4 '19 and Q1 '20, and divide that by 6 to get average monthly.
Applied by Paypal Yesterday, submitted just 2019 payroll records from payroll company, in the morning they approved already the loan and send me the loan documents to sign, now waiting for additional funds. Maybe can try to submit payroll records showing that it was only for that quarters with a letter of explanation and it will work.

Offline aspitz6342

  • Dansdeals Silver Elite
  • **
  • Join Date: Mar 2012
  • Posts: 70
  • Total likes: 1
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 0
    • View Profile
  • Location: Brooklyn NY
Re: SBA PPP and EIDL Small Business Loans (some money is forgivable)
« Reply #259 on: April 22, 2020, 02:47:46 AM »
My experience - and I ended up getting approved and funded:

1) Used entire 2019 payroll off W3.
2) Add all federal & state employer taxes.
3) Add health insurance premiums.
4) Add all 401K employer contributions.
5) Subtract excess of $100K payroll per employee. Note - the taxes, health & 401K may take you over the $100K per employee, but thats ok. Only look to make "gross wages" limit at $100K.
6) Divide entire sum by 12
7) Multiply by 2.5

Submit W3 & 941's as proof.

Can you use Q2,3,4 2019 & Q1 2020? Yes, but good luck getting your bank to work with that, especially if you 941's are not ready

I used Q2, 3, 4 2019 and Q1 2020

Provided 941s for the 3 quarters from 2019 and a report from my payroll company for the period I used.

I got approved and funded by crossriver