Poll

Is your shul secretly open right now?

Shul is closed and locked NYC
45 (40.9%)
Shul is "closed" but secretly functioning NYC
6 (5.5%)
Shul is officially not closed NYC
0 (0%)
Shul is closed and locked OOT
26 (23.6%)
Shul is "closed" but secretly functioning OOT
2 (1.8%)
Shul is officially not closed OOT
0 (0%)
Shul is closed and locked Lakewood
31 (28.2%)
Shul is "closed" but secretly functioning Lakewood
0 (0%)
Shul is officially not closed Lakewood
0 (0%)

Total Members Voted: 110

Author Topic: Is your Shul Secretly Open Right Now?  (Read 7115 times)

Online Lurker

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Platinum Elite
  • *******
  • Join Date: Jul 2019
  • Posts: 1501
  • Total likes: 871
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 0
    • View Profile
  • Location: As always, silence is NOT an admission of agreement on DDF. It just means that people lack the stamina to keep on arguing with made up "facts", illogical arguments, deceiving statements, nasty and degrading comments, and fuzzy math. - @yelped
Re: Is your Shul Secretly Open Right Now?
« Reply #120 on: April 12, 2020, 07:11:42 PM »
In all fairness, the DOJ has said they will be fighting state and local bans on religious gatherings. That said, I don't know why your Constitutional rights should be a factor in deciding whether or not to close your place of worship during a pandemic with lives on the line.
<--- See location

Offline chevron

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Platinum Elite
  • *******
  • Join Date: Dec 2013
  • Posts: 1955
  • Total likes: 252
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 2
    • View Profile
Re: Is your Shul Secretly Open Right Now?
« Reply #121 on: April 12, 2020, 07:14:57 PM »
https://www.sefaria.org/Mishnah_Berakhot.1?lang=bi

וְכָל הַנֶּאֱכָלִים לְיוֹם אֶחָד, מִצְוָתָן עַד שֶׁיַּעֲלֶה עַמּוּד הַשָּׁחַר. אִם כֵּן, לָמָּה אָמְרוּ חֲכָמִים עַד חֲצוֹת, כְּדֵי לְהַרְחִיק אֶת הָאָדָם מִן הָעֲבֵרָה:

People need to eat and unfortunately you can't eat at home without food.

No one needs to go to shul. Your yetzer Hara wants you to..

Your yetzer tov wants you to stay alive.

If you are going to shul in a pandemic, risking your lives and others, you're at the very least a chasid shoteh.

All your pilpul logic arguments here belie an absolute stupidity and underlines a series failure in frum education.

Common sense seems to be uncommon.


Online Euclid

  • Dansdeals Platinum Elite
  • ****
  • Join Date: Jun 2010
  • Posts: 416
  • Total likes: 214
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 1
    • View Profile
Re: Is your Shul Secretly Open Right Now?
« Reply #122 on: April 12, 2020, 07:16:27 PM »
צדיק ורע לכל

Offline chevron

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Platinum Elite
  • *******
  • Join Date: Dec 2013
  • Posts: 1955
  • Total likes: 252
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 2
    • View Profile
Re: Is your Shul Secretly Open Right Now?
« Reply #123 on: April 12, 2020, 07:19:43 PM »
In all fairness, the DOJ has said they will be fighting state and local bans on religious gatherings. That said, I don't know why your Constitutional rights should be a factor in deciding whether or not to close your place of worship during a pandemic with lives on the line.

That is a part of a broader issue of constitutional rights, state vs federal powers and checks and balances.

Just because right now it's critical, doesn't mean we should allow unchecked powers.

It's a very fundamental church and state separation.

With that said, the average frum guy in boro park and Monsey didn't take secular studies and cannot fathom why the government doesn't close shuls etc and thus finds a justification for going to shul because it's good enough for Joe dirt...


Offline aygart

  • Dansdeals Lifetime 10K Presidential Platinum Elite
  • *******
  • Join Date: May 2008
  • Posts: 10032
  • Total likes: 3776
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 7
    • View Profile
    • Lower Watt Energy Brokers
  • Programs: www.lowerwatt.com
Re: Is your Shul Secretly Open Right Now?
« Reply #124 on: April 12, 2020, 07:36:39 PM »
צדיק ורע לכל
more likely to fit into כנוס לרשעים רע להן ורע לעולם


ETA: I do not mean to say that every single person who joins any minyan fits into that description, but MANY most definitely do. The "I know better" attitude is not what hashem wants.
« Last Edit: April 12, 2020, 07:49:41 PM by aygart »
The thing with the hamster is that running on the wheel is actually what it is trying to do.

Offline aygart

  • Dansdeals Lifetime 10K Presidential Platinum Elite
  • *******
  • Join Date: May 2008
  • Posts: 10032
  • Total likes: 3776
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 7
    • View Profile
    • Lower Watt Energy Brokers
  • Programs: www.lowerwatt.com
Re: Is your Shul Secretly Open Right Now?
« Reply #125 on: April 12, 2020, 07:42:13 PM »
In all fairness, the DOJ has said they will be fighting state and local bans on religious gatherings. That said, I don't know why your Constitutional rights should be a factor in deciding whether or not to close your place of worship during a pandemic with lives on the line.
This is the quote:

Attorney General William Barr "is monitoring (government) regulation of religious services," said Justice Department spokeswoman Kerri Kupec on Twitter late Saturday. "While social distancing policies are appropriate during this emergency, they must be applied evenhandedly (and) not single out religious orgs."

If they are equally applied to all gatherings then they can include religious ones. If they are qually applied to all gatherings except food and the like that will also be able to include religious ones. Stop with the ignorant interpretations of the constitution.
It's a very fundamental church and state separation.
Separation fo church and state is not anywhere in the constitution.
The thing with the hamster is that running on the wheel is actually what it is trying to do.

Offline yochiek93

  • Dansdeals Presidential Platinum Elite
  • ********
  • Join Date: Apr 2015
  • Posts: 4486
  • Total likes: 74
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 3
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: Is your Shul Secretly Open Right Now?
« Reply #126 on: April 12, 2020, 07:42:31 PM »
Please stay out of this discussion. You'll never understand. Thank you.
are you seriously saying this?


Why are people so easily dismissive of people's lives, if it isn't their own?
Can anyone who believes it is right to daven with a minyan show me any mekor that one must in this situation?
Because seeing the death toll in real life I can't believe one exists.

Offline aygart

  • Dansdeals Lifetime 10K Presidential Platinum Elite
  • *******
  • Join Date: May 2008
  • Posts: 10032
  • Total likes: 3776
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 7
    • View Profile
    • Lower Watt Energy Brokers
  • Programs: www.lowerwatt.com
Re: Is your Shul Secretly Open Right Now?
« Reply #127 on: April 12, 2020, 07:43:23 PM »
are you seriously saying this?


Why are people so easily dismissive of people's lives, if it isn't their own?
Can anyone who believes it is right to daven with a minyan show me any mekor that one must in this situation?
Because seeing the death toll in real life I can't believe one exists.
It is the same arrogance shown here.
The thing with the hamster is that running on the wheel is actually what it is trying to do.

Offline yelped

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Presidential Platinum Elite
  • *********
  • Join Date: Mar 2015
  • Posts: 5206
  • Total likes: 525
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 14
    • View Profile
Re: Is your Shul Secretly Open Right Now?
« Reply #128 on: April 12, 2020, 07:47:45 PM »
The problem is that people who say stupid things are too stupid to realize that they are stupid and it shouldn't be said.

Offline aygart

  • Dansdeals Lifetime 10K Presidential Platinum Elite
  • *******
  • Join Date: May 2008
  • Posts: 10032
  • Total likes: 3776
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 7
    • View Profile
    • Lower Watt Energy Brokers
  • Programs: www.lowerwatt.com
Re: Is your Shul Secretly Open Right Now?
« Reply #129 on: April 12, 2020, 07:53:09 PM »
The problem is that people who say stupid things are too stupid to realize that they are stupid and it shouldn't be said.
Hold this rule for future use whenever you see someone say something which would be better left unsaid even if they truly do believe it. Their judgment about the thing itself is no better than their judgement about talking about it.
The thing with the hamster is that running on the wheel is actually what it is trying to do.

Offline avromie7

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Presidential Platinum Elite
  • *********
  • Join Date: Feb 2014
  • Posts: 5312
  • Total likes: 516
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 6
    • View Profile
  • Location: Lakewood
Re: Is your Shul Secretly Open Right Now?
« Reply #130 on: April 12, 2020, 07:54:57 PM »
I wonder what people who type "u" instead of "you" do with all their free time.

Offline YossieW

  • Dansdeals Presidential Platinum Elite
  • ********
  • Join Date: May 2014
  • Posts: 3710
  • Total likes: 247
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 447
    • View Profile
  • Location: Los Angeles

Offline ushdadude

  • Dansdeals Presidential Platinum Elite
  • ********
  • Join Date: Apr 2013
  • Posts: 4587
  • Total likes: 158
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 5
    • View Profile
  • Location: Long Island
Re: Is your Shul Secretly Open Right Now?
« Reply #132 on: April 12, 2020, 07:56:50 PM »
Who said it's illegal?
Did you read the actual text of the executive order? Nothing bans religious gatherings with proper social distancing.

The federal government did not ban it and the constitution would void such  an order that would do so. Social distancing in a grocery and USPS can be done but not outside in your backyard or in a shul.

I know of a very  recognized shul with a huge hall that has a guard that limits the amount of ppl entering and every one is spread out. Also no older ppl allowed in.
How do they do leining?
Trolls will always post stupid replies

Offline Chapshnell

  • Dansdeals Presidential Platinum Elite
  • ********
  • Join Date: Apr 2013
  • Posts: 4735
  • Total likes: 216
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 10
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
  • Location: BP
  • Programs: Delta Skypesos, AA Shilling, AS Pounds.
Re: Is your Shul Secretly Open Right Now?
« Reply #133 on: April 12, 2020, 07:58:21 PM »
...

Offline KSMH

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Platinum Elite
  • *******
  • Join Date: Jul 2018
  • Posts: 1959
  • Total likes: 252
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 8
    • View Profile
Re: Is your Shul Secretly Open Right Now?
« Reply #134 on: April 12, 2020, 07:58:29 PM »
How do they do leining?
The place I know of, everyone is Oleh from where they are standing, so if your at seat #45 you stay there and say the bracha from there.
Always praying for delayed baggage.