POLL: Wedding expenses in the frum Community - BH for simchos? or out of hand?

[Just A Jew]

THey are absolutely correct that the peer pressure is not comparable.

What about the assertion that a significant number of people are living above their means? I would think that goes hand in hand with the peer pressure.

[aygart]

What about the assertion that a significant number of people are living above their means? I would think that goes hand in hand with the peer pressure.

Of course there are, but in this regard I am not confident that OOT is any better.

[Just A Jew]

Of course there are, but in this regard I am not confident that OOT is any better.

Depends where OOT. Just as an observer, cars, clothes, kiddushim, simchos, accessories, and food (not grocery) all seem to be things which in-towners spend more the OOT. No solid data backing any of this up, just things I've seen.

[David61]

Of course there are, but in this regard I am not confident that OOT is any better.

I think the underlying issue is that when there are fewer people in your "community" you don't have to compete as much to feel like a "valued" member of the community. 

So people OOT often focus less on impressing others, and peer pressure is one key cause of overspending.

That said, other causes of overspending include growing up with abundance, increased materialism, poor financial education, limited earning power for many, large family size (ka'h), easy access to credit (including credit cards), exposure to marketing/advertisements, ease of online shopping, disproportionate rise in housing costs, and the recent inflationary pressures exceeding the pace of most peoples income.

[yr]

This is all bizarre.

 A little off topic but...

I live somewhat out of town within the tri state area,  that used to be considered low key, although that has been changing over the last 0 to 20 years.

I estimate that I need $40k - $50k for my son's bar mitzvah in a few years.

$8k kiddush (including party planner and catering)
$12k 2 meals for 75 people plus shalosh seidos and general cost of hosting- don't forget its out of town,  so lots of guest.

$6k tefillin, leining lessons,  clothing for bar mitzvah boy and family
$10k even party/affair including hall rental, catering, party planning, music,  photography etc.
$5k plus since I know I'm underestimating somewhere plus general inflation over the next few years


Thoughts?

[tzifanya54]

This is all bizarre.

 A little off topic but...

I live somewhat out of town within the tri state area,  that used to be considered low key, although that has been changing over the last 0 to 20 years.

I estimate that I need $40k - $50k for my son's bar mitzvah in a few years.

$8k kiddush (including party planner and catering)
$12k 2 meals for 75 people plus shalosh seidos and general cost of hosting- don't forget its out of town,  so lots of guest.

$6k tefillin, leining lessons,  clothing for bar mitzvah boy and family
$10k even party/affair including hall rental, catering, party planning, music,  photography etc.
$5k plus since I know I'm underestimating somewhere plus general inflation over the next few years


Thoughts?

Should be about half of that.

ETA: Can easily be half of that if you are willing to not go over the top.

[TimT]

I estimate that I need $40k - $50k for my son's bar mitzvah

Thoughts?

You don't

[MiInvstr]

This is all bizarre.

 A little off topic but...

I live somewhat out of town within the tri state area,  that used to be considered low key, although that has been changing over the last 0 to 20 years.

I estimate that I need $40k - $50k for my son's bar mitzvah in a few years.

$8k kiddush (including party planner and catering)
$12k 2 meals for 75 people plus shalosh seidos and general cost of hosting- don't forget its out of town,  so lots of guest.

$6k tefillin, leining lessons,  clothing for bar mitzvah boy and family
$10k even party/affair including hall rental, catering, party planning, music,  photography etc.
$5k plus since I know I'm underestimating somewhere plus general inflation over the next few years


Thoughts?

$8k Kiddush?! Do you need a party planner? You don’t need to get a caterer that charges $6k per meal or even close to that for Shabbos. Is there only one caterer in your town and do they charge that much?

[Yehuda57]

$8k kiddush (including party planner and catering)

Whatever you're paying your party planner, I'll do it for a quarter of the price. I'll start practicing everything I'll need to do now.

"Hey, dingbat, how are people supposed to get that onto their plates?"
"Yo, that steaming heap of heart attack needs a spoon."
"Sir, can you please put a spoon in the cholent."

Ready.

[Just A Jew]

$8k kiddush (including party planner and catering)
.....
$10k even party/affair including hall rental, catering, party planning, music,  photography etc.
Thoughts?

This is something I don't understand. A bar mitzvah needs to be celebrated, but why is everyone making 2 parties? Either make a really nice kiddush, or a big party and a small contribution towards the kiddush.

$12k 2 meals for 75 people plus shalosh seidos and general cost of hosting- don't forget its out of town,  so lots of guest.

This doesn't need to be as expensive, especially together with the 8k kiddush.

Look, I don't mean any of this to bash anyone. If you can afford a beautiful weekend with catered meals and big parties, may G-d bless you with continued abundance. But for these things to be the norm and for people to be struggling under the weight of these expectations, especially in communities where we can barely string together enough pennies for necessities like education, is beyond me.

[Dan]

This is something I don't understand. A bar mitzvah needs to be celebrated, but why is everyone making 2 parties? Either make a really nice kiddush, or a big party and a small contribution towards the kiddush.

+13.
Though I don't feel any communal pressure to do both.

[TimT]

Though I don't feel any communal pressure to do both.

Of course not. You’re probably setting the standards there.

[Sammy82]

+13.
Though I don't feel any communal pressure to do both.

We gave our son the option of either a bo bayom party or a trip to EY. I'm happy he chose the right one.
And then of course we sponsored kiddush (a little more than a regular shabbos but nothing crazy. I think it was $3k for the kiddush) and did a full shabbos for the extended family.

[yr]

The kiddush I listed $8k can easily be $1500 if I would just upgrade the shul kiddushba drop, agreed there.

The meals assume roughly $50 a plate times 75 times 2=$7500
Plus hall rental plus waiters plus random other stuff.

One option would be simply don't invite so many out of towers (not an option for my family situation)  or host the meals at home with homemade food, also not realistic in my 1600 sq ft house.

Also, I agree this is all easily done for way cheaper. I'm just reporting based on what I've seen in my area as well as what I know DW will take as a given.

[yr]

We gave our son the option of either a bo bayom party or a trip to EY. I'm happy he chose the right one.
And then of course we sponsored kiddush (a little more than a regular shabbos but nothing crazy. I think it was $3k for the kiddush) and did a full shabbos for the extended family.

Full shabbos can be very expensive once you out grow doing it your house with homemade food...

[whacked1]

This doesn't need to be as expensive, especially together with the 8k kiddush.

How much do you consider as nice without over the top? Note, he mentioned 75 are coming for the bar mitzvah. You need waiters etc.

[TimT]

The kiddush I listed $8k can easily be $1500 if I would just upgrade the shul kiddushba drop, agreed there.

The meals assume roughly $50 a plate times 75 times 2=$7500
Plus hall rental plus waiters plus random other stuff.

One option would be simply don't invite so many out of towers (not an option for my family situation)  or host the meals at home with homemade food, also not realistic in my 1600 sq ft house.

Also, I agree this is all easily done for way cheaper. I'm just reporting based on what I've seen in my area as well as what I know DW will take as a given.

If you’d be ok doing homemade food, would the hall let you bring your own food ?

[yr]

Unlikely. Plus it's no simple feat to cook for that many people,  and you still need waiters and hall rental..and your also prepping for a whole shabnos, finding places for your guest etc. And the food you cook isn't free either.

[davidd75]

I know many that either do a night weekday event OR a shabbos Kiddush
no need for both unless you want to go into debt
If you maintain strong you can persevere under peer pressure
Where does it say we must spend thousands of dollars for a proper simcah? 

[aygart]

Unlikely. Plus it's no simple feat to cook for that many people,  and you still need waiters and hall rental..and your also prepping for a whole shabnos, finding places for your guest etc. And the food you cook isn't free either.

And the time and effort spent cooking isn't free either. There are often cheaper options that are in the middle such as buying the food from a takeout.