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« Last edited by Iz on May 05, 2020, 11:24:47 AM »

Author Topic: 5 Towns/Rockaway Rabbonim Ban All Minyanim Due To COVID-19 (Split Topic)  (Read 86832 times)

Offline Afrages6

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Are you insinuating that the 5ts didn't get hit as bad as Brooklyn? Because that's simply untrue. 5ts got it worse
In terms of infections maybe.

Offline aygart

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Are you insinuating that the 5ts didn't get hit as bad as Brooklyn? Because that's simply untrue. 5ts got it worse
Does anyone have real numbers for this?
Feelings don't care about your facts

Offline Sam Finkelstein

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Does anyone have real numbers for this?

Dunno but I have relatives who are members of one of the big Shuls in 5Ts; said they were getting nonstop shiva emails.
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Offline yaakov35

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Dunno but I have relatives who are members of one of the big Shuls in 5Ts; said they were getting nonstop shiva emails.
Yup, wasn't on yeshiva world or on websites  but there were 100s of frum people that I'm aware of and I'm sure there are more than that, that were niftar, R'L

Offline yaakov35

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Does anyone have real numbers for this?
Not that many people tested and people that died didn't get media attention, so its very to hard to count these things.

Offline S209

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Was it ever actually confirmed that he had it? I don't believe so but I may be wrong
The NY Times good enough?
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/10/obituaries/rabbi-yaakov-perlow-dead.html
Quote from: YitzyS
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Offline ushdadude

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Dunno but I have relatives who are members of one of the big Shuls in 5Ts; said they were getting nonstop shiva emails.
Did the relatives that passed R"L live in 5T too? not trying to belittle any death chas vishalom

Offline ushdadude

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The NY Times good enough?
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/10/obituaries/rabbi-yaakov-perlow-dead.html
actually no. he died during covid. doesn't mean he died from it. i've heard from several board members that he was never tested. but it's really irrelevant because, unfortunately, the end result is the same.

Offline ushdadude

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Can we get an honest recap without any snarkiness?

Offline S209

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actually no. he died during covid. doesn't mean he died from it. i've heard from several board members that he was never tested. but it's really irrelevant because, unfortunately, the end result is the same.
The article states that cause of death was coronavirus.
Here are 2 more articles that specifically state cause of death was coronavirus. I also know someone was in touch with him his final week who said he was sick with COVID at home for a week before he was niftar.
https://www.jta.org/quick-reads/yaakov-perlow-leader-of-novominsker-hasidim-and-a-top-orthodox-rabbi-dies-of-coronavirus-at-89
https://www.theyeshivaworld.com/news/featured/1847887/bde-the-novominsker-rebbe-ztl-head-of-agudas-yisrael-moetzes-gedolei-torah-is-niftar.html
Quote from: YitzyS
Quotes in a signature is annoying, as it comes across as an independent post.

Offline ushdadude

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The article states that cause of death was coronavirus.
Here are 2 more articles that specifically state cause of death was coronavirus. I also know someone was in touch with him his final week who said he was sick with COVID at home for a week before he was niftar.
https://www.jta.org/quick-reads/yaakov-perlow-leader-of-novominsker-hasidim-and-a-top-orthodox-rabbi-dies-of-coronavirus-at-89
https://www.theyeshivaworld.com/news/featured/1847887/bde-the-novominsker-rebbe-ztl-head-of-agudas-yisrael-moetzes-gedolei-torah-is-niftar.html


Ok so conflicting sources. Doesn't really change the outcome

Offline skyguy918

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https://www.theyeshivaworld.com/news/headlines-breaking-stories/1858893/agudath-israel-releases-roadmap-and-instructions-to-reopen-shuls-minyanim.html

Haven't read through the whole thing yet, but doesn't seem as different than the OU/RCA guidelines as I was expecting.

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I heard Rabbi Feiner also sent out the ok on outdoor minyanyim. Anyone that can confirm?

Offline yaakov35

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I heard Rabbi Feiner also sent out the ok on outdoor minyanyim. Anyone that can confirm?
I know people in the shul that confirmed, anyone here daven there?

https://beta.5townscentral.com/2020/05/08/breaking-several-local-shuls-begin-to-permit-backyard-minyanim/
« Last Edit: May 10, 2020, 11:13:18 AM by yaakov35 »

Offline ushdadude

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I heard Rabbi Feiner also sent out the ok on outdoor minyanyim. Anyone that can confirm?


It's on 5t Central. Com

Offline stooges44

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I heard Rabbi Feiner also sent out the ok on outdoor minyanyim. Anyone that can confirm?

Yes, he sent the same email on Friday:



בס"ד


13 I'yar 5780 / May 7, 2020


Lichvod the wonderful members of our community שיחיו,

We sincerely hope that this letter finds you and your families healthy and safe, and managing well under the current challenging circumstances.

On Rosh Chodesh I'yar, we disseminated a letter addressing the numerous calls and requests that had been presented to all our community Rabbanim regarding the possibility of issuing clear guidelines, in conjunction with medical professionals, for the establishment of safe and legal outdoor Minyanim, with safeguards in place to ensure that there is no significant risk.
 
At that time, after much careful consideration, 57 community Rabbanim and Roshei Yeshiva communicated a united and painful decision to bid the entire community against the creation of any outdoor Minyanim, with no exceptions whatsoever. The decision was based on the fact that, in a pandemic, the overarching Mitzva of Pi'kuach Nefashos mandates preventing any risk or danger that could increase the likelihood of illness and loss of life in our community r"l. We wrote in that letter that we would continue to reassess and reanalyze this decision on a regular and ongoing basis, in consultation with medical professionals, as new developments unfold.

At the current point in time, B"H our community has now maintained a consistently low incidence of new cases for an entire 14-day incubation period. This fact, according to many infectious disease specialists, indicates that the decreased prevalence of disease is real and sustainable for at least the short term. Additionally, due to our community’s adherence to the lockdown, virus infectivity rates have gradually decreased, and the reproductive rate of the virus is now estimated at a level wherein, if we maintain current protocols of social distancing, the level of infection will continue its downward trend, B’ezras Hashem.

Based on these facts, after assessing the level of overall risk in our specific community, many doctors now advise that outdoor Minyanim under specific circumstances, within strict social distancing protocol (and adhering to NY State legal guidelines), could be safely conducted, and would not present any additional risk to the participants or the community. This information is relevant only for our community at the present time, and is not to be applied to any other community.   

Nevertheless, as the pandemic continues, and thousands in our community remain susceptible to contracting the virus, the paramount imperative of Pikuach Nefesh and our mandate to exercise utmost vigilance against risk remains critically important. As previously stated, when in circumstances of concern of potential sakanah, we are not obligated in Tefilla B'Tizbbur. Still, based on the above medical counsel, some Rabbanim will be providing clear guidelines for those individuals in their respective Kehillos who wish to daven with a safe and legal Minyan. Each Rav will endeavor to lead his individual Kehilla, based on demographics, location/block layout, and other factors.

We must all do our utmost to work together with mutual respect, achdus and a'havas Yisroel, and avoid any machlokes-- especially in an eis tzara. Our achdus will be marbeh Kevod Shamayim, and will surely provide a great shemira to our entire community.

The  following are the guidelines to ensure compliance with New York State law and strict adherence to protocols of social distancing.

Each family must remain solely on their own property, and at least 6 ft. away from any neighbor. We cannot currently allow Minyanim to form in a single yard, parking lot, or street, even when wearing masks and practicing social distancing [pursuant to the Governor’s Executive Order {202.18} prohibiting non-essential gatherings of ten people in one place - whether in a public or private location- and we must avoid anything of questionable legality (though we naturally deem Minyanim most essential in our lives)]. The only way a Minyan could currently be allowed is for each family to remain on their own property (e.g. porch, front, or back yard), and join with others in their immediate vicinity- where participants can see each other without leaving their individual properties. When safe and appropriate, a few individuals may stand in the adjacent street to complete a Minyan-- while practicing social distancing. [The Rabbanim will provide Halachik guidelines for requirements for "tzi'ruf" for such Minyanim, as well as various details of Hilchos Tefilla in these circumstances.]   According to these guidelines, many will be unable to join in a Minyan, as the location of their homes would preclude forming and joining a Minyan without leaving their property. Nevertheless, the above guidelines present the only safe and legal way that Minyanim can currently be allowed. 
Only OUTDOOR Minyanim are permitted. Under no circumstances may a Minyan be held indoors, even in the event of rain, and even for a Yahrzeit or other chiyuv. People may not gather on a single property or even on the street to schmooze before or after davening. One may certainly not make a 'Tikkun' or Kiddush, even for a Yahrzeit.
Although the wearing of masks is not required by law in such a setting, we nevertheless strongly encourage that masks be worn at all times when outdoors. As always, donning a mask does not allow any laxity in social distancing.
Individuals with underlying health issues, the immuno-compromised, the elderly, or anyone exhibiting COVID-like symptoms, may not participate in a Minyan. Children under Bar Mitzvah should not join.
K'rias HaTorah is only permitted if all a'liyos, leining, hagbah and gelilah are done exclusively by one family on their property. No one may bring siddurim, chumashim, chairs, or similar from one property to another.
Each Minyan should have a designated individual who is responsible to ensure that all guidelines are strictly adhered to. The individual should report regularly to his respective Rav.
We will, of course, continue to reassess and reanalyze this decision on an ongoing basis, in consultation with medical professionals, as new developments unfold. If there is, chas vi'shalom, any evidence of resurgence of new cases or a "second wave," we will act quickly to take any and all necessary measures to ensure the safety of our community.

Our responsibility to be proactive and vigilant against any possibility of health risk and sakanah extends to far more than just Minyanim. We must all continue to exercise zehirus and to take precautions to avoid any health risk, and fully observe social distancing protocols in any and all of our interactions. We continue to daven daily that this mageifa comes to an end soon, and we should be able to return to our Shuls and Yeshivos. May we be zocheh to see refu'os v'yeshuos bi'karov, and share only besuros tovos henceforth IY"H.

Wishing you and yours a wonderful Shabbos,

Rabbi Eytan Feiner

Rabbi Motti Neuburger
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Offline Lurker

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As always, silence is NOT an admission of agreement on DDF. It just means that people lack the stamina to keep on arguing with made up "facts", illogical arguments, deceiving statements, nasty and degrading comments, and fuzzy math.

Best of'd. This needs to be plastered on every page.
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Offline Sam Finkelstein

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Did the relatives that passed R"L live in 5T too? not trying to belittle any death chas vishalom

BH they are alive and well and safely away from NY at the moment.
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Offline reed

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BH they are alive and well and safely away from NY at the moment.

They were sitting shiva for people alive and well?

Offline Sam Finkelstein

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They were sitting shiva for people alive and well?

They got email notices from the shul.
Formula for success: rise early, work hard, strike oil. –J. Paul Getty