Poll

Do you know someone who has had Coronavirus after Pesach (NEW case)?

Don't know
I know in Tri-State area
I know other location in us
I know out of the US

Author Topic: Do you know someone who has had Coronavirus after Pesach?  (Read 26747 times)

Offline joeberg

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Re: Do you know someone who has had Coronavirus after Pesach?
« Reply #210 on: June 03, 2020, 12:01:39 AM »
Dr. Fenster sent out an email that all of the main Lakewood practices are collaborating to track new cases. They said there have been 5 new cases in the community over the last week, including one toddler in their practice who has been playing with many children.
Do you have a copy of the email?

Offline yesitsme

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Re: Do you know someone who has had Coronavirus after Pesach?
« Reply #211 on: June 03, 2020, 12:17:18 AM »
Do you have a copy of the email?
PLEASE DO NOT FORWARD THIS EMAIL OR POST IT IN A PUBLIC FORUM.
« Last Edit: June 03, 2020, 02:16:05 AM by yesitsme »

Offline elimmm

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Re: Do you know someone who has had Coronavirus after Pesach?
« Reply #212 on: June 03, 2020, 12:19:44 AM »
Don't all the local Hatzalas keep track as well? (Obviously that would only mean people who've had it really bad)

Online Euclid

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Re: Do you know someone who has had Coronavirus after Pesach?
« Reply #213 on: June 03, 2020, 12:42:34 AM »

THIS EMAIL IS INTENDED FOR FAMILIES OF KINDER PEDIATRICS
OR OTHER FAMILIES WHO SEEK THE GUIDANCE OF KINDER PEDIATRICS.
PLEASE DO NOT FORWARD THIS EMAIL OR POST IT IN A PUBLIC FORUM.
FAMILIES WHO WISH TO ADD THEIR EMAIL ADDRESS
TO THIS LIST SERVE ARE WELCOME TO DO SO.
Please delete this post.

Online Euclid

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Re: Do you know someone who has had Coronavirus after Pesach?
« Reply #214 on: June 03, 2020, 12:45:29 AM »
Don't all the local Hatzalas keep track as well? (Obviously that would only mean people who've had it really bad)
People are more cognizant of Covid-19 now and will seek medical treatment before they get to a state of needing Hatzolah (as opposed to Purim-Pesach).

Online yuneeq

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Re: Do you know someone who has had Coronavirus after Pesach?
« Reply #215 on: June 03, 2020, 01:53:55 AM »
Why are you lumping a reasonable position together with ridiculous ones? Here is my take on it from early on, when many others on DDF were saying there was no evidence it was spreading in the frum community:Feel free to take a different position but it doesnít do you any good to lump mine together with the wacko positions.

Forgive me for mocking you with the others. I donít think itís a reasonable position to take based on the lack of evidence spring your position, and the risk associated with getting it wrong. We know corona was basically eradicated from Lakewood, but not entirely, and certainly not for good. Which means if itís reintroduced, and there isnít herd immunity - and based on NYC antibody stats, is extremely reasonable to assume - we are risking lives needlessly with the lack of social distancing. Just like the virus took a while to spread quietly and finally become noticeable after Purim, with all the lockdowns it can take a while for the coin entail spread to rear itís ugly head once again.

Online yuneeq

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Re: Do you know someone who has had Coronavirus after Pesach?
« Reply #216 on: June 03, 2020, 01:56:58 AM »
You can make your point without your sick attitude

Repeating what others have mentioned is a sick attitude? While you calling for no social distancing based on absolutely nothing besides complete lack of self control is a beautiful attitude. Got it.

Online avromie7

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Re: Do you know someone who has had Coronavirus after Pesach?
« Reply #217 on: June 03, 2020, 10:40:00 AM »
Forgive me for mocking you with the others. I donít think itís a reasonable position to take based on the lack of evidence spring your position, and the risk associated with getting it wrong. We know corona was basically eradicated from Lakewood, but not entirely, and certainly not for good. Which means if itís reintroduced, and there isnít herd immunity - and based on NYC antibody stats, is extremely reasonable to assume - we are risking lives needlessly with the lack of social distancing. Just like the virus took a while to spread quietly and finally become noticeable after Purim, with all the lockdowns it can take a while for the coin entail spread to rear itís ugly head once again.
I don't think it's reasonable to completely ignore the many differences between now and before purim including
  • There is at least some immunity within our community
  • There is (and will continue to be) a limit on the number of people who can gather, even if it only applies to the biggest events (which are a very big cause of mass spreading)
  • There is still a requirement to wear masks in stores (which are high traffic areas)
  • People are still keeping some social distancing (some people more than others, but enough to at least help the situation)
  • High risk people are still being very careful
  • Regular people are aware to quarantine (or at least try to avoid contact with other people) if they have been exposed or have symptoms
  • Doctors are more aware and don't make fun if people if they ask if they think they have COVID
  • Testing is readily available to identify new cases so we will know if it starts spreading rapidly way earlier than last time

I'm sure some of these have a bigger effect than others, but to ignore the fact that they exist and change the equation significantly is intellectually dishonest.
« Last Edit: June 03, 2020, 11:23:36 AM by avromie7 »
I wonder what people who type "u" instead of "you" do with all their free time.

Offline aygart

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Re: Do you know someone who has had Coronavirus after Pesach?
« Reply #218 on: June 03, 2020, 11:21:46 AM »
I don't think it's reasonable to completely ignore the many differences between now and before purim including
  • There is at least some immunity within our community
  • There is (and will continue to be) a limit on the number of people who can gather, even if it only applies to the biggest events (which are the biggest cause of mass spreading)
  • There is still a requirement to wear masks in stores (which are high traffic areas)
  • People are still keeping some social distancing (some people more than others, but enough to at least help the situation)
  • High risk people are still being very careful
  • Regular people are aware to quarantine (or at least try to avoid contact with other people) if they have been exposed or have symptoms
  • Doctors are more aware and don't make fun if people if they ask if they think they have COVID
  • Testing is readily available to identify new cases so we will know if it starts spreading rapidly way earlier than last time

I'm sure some of these have a bigger effect than others, but to ignore the fact that they exist and change the equation significantly is intellectually dishonest.
All of these are good points other than 2.

The biggest causes of mass spreading are most likely offices, shuls, and batei medrash (and the like)
Just because things turned out a certain way doesn't mean you were right.

Online etech0

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Re: Do you know someone who has had Coronavirus after Pesach?
« Reply #219 on: June 03, 2020, 11:22:32 AM »
All of these are good points other than 2.

The biggest causes of mass spreading are most likely offices, shuls, and batei medrash (and the like)
IF they stay within the legal limits, there will be much less spreading than if they don't
Workflowy. You won't know what you're missing until you try it.

Offline aygart

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Re: Do you know someone who has had Coronavirus after Pesach?
« Reply #220 on: June 03, 2020, 11:28:03 AM »
IF they stay within the legal limits, there will be much less spreading than if they don't

Yeah that's number 4
Just because things turned out a certain way doesn't mean you were right.

Online avromie7

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Re: Do you know someone who has had Coronavirus after Pesach?
« Reply #221 on: June 03, 2020, 11:29:37 AM »
All of these are good points other than 2.

The biggest causes of mass spreading are most likely offices, shuls, and batei medrash (and the like)
I updated it. Weddings are definitely a big cause of mass spreading in our community, and sports games are probably a bigger cause of mass spread outside our community.

Shuls etc. are usually the same group of people, so if 1 person spreads it most of those who get aren't likely to spread it to a new group. Obviously the more groups and the bigger the group each person is part of the more it will spread. This is also the issue with minyan factories.
I wonder what people who type "u" instead of "you" do with all their free time.

Offline aygart

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Re: Do you know someone who has had Coronavirus after Pesach?
« Reply #222 on: June 03, 2020, 11:33:52 AM »
I updated it. Weddings are definitely a big cause of mass spreading in our community, and sports games are probably a bigger cause of mass spread outside our community.

Shuls etc. are usually the same group of people, so if 1 person spreads it most of those who get aren't likely to spread it to a new group. Obviously the more groups and the bigger the group each person is part of the more it will spread. This is also the issue with minyan factories.
Yes weddings probably are but are also mostly family and friends who already associate with each other.

That is unless they daven in more than one place, go to an office, learn in a differnt bais medrash or more than one.
Just because things turned out a certain way doesn't mean you were right.

Online Euclid

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Re: Do you know someone who has had Coronavirus after Pesach?
« Reply #223 on: June 03, 2020, 11:42:19 AM »
Shuls in Lakewood do not strictlyly contain the same group of people, e.g. people having relatives over for shabbos, chavrusas coming from across town to daven in the shul, amongst many other scenarios.

A scenario where it can leak: father davens in shul -> catches it from another member -> transfers to child who goes to camp/school ->  child transfers to 10 other kids/teachers -> transfers it to their respective families -> fathers spread it in shul.
« Last Edit: June 03, 2020, 12:11:23 PM by Euclid »

Online avromie7

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Re: Do you know someone who has had Coronavirus after Pesach?
« Reply #224 on: June 03, 2020, 11:58:02 AM »
Yes weddings probably are but are also mostly family and friends who already associate with each other.

That is unless they daven in more than one place, go to an office, learn in a differnt bais medrash or more than one.
Between 2 completely separate families and all of their family and friends who they don't regularly come in contact with, there is definitely spread to many people who wouldn't otherwise come in contact with each other.
Shuls in Lakewood do not contain strictly the same group of people, e.g. people having relatives over for shabbos, chavrusas coming from across town to daven in the shul, amongst many other scenarios.

A scenario where it can leak: father davens in shul -> catches it from another member -> transfers to child who goes to camp/school ->  child transfers to 10 other kids/teachers -> transfers it to their respective families -> fathers spread it in shul.
The point is to slow the spread and keep it under control, not to stop it completely. Of course there are other people from outside there, but most of the people are from the same group. Same goes for your scenario where it can leak, 5 steps takes much longer than 1 or 2 steps.
I wonder what people who type "u" instead of "you" do with all their free time.