Author Topic: Is celebrating thanksgiving issur or just a bunch of narishkeit? (Read 5537 times)

ReadsTheT&C · « **on:** November 23, 2011, 01:36:34 PM »

If so, dirabanan or diorayta? As far as I can tell from reading igros moshe, there's 3 issues: does the holiday constitute avodah zarah, it there a b'chukotayhem lo taylaychu prohibiton here, and lastly is it bal tosif? Rav Moshe pretty much summarily rejects 1 and 3 but leaves 2 as being problematic but not necesarilly issur here and finishes off with saying a ba'al nefesh wouldn't celebrate it. Curious to hear what you folks have learned on the subject. And please don't link to the Michael Broyde article.

Name Changed · « **Reply #1 on:** November 23, 2011, 01:46:40 PM »

You not celebrating the holiday, you are just making a party

The only problem I could see it as you mentioned - b'chukotayhem lo taylaychu prohibiton

JEWDA · « **Reply #2 on:** November 23, 2011, 03:44:41 PM »

Besides for #2 i wud say its like cholov yisrael, if ur a bal nefesh u keep it otherwise not.

Dan · « **Reply #3 on:** November 23, 2011, 03:55:42 PM »

Quote from: jewda on November 23, 2011, 03:44:41 PM

i wud say its like cholov yisrael, if ur a bal nefesh u keep it otherwise not.

Cholov yisrael is a d'oraisa.
I haven't seen anything in the torah against eating a nice dinner with your family on a day that most people have off from work.

AJK · « **Reply #4 on:** November 23, 2011, 04:09:46 PM »

Quote from: Dan on November 23, 2011, 03:55:42 PM

I haven't seen anything in the torah against eating a nice dinner with your family on a day that most people have off from work.

What about if there is a tree decorated with lights in the background?

(Yes, yes, I know... different holiday.)

Chaikel · « **Reply #5 on:** November 23, 2011, 04:13:08 PM »

Quote from: Dan on November 23, 2011, 03:55:42 PM

Cholov yisrael is a d'oraisa.

Pretty sure C"A is a derabanan

sky121 · « **Reply #6 on:** November 23, 2011, 04:22:42 PM »

We "celebrate" . The family gets together to enjoy a good meal and taking time to think of all we have.to be thankful for. It's just a nice relaxed evening to enjoy each other.

Sent from my LS670 using Tapatalk

dirah · « **Reply #7 on:** November 23, 2011, 04:33:09 PM »

Quote from: Chaikel on November 23, 2011, 04:13:08 PM

Pretty sure C"A is a derabanan

It is absolutely a d'rabanan.
Years ago, Thanksgiving coincided with 19 Kislev.
At the big Farbrengen at O.T., sliced turkey was served... They must have picked it up free somewhere...

Dan · « **Reply #8 on:** November 23, 2011, 04:43:53 PM »

Yup, thanks for the correction guys, too many farbrangens where the mashpi'im compare cholov stam to a shtik chazer...granted that I'm a brainwashed chabadnik.
But at any rate, Yoreh De’ah 115:1 (based on Maseches Avodah Zarah 35b). does require cholov yisroel and I don't think big family dinners are banned anywhere in shulchsn aruch. Heteirim for C"A are based fear of the US government (based on the tens of millions of illegal immigrants we have I'd say not too many care about our ineffectual government anymore) and its only "b'shaas hadchak...v'lo bishvil yoker me'at" in the words of r' moshe who himself didn't rely on it.

boruch · « **Reply #9 on:** November 23, 2011, 04:47:42 PM »

Quote from: Dan on November 23, 2011, 04:43:53 PM

Yup, thanks for the correction guys, too many farbrangens where the mashpi'im compare cholov stam to a shtik chazer...granted that I'm a brainwashed chabadnik.
But at any rate, Yoreh De’ah 115:1 (based on Maseches Avodah Zarah 35b). does require cholov yisroel and I don't think big family dinners are banned anywhere in shulchsn aruch. Heteirim for C"A are based fear of the US government (based on the tens of millions of illegal immigrants we have I'd say not too many care about our ineffectual government anymore) and its only "b'shaas hadchak...v'lo bishvil yoker me'at" in the words of r' moshe who himself didn't rely on it.

nice one, Dan !!

elikay · « **Reply #10 on:** November 23, 2011, 04:51:08 PM »

btw Rav Moshe has a tshuva about thanksgiving (not assur).

boruch · « **Reply #11 on:** November 23, 2011, 05:03:54 PM »

just be machmir and buy a 'empire' turkey !

JEWDA · « **Reply #12 on:** November 23, 2011, 05:17:00 PM »

Quote from: elikay on November 23, 2011, 04:51:08 PM

btw Reb Moshe has a tshuva about thanksgiving (not assur).

See 1st post.

Chaikel · « **Reply #13 on:** November 23, 2011, 05:27:44 PM »

שו"ת אגרות משה חלק או"ח ה סימן כ ד"ה ובדבר
ובדבר טענקס - גיווינג, כבר כתבתי לאחד בתשובה באג"מ ח"ב דאה"ע סימן י"ג, שאין לאסור מדינא לקבוע על יום זה איזה שמחה, כסעודת בר מצוה ונישואין, אלא שבעלי נפש יש להם להחמיר. אבל לעשות שמחה וסעודה לכבוד טענקס - גיווינג, יש וודאי לאסור מדינא

Dan · « **Reply #14 on:** November 23, 2011, 05:35:39 PM »

What about just making a nice dinner because people don't work that day and families can get together

boruch · « **Reply #15 on:** November 23, 2011, 05:46:22 PM »

Wondering the same.
Btw, is that the correct hebrew way to spell טענקס - גיווינ?

Chaikel · « **Reply #16 on:** November 23, 2011, 05:46:58 PM »

Quote from: Dan on November 23, 2011, 05:35:39 PM

What about just making a nice dinner because people don't work that day and families can get together

The teshuva he quotes in the one I posted basically says a ba'al nefesh shouldn't make a Bar Mitzva Seuda, or wedding on Thanksgiving.

Efsher Loimar thats seuda shel simcha davka, but stam family gathering ain lehachmir, but I think it's more of an YLORMV sitch.

JEWDA · « **Reply #17 on:** November 23, 2011, 06:13:42 PM »

Quote from: Dan on November 23, 2011, 05:35:39 PM

What about just making a nice dinner because people don't work that day and families can get together

I wud say its fine as long as it's for that reason

elikay · « **Reply #18 on:** November 23, 2011, 06:15:20 PM »

sorry I can't see the link from mobile

ReadsTheT&C · « **Reply #19 on:** November 24, 2011, 03:25:35 AM »

bottom line, YMMV