POLL: Living (1) below your means (2) above your means or (3) near income level?

[David61]

See poll above:
I'm curious what % of DDF users who are in the income-earning stage of life generally live (1) below their means, (2) above their means, or (3) about paycheck to paycheck?

Obviously this is easier to do with a higher income, though plenty people with modest incomes live below their means and plenty of people with high incomes live above their current income level.

The focus is not on the COVID-19 era (with many income challenges), but in years prior to that or just generally.

This is a spin-off of the thread on high wedding expenses in the frum community, which gravitated toward this discussion of living below ones means. https://forums.dansdeals.com/index.php?topic=115607.msg2227849#msg2227849 , and a recent article referenced in that thread: https://mishpacha.com/conversations/blog-unboxed/ .

P.s. By the way, according to the search function, that thread is the only place the word "means" shows up in the DDF.

[Shmulie]

Given that this is a deal's based website I would assume the poll would lean heavily towards savings

[David61]

Given that this is a deal's based website I would assume the poll would lean heavily towards savings

Given that some people churn CCs for miles to help make ends meet, I would not.

Aside from that, not sure I see the correlation. Don't people on a tight budget focus on deals even more? Or is deal-finding merely a pastime of sorts?

[Shmulie]

Given that some people churn CCs for miles to help make ends meet, I would not.

Aside from that, not sure I see the correlation. Don't people on a tight budget focus on deals even more? Or is deal-finding merely a pastime of sorts?

I don't think there are that many people who are churning miles to make ends meet

I think people with a tendency to spend time on a deal's website are the type of people that like to save money

I think saving is a personality trait I know people that have quite a bit of savings and always look for deals on everything I also know people who are heavily in debt but never look for deals because once you're in debt a little more is just a drop in the bucket they don't see the $5 here and the $5 there add up

[Dan]

I don't think there are that many people who are churning miles to make ends meet

I think people with a tendency to spend time on a deal's website are the type of people that like to save money

I think saving is a personality trait I know people that have quite a bit of savings and always look for deals on everything I also know people who are heavily in debt but never look for deals because once you're in debt a little more is just a drop in the bucket they don't see the $5 here and the $5 there add up

+1, though in the good old days people did churn for a living.

[Definitions]

P.s. By the way, according to the search function, that thread is the only place the word "means" shows up in the DDF.

I get 30 results.

Also I'm assuming you're looking for people that have a family, to reply to the poll? Since I don't meet that criteria I won't vote but I'll say I used to barely spend any money whatsoever I definitely spend more now but still well below my means.

[Euclid]

Are polls anonymous? Can OP/Mods see who votes what?



Also perhaps we need a budgeting thread...

[justmeha]

Given that some people churn CCs for miles to help make ends meet, I would not.

Aside from that, not sure I see the correlation. Don't people on a tight budget focus on deals even more? Or is deal-finding merely a pastime of sorts?

this

[Dan]

Are polls anonymous? Can OP/Mods see who votes what?

OP/Mods can't see who responded to polls. All I see is what everyone else sees.

[lubaby]

P.s. By the way, according to the search function, that thread is the only place the word "means" shows up in the DDF.

Or, you’re just not familiar with how the search function works:

-If you’re on the home page the search engine (top right corner of your screen) will search everything on the forum.
-If you’re in a specific board it will only search within that board.
-If you’re in a specific thread it will only search within that thread.
Easy as 1-2-3!

[Kobe Bryant]

IMHO i wouldn't categorize 5% as a "meaningful portion of one's income to savings in the future"

[farmbochur]

https://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2012/01/13/the-shockingly-simple-math-behind-early-retirement/

Assumptions:

You can earn 5% investment returns after inflation during your saving years

You’ll live off of the  “4% safe withdrawal rate” after retirement, with some flexibility in your spending during recessions.

[Dr Moose]

Given that this is a deal's based website I would assume the poll would lean heavily towards savings

I find that there's different reasons people join DansDeals. The majority are people looking for deals, but there's plenty of people who are just here for the travel. Being able to travel across the world in 5 star hotels and first class for next to nothing is what brought them here. They don't really care about the day-to-day savings.

[Kobe Bryant]

I find that there's different reasons people join DansDeals. The majority are people looking for deals, but there's plenty of people who are just here for the travel. Being able to travel across the world in 5 star hotels and first class for next to nothing is what brought them here. They don't really care about the day-to-day savings.

That is pretty presumptuous. Maybe the only way they can ever experience those luxuries is by paying "next to nothing" which is within their budget.

[Kobe Bryant]

https://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2012/01/13/the-shockingly-simple-math-behind-early-retirement/

Assumptions:

You can earn 5% investment returns after inflation during your saving years

You’ll live off of the  “4% safe withdrawal rate” after retirement, with some flexibility in your spending during recessions.

So at 5% one would have to work from age 20 to 86. Kind of negates the whole idea of saving for retirement

[Dr Moose]

That is pretty presumptuous. Maybe the only way they can ever experience those luxuries is by paying "next to nothing" which is within their budget.

Maybe you didn't understand what I was saying.

He made an assumption, being that this is a deal website, most people will be living within their budget because they're always looking for deals.

I replied stating, it's possible that someone is here so they use their miles to stay and fly in the nicest places. Just because they're using miles, doesn't mean they're living within their means. I was not in agreement that you can presume everyone here is living within their means just because it's a deals website.

[Kobe Bryant]

Maybe you didn't understand what I was saying.

He made an assumption, being that this is a deal website, most people will be living within their budget because they're always looking for deals.

I replied stating, it's possible that someone is here so they use their miles to stay and fly in the nicest places. Just because they're using miles, doesn't mean they're living within their means. I was not in agreement that you can presume everyone here is living within their means just because it's a deals website.

I understand your point.
It also doesn't mean they aren't....

[David61]

https://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2012/01/13/the-shockingly-simple-math-behind-early-retirement/

Assumptions:

You can earn 5% investment returns after inflation during your saving years

You’ll live off of the  “4% safe withdrawal rate” after retirement, with some flexibility in your spending during recessions.

The assumption (1) of 5% real rate of return (after incorporating loss from inflation) over a long period is conservative, (2) that your living expenses are not lower in retirement is conservative (especially for large families common in frum community) (3) that you need to retain 100% of the principal through '120' is conservative.

[farmbochur]

The assumption (1) of 5% real rate of return (after incorporating loss from inflation) over a long period is conservative, (2) that your living expenses are not lower in retirement is conservative (especially for large families common in frum community) (3) that you need to retain 100% of the principal through '120' is conservative.

Disagree with the assumptions? Feel free to adjust here. https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/12StNSMXZe7DB7pFJ38FRORMNu4d5HTqDvt0u_Jvnmiw/edit#gid=0

Long term financial planning should be conducted with a fair amount of conservatism. If / when projections prove inaccurate, it's much easier to make upward adjustments to your standard of living than the opposite.

[David61]

Long term financial planning should be conducted with a fair amount of conservatism. If / when projections prove inaccurate, it's much easier to make upward adjustments to your standard of living than the opposite.

With a measured amount of conservatism. Don't save all the good times for old age.