Are we going too far?

[PlatinumGuy]

Yes, it seems like Simon Cowell is the one who is judging who gets canceled and who doesn't.

Everybody gets to choose for themselves (and their company) who they want to cancel. That's exactly what freedom means.

[zh cohen]

Everybody gets to choose for themselves (and their company) who they want to cancel. That's exactly what freedom means.

You keep bring up the fact that these companies have the right to do what they are doing. That is completely irrelevant to the discussion of whether it is the right thing for them to do.

[PlatinumGuy]

That is completely irrelevant to the discussion of whether it is the right thing for them to do.

And you keep on ignoring the fact the constitution explicitly gives them the freedom to decide it's the right thing to do even if you think it's the wrong thing.

[Yehuda57]

And you keep on ignoring the fact the constitution explicitly gives them the freedom to decide it's the right thing to do even if you think it's the wrong thing.

This thread is about if we're going too far, not if we're behaving unconstitutionally.

[PlatinumGuy]

This thread is about if we're going too far, not if we're behaving unconstitutionally.

Do you want to cancel me?

[Yehuda57]

Do you want to cancel me?

What does that even mean

[Yo ssi]

Do you want to cancel me?

What does that even mean

Say yes and we'll find out.

[shabbosabba]

Do you want to cancel me?

I think that this begs the question of OP, "Are we going too far?" 

[YitzyS]

Do you want to cancel me?

No. Unlike the far left, I (as well as the majority of America IMO) believe that a person should not be shunned because of his ideas. To the contrary, meaningful debate leads to positive changes.

[PlatinumGuy]

No. Unlike the far left, I (as well as the majority of America IMO) believe that a person should not be shunned because of his ideas. To the contrary, meaningful debate leads to positive changes.

Really? Do you think people who deny the Holocaust shouldn’t be shunned? Do you think people who claim Jews drink Christian blood shouldn’t be shunned? Do you think people who claim it is immoral to buy products made in occupied territories shouldn’t be shunned?

Sounds to me like you agree with the far left that some people should be shunned, the only argument is who should be shunned.

It’s good that everybody gets to decide for themselves who to shun. That’s exactly what freedom is. If you think people are shunning the wrong people you have the freedom to attempt and change their mind.

[YitzyS]

Really? Do you think people who deny the Holocaust shouldn’t be shunned? Do you think people who claim Jews drink Christian blood shouldn’t be shunned? Do you think people who claim it is immoral to buy products made in occupied territories shouldn’t be shunned?

Sounds to me like you agree with the far left that some people should be shunned, the only argument is who should be shunned.

It’s good that everybody gets to decide for themselves who to shun. That’s exactly what freedom is. If you think people are shunning the wrong people you have the freedom to attempt and change their mind.

IINM, we went through this exact sequence of discussion before.

Yes, companies are private and they can fire whoever they want. But we hope the costumers have a healthy-enough moral compass to know when to go along with it and when to pushback and provide equilibrium against the far-left cancel culture voices.

[PlatinumGuy]

IINM, we went through this exact sequence of discussion before.

Yes, companies are private and they can fire whoever they want. But we hope the costumers have a healthy-enough moral compass to know when to go along with it and when to pushback and provide equilibrium against the far-left cancel culture voices.

I have no argument with that. If you want to take your business away from a company or vendor because you disagree with their opinions, you are perfectly entitled to do so. But don’t be incensed when the companies exercise the same freedom just bc you disagree with them.

[Yehuda57]

Evidently PG doesn't live in the East Coast and hasn't gotten his fill building snow men, hence the need for the straw variety.

[Randomex]

https://reason.com/volokh/2021/02/11/redefining-anti-semitism-in-the-gina-carano-controversy-or-just-inaccurate-reporting/

[aygart]

And you keep on ignoring the fact the constitution explicitly gives them the freedom to decide it's the right thing to do even if you think it's the wrong thing.

Wait, you mean the liberals feel that companies are constitutionally protected?

[PlatinumGuy]

Wait, you mean the liberals feel that companies are constitutionally protected?

Who cares what liberals feel? The law of the land is that companies are constituently protected.

We revel in our privilege to shun Disney when we don't like what they do, but complain when Disney exercises the exact same privilege to shun somebody they don't like. You can't have one without the other.

[aygart]

Who cares what liberals feel? The law of the land is that companies are constituently protected.

We revel in our privilege to shun Disney when we don't like what they do, but complain when Disney exercises the exact same privilege to shun somebody they don't like. You can't have one without the other.

Unless you are one of those who say that Cirtizen's United was ruled incorrectly.

FTR, in the past I have often argued how companies absolutely have the right to fire and censor as they please.

[PlatinumGuy]

FTR, in the past I have often argued how companies absolutely have the right to fire and censor as they please.

Then we agree, I just think many people aren't realizing that the exact privilege they are claiming is violated is actually being exercised, morally as well as legally.

[aygart]

Then we agree, I just think many people aren't realizing that the exact privilege they are claiming is violated is actually being exercised, morally as well as legally.

Sort of on the morally part of it. When the line is drawn too tight then it becomes an issue. I don't think that many would complain if someone was fired for saying a racial slur at someone or the like, but the idea of firing for anything someone says a bit contrvetial becomes ridiculous. I have no clue about the case at hand here, who it is about, or what s/he said, so I have no opinion at all about where this case fits.

The flip side of this is how so many of the same people who are pushing Disney to exercise this right are the same ones who were fighting to pack the court in order to take this right away from them.

[PlatinumGuy]

Sort of on the morally part of it. When the line is drawn too tight then it becomes an issue.

True, but fundamentally if you are entitled to self determine what's right and what's wrong, they have the same right. Many people will behave ridiculously as a result of that, but we like it because it allows us to behave in a way we think is right.

In terms of employment specifically there are many laws in place (many of which I think are actually unfair)