Author Topic: When To Keep Shabbos In Hawaii, Antarctica, Svalbard, Or In Orbit?  (Read 1065 times)

Offline sam28

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Platinum Elite
  • *******
  • Join Date: Jun 2010
  • Posts: 1641
  • Total likes: 40
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 0
    • View Profile
Re: Re: Maui Master Thread
« Reply #15 on: January 29, 2020, 01:13:32 PM »
No offense, but the
most Chumradig psak possible is, to just keep 2 days Shabbos.
Saying don't go is another way of saying I don't know the answer, and/or don't want/not capable to research the subject...

I would say that a nice big chunk of Dayanim haven't learned the subject thouroly, and some are even clueless.

Find a Ruv that you respect and is familiar to the matter, and ask for his opinion, and if he says to do 2 days, it's not that bad at all, as a matter of fact I think it's really unique and enjoyable.

Bottom line, whatever you end up doing, Maui is a stuuuning place, so just make sure to enjoy all the time you get.

I just had to get this off my chest...
#sighofrelief :)


I spoke to someone who knows good this stuff and he said if you only going for vacation why do wont to put yourself in to it . so the best is avoid being there for shabbes .

Offline sam28

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Platinum Elite
  • *******
  • Join Date: Jun 2010
  • Posts: 1641
  • Total likes: 40
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 0
    • View Profile
Re: Re: Maui Master Thread
« Reply #16 on: January 29, 2020, 01:14:42 PM »
He probably meant he didnt want to keep 2 days. Not that his Rav doesnt let him go at all......

and I have no problem keeping 2 days and staying there longer I wish I can

Offline mochjas

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Presidential Platinum Elite
  • *********
  • Join Date: Oct 2015
  • Posts: 8276
  • Total likes: 642
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 96
    • View Profile
  • Programs: Hyatt Globalist, Hilton Diamond, Marriott Titanium Elite, AA EX PLAT, Jetblue Mosaic, Qatar Gold, United Silver
Re: Re: Maui Master Thread
« Reply #17 on: January 29, 2020, 01:15:39 PM »
and I have no problem keeping 2 days and staying there longer I wish I can
my bad, but Sun- Thursday is more than enough

Offline yoohoo

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Platinum Elite
  • *******
  • Join Date: Feb 2015
  • Posts: 1067
  • Total likes: 85
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 3
    • View Profile
  • Location: United States
Re: Re: Maui Master Thread
« Reply #18 on: January 29, 2020, 11:07:42 PM »
Rabbi Taplin of Lakewood

http://www.datelineinhalacha.com/

http://www.datelineinhalacha.com/dateline_in_halacha.html

Do a page search for Hawaii

Very interesting.


I spoke to him before my trip and he convinced me to avoid staying for Shabbos.
« Last Edit: January 29, 2020, 11:17:25 PM by yoohoo »

Offline nirc

  • Dansdeals Platinum Elite + Lifetime Silver Elite
  • *****
  • Join Date: Nov 2014
  • Posts: 508
  • Total likes: 4
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 0
    • View Profile
  • Location: USA
Re: Re: Maui Master Thread
« Reply #19 on: June 16, 2020, 08:30:08 AM »
I've discussed these questions in the past here (Kauai thread maybe?). Everything has a clear answer - but one should always do as their LOR says. A LOR who doesn't know the answer will hopefully say so and/or ask someone who does.

Sadly, this is not always the case. I learned this the hard way.
Just like many Doctors won't admit they don't know something (in their field) and refer to you to someone else, so do Rabbanim.
It is very easy to take the "machmir" approach.
As I once heard many years ago it doesn't take a "big lamden" to be machmir, rather the opposite.

Offline 12HRS

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Presidential Platinum Elite
  • *********
  • Join Date: Jun 2013
  • Posts: 5068
  • Total likes: 483
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 6
    • View Profile
Re: Re: Maui Master Thread
« Reply #20 on: June 16, 2020, 01:48:24 PM »
No offense, but the
most Chumradig psak possible is, to just keep 2 days Shabbos.


I would say that a nice big chunk of Dayanim haven't learned the subject thouroly, and some are even clueless.

My Rov spoke with R' Eliyashav on this topic and his attitude was

I spoke to someone who knows good this stuff and he said if you only going for vacation why do wont to put yourself in to it . so the best is avoid being there for shabbes .

Hope he wasn't clueless

Offline Dan

  • Administrator
  • Dansdeals Lifetime 50K Presidential Platinum Elite
  • **********
  • Join Date: May 2008
  • Posts: 57931
  • Total likes: 5574
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 16442
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
  • Location: CLE
  • Programs: UA Global Services, AA Lifetime Plat, DL Dirt, SPG Plat, Hyatt Diamond, Fairmont Lifetime Plat, Hilton Diamond, Priority Club Plat, Avis Chairman, National EE, Hertz PC
Re: Re: Maui Master Thread
« Reply #21 on: June 16, 2020, 01:55:37 PM »
I spoke to someone who knows good this stuff and he said if you only going for vacation why do wont to put yourself in to it . so the best is avoid being there for shabbes .
Several Rabonim gave me the same answer about Antarctica and Shabbos.

Others pushed back and argued that we need real answers and a psak halacha. These are questions that existed in the past in Northern Russia and questions that will exist in a future where we travel into space. Saying don't go is taking the easy way out.
Save your time, I don't answer PM. Post it in the forum and a dedicated DDF'er will get back to you as soon as possible.

Offline ushdadude

  • Dansdeals Presidential Platinum Elite
  • ********
  • Join Date: Apr 2013
  • Posts: 4651
  • Total likes: 163
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 5
    • View Profile
  • Location: Long Island
Re: Re: Maui Master Thread
« Reply #22 on: June 16, 2020, 02:10:39 PM »
Several Rabonim gave me the same answer about Antarctica and Shabbos.

Others pushed back and argued that we need real answers and a psak halacha. These are questions that existed in the past in Northern Russia and questions that will exist in a future where we travel into space. Saying don't go is taking the easy way out.


you raise a good question (maybe spin-off thread?) how would traveling in orbit work? say shema every 15 minutes?
Trolls will always post stupid replies

Offline Mikes@Micro

  • Dansdeals Platinum Elite + Lifetime Gold Elite
  • ******
  • Join Date: Apr 2020
  • Posts: 872
  • Total likes: 292
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 0
    • View Profile
  • Location: US
Re: Re: Maui Master Thread
« Reply #23 on: June 16, 2020, 02:29:40 PM »

you raise a good question (maybe spin-off thread?) how would traveling in orbit work? say shema every 15 minutes?
Ilan Ramon kept shabbos based on where he took off as per psak from Chabad rabbi near his training center who he was in touch with.

There will prob be more /less mehadrin options
יש כאן מקום להחמיר
Quote or engagement  equals full throated endorsement and vote!
H/t PinchosL

Offline Dan

  • Administrator
  • Dansdeals Lifetime 50K Presidential Platinum Elite
  • **********
  • Join Date: May 2008
  • Posts: 57931
  • Total likes: 5574
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 16442
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
  • Location: CLE
  • Programs: UA Global Services, AA Lifetime Plat, DL Dirt, SPG Plat, Hyatt Diamond, Fairmont Lifetime Plat, Hilton Diamond, Priority Club Plat, Avis Chairman, National EE, Hertz PC
Re: When To Keep Shabbos In Hawaii, Antarctica, Svalbard, Or In Orbit?
« Reply #24 on: June 16, 2020, 02:41:25 PM »
Ilan Ramon kept shabbos based on where he took off as per psak from Chabad rabbi near his training center who he was in touch with.

There will prob be more /less mehadrin options
יש כאן מקום להחמיר
Likely based on the same questions as Antarctica:

https://www.dansdeals.com/points-travel/trip-notes/guest-post-halachic-zmanim-polar-regions-kosher-antarctica-cruise/
https://www.dansdeals.com/points-travel/trip-notes/trip-notes-antarctica-part-1-buenos-airesplanning-positioning-adventure-lifetime/
Save your time, I don't answer PM. Post it in the forum and a dedicated DDF'er will get back to you as soon as possible.

Offline Dan

  • Administrator
  • Dansdeals Lifetime 50K Presidential Platinum Elite
  • **********
  • Join Date: May 2008
  • Posts: 57931
  • Total likes: 5574
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 16442
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
  • Location: CLE
  • Programs: UA Global Services, AA Lifetime Plat, DL Dirt, SPG Plat, Hyatt Diamond, Fairmont Lifetime Plat, Hilton Diamond, Priority Club Plat, Avis Chairman, National EE, Hertz PC
Re: When To Keep Shabbos In Hawaii, Antarctica, Svalbard, Or In Orbit?
« Reply #25 on: June 16, 2020, 02:42:19 PM »

you raise a good question (maybe spin-off thread?) how would traveling in orbit work? say shema every 15 minutes?
Done. And I hope the ask the question myself one day.
Save your time, I don't answer PM. Post it in the forum and a dedicated DDF'er will get back to you as soon as possible.

Offline JuryDuty

  • Dansdeals Platinum Elite + Lifetime Silver Elite
  • *****
  • Join Date: Nov 2018
  • Posts: 639
  • Total likes: 94
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 11
    • View Profile
  • Location: New York
  • Programs: Hyatt Explorist
Re: Re: Maui Master Thread
« Reply #26 on: June 16, 2020, 02:51:48 PM »
What many LOR's will say is that Friday is just for d'oraisos which means that you can go swimming and do muktzah

This is the answer I got. I haven't been to Hawaii yet, but if you go through what you actually are allowed to do, it sounds like an amazing vacation day
Jury Duty: A time with nothing to do but chill and write a TR. Kinda like the beach without a view and an ocean breeze.

Offline Traveler718

  • Dansdeals Platinum Elite + Lifetime Silver Elite
  • *****
  • Join Date: Jun 2010
  • Posts: 591
  • Total likes: 165
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 0
    • View Profile
Re: When To Keep Shabbos In Hawaii, Antarctica, Svalbard, Or In Orbit?
« Reply #27 on: June 16, 2020, 03:04:35 PM »
My Rav was supportive of me going to Antarctica and meticulously answered all my zman-related questions, but has been very discouraging about going to Hawaii, even unhappy with the option of keeping 2 days l'chumra.

Offline Dan

  • Administrator
  • Dansdeals Lifetime 50K Presidential Platinum Elite
  • **********
  • Join Date: May 2008
  • Posts: 57931
  • Total likes: 5574
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 16442
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
  • Location: CLE
  • Programs: UA Global Services, AA Lifetime Plat, DL Dirt, SPG Plat, Hyatt Diamond, Fairmont Lifetime Plat, Hilton Diamond, Priority Club Plat, Avis Chairman, National EE, Hertz PC
Re: When To Keep Shabbos In Hawaii, Antarctica, Svalbard, Or In Orbit?
« Reply #28 on: June 16, 2020, 03:16:25 PM »
My Rav was supportive of me going to Antarctica and meticulously answered all my zman-related questions, but has been very discouraging about going to Hawaii, even unhappy with the option of keeping 2 days l'chumra.
Not sure why there would be a difference?
I'd think that Antarctica would be more problematic, had our trip not had the Falklands detour.
Save your time, I don't answer PM. Post it in the forum and a dedicated DDF'er will get back to you as soon as possible.

Offline Joel

  • Dansdeals Presidential Platinum Elite
  • ********
  • Join Date: May 2018
  • Posts: 2982
  • Total likes: 411
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 41
    • View Profile
  • Location: NYC
  • Programs: Hilton Diamond, Wyndham Diamond, Hyatt Explorist, Marriott Gold, IHG Platinum, National EE, Hertz PC
Re: Re: Maui Master Thread
« Reply #29 on: June 16, 2020, 03:36:18 PM »
Just like many Doctors won't admit they don't know something (in their field) and refer to you to someone else, so do Rabbanim.
It is very easy to take the "machmir" approach.
As I once heard many years ago it doesn't take a "big lamden" to be machmir, rather the opposite.
Knowing this I knew i had to ask someone who is well versed in (specialty) not every day question.
 
And indeed this was his answer told me not to drive and be machmir on d'oraisos
What many LOR's will say is that Friday is just for d'oraisos which means that you can go swimming and do muktzah (tefillin) etc. which are only Rabbinic issues.