Author Topic: The Post-Trump World  (Read 55010 times)

Online aygart

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Re: The Post-Trump World
« Reply #140 on: October 30, 2020, 05:24:26 PM »
No doubt
And by recently i mean within the last30 years
Feelings don't care about your facts

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Re: The Post-Trump World
« Reply #141 on: October 30, 2020, 05:28:07 PM »
Who said more or less? You said they don't have guns. Fewer is not the same as not having.
So when I said left wing rioters don't have guns, you're interpreting it as not a single one of them have guns in order to discredit the statement by showing some of them do? Obviously it was a figure of speech to claim they are less armed than the right wing, which I've brought data to suggest.

I am not following the logic of publicly traded companies not losing anything. Are you justifying stealing from them? Do you have any data to back up the premise that they only loot public companies? Are you justifying looting?
Never justified riots. I said their impact on society is smaller. As an example, the looting of publicly traded companies doesn't really have any impact. The other looting is absolutely condemnable but it's impact is very minor. The US produces $20T per year. They looted $5b? That's 1/4,000. It's wrong & horrible but the impact should be taken in the correct proportion.
״וזה כלל גדול: שישנא אדם כל דבר שקר. וכל מה שיוסיף שנאה לדרכי השקר – יוסיף אהבה לתורה.״ - אורחות צדיקים

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Re: The Post-Trump World
« Reply #142 on: October 30, 2020, 05:31:20 PM »
...and almost exclusively without guns.
But most definitely not there
Feelings don't care about your facts

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Re: The Post-Trump World
« Reply #143 on: October 30, 2020, 05:34:42 PM »


So when I said left wing rioters don't have guns, you're interpreting it as not a single one of them have guns in order to discredit the statement by showing some of them do? Obviously it was a figure of speech to claim they are less armed than the right wing, which I've brought data to suggest.
Never justified riots. I said their impact on society is smaller. As an example, the looting of publicly traded companies doesn't really have any impact. The other looting is absolutely condemnable but it's impact is very minor. The US produces $20T per year. They looted $5b? That's 1/4,000. It's wrong & horrible but the impact should be taken in the correct proportion.
Once there are guns on both sides you need to explain then the remainder is something to discuss. A higher protein does not mean a higher likelihood to root with guns. A higher tendency to gun violence might.

Proportion to what? Why does it even get measured compared to IS output?
Feelings don't care about your facts

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Re: The Post-Trump World
« Reply #144 on: October 30, 2020, 05:35:38 PM »
I find you more delusional
I don't know if it's intentional or not, but you're misunderstanding me saying something is possible, or more likely than something else, as saying something is probable. So let me be clear, I don't think anything dramatic will happen. If Trump wins, the left will start some protests/riots whenever the next police brutality event happens, which won't take long. If Biden wins, Trump will kvetch that the election was stolen but nobody will really take him seriously. That doesn't justify his rhetoric, which does raise a small possibility of his supporters taking dangerous action.
״וזה כלל גדול: שישנא אדם כל דבר שקר. וכל מה שיוסיף שנאה לדרכי השקר – יוסיף אהבה לתורה.״ - אורחות צדיקים

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Re: The Post-Trump World
« Reply #145 on: October 30, 2020, 05:35:54 PM »
You got nutcases at both ends and the difference is the nutcases on the right end are armed by a large margin.
Look at some of the rallies where these nut cases come fully armed.
This is just a fact.
Only on DDF does 24/6 mean 24/5/half/half

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Re: The Post-Trump World
« Reply #146 on: October 30, 2020, 05:36:14 PM »
You got nutcases at both ends and the difference is the nutcases on the right end are armed by a large margin.
Look at some of the rallies where these nut cases come fully armed.
This is just a fact.
Exactly.
״וזה כלל גדול: שישנא אדם כל דבר שקר. וכל מה שיוסיף שנאה לדרכי השקר – יוסיף אהבה לתורה.״ - אורחות צדיקים

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Re: The Post-Trump World
« Reply #147 on: October 31, 2020, 08:32:47 PM »

Probably. Welcome to bring data disprove me. You'll find it more difficult than calling me names.
Seems like you didn't even bother reading what you yourself brought a source. It very explicitly states that it is going based solely on REGISTERED GUNS. How are we supposed to have any sort of honest conversation when you make assumptions about data that the source itself says otherwise?
Feelings don't care about your facts

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Re: The Post-Trump World
« Reply #148 on: October 31, 2020, 08:39:28 PM »
Is there a single left wing organization/movement that encourages its members to bear arms? Because we all know there are plenty of those on the right.

This is obvious and well-known. But since you call it non-sense, here is the data


Large, cross-state, right-wing militia movements4

Name   Type   Est. Size   Active Spaces   History of Violence   Violence Potential
Three Percenters   Mainstream militia   Large   Nationwide, organized at assorted intervals (depending upon group)   High   High
Oath Keepers   Mainstream militia   Moderate   Nationwide, mostly gathering on event basis   Moderate   Moderate
Light Foot Militia   Mainstream militia   Large   Nationwide, divided by region of state   Low   Moderate
Civilian Defense Force   Mainstream militia   Small   Nationwide, mostly online   Low   Low
American Contingency   Mainstream militia   Moderate   Nationwide, mostly online, divided by region   Low   Low
Proud Boys   Right-wing street movement   Large   Nationwide, especially near cities   Very High   Very High
Patriot Prayer   Right-wing street movement   Moderate   Pacific Northwest and West Coast   High   High
Boogaloo Bois   Devolved right-wing libertarian modality   Moderate   Nationwide, highly devolved   Very High   Very High
People’s Rights   Devolved right-wing libertarian modality   Large   Nationally dispersed, broken down into sub-state regions   Low   Moderate



https://acleddata.com/2020/10/21/standing-by-militias-election/





Seems like you didn't even bother reading what you yourself brought a source. It very explicitly states that it is going based solely on REGISTERED GUNS. How are we supposed to have any sort of honest conversation when you make assumptions about data that the source itself says otherwise?
That data is irrelevant to my original claim. You were the one brought it up, the burden of citing it is on you.
״וזה כלל גדול: שישנא אדם כל דבר שקר. וכל מה שיוסיף שנאה לדרכי השקר – יוסיף אהבה לתורה.״ - אורחות צדיקים

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Re: The Post-Trump World
« Reply #149 on: October 31, 2020, 08:46:34 PM »
Is there a single left wing organization/movement that encourages its members to bear arms? Because we all know there are plenty of those on the right.

This is obvious and well-known. But since you call it non-sense, here is the data


Large, cross-state, right-wing militia movements4

Name   Type   Est. Size   Active Spaces   History of Violence   Violence Potential
Three Percenters   Mainstream militia   Large   Nationwide, organized at assorted intervals (depending upon group)   High   High
Oath Keepers   Mainstream militia   Moderate   Nationwide, mostly gathering on event basis   Moderate   Moderate
Light Foot Militia   Mainstream militia   Large   Nationwide, divided by region of state   Low   Moderate
Civilian Defense Force   Mainstream militia   Small   Nationwide, mostly online   Low   Low
American Contingency   Mainstream militia   Moderate   Nationwide, mostly online, divided by region   Low   Low
Proud Boys   Right-wing street movement   Large   Nationwide, especially near cities   Very High   Very High
Patriot Prayer   Right-wing street movement   Moderate   Pacific Northwest and West Coast   High   High
Boogaloo Bois   Devolved right-wing libertarian modality   Moderate   Nationwide, highly devolved   Very High   Very High
People’s Rights   Devolved right-wing libertarian modality   Large   Nationally dispersed, broken down into sub-state regions   Low   Moderate



https://acleddata.com/2020/10/21/standing-by-militias-election/




That data is irrelevant to my original claim. You were the one brought it up, the burden of citing it is on you.

What do militias have to do with anything?

If that data does not include illegal guns then it is not very meaningful. There are a fairly high number of unregistered guns in the hands of violent people in heavily D districts. How do they compare to others? I don't know, but your data is meaningless and when I asked you about it you represented it as saying something it says te exact opposite of based on a presumption.
Feelings don't care about your facts

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Re: The Post-Trump World
« Reply #150 on: October 31, 2020, 08:49:27 PM »
Honestly, what I am more shocked about is your downplaying of looting because of its portion of GDP. You are making it as if that is the issue with looting. The issue is that it is STEALING. I guarantee there was absolutely no cheshbon made about who they were stealing from. That you can downplay that speaks volumes.
Feelings don't care about your facts

Offline PlatinumGuy

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Re: The Post-Trump World
« Reply #151 on: October 31, 2020, 08:52:54 PM »
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/elections/2020/10/28/election-day-violence-voter-concern-trump-biden-exclusive-poll/3702477001/

Since the last election, confidence that there will be a peaceful transfer of power has eroded, perhaps because Trump has refused to commit to that. At this point in 2016, 40% of Americans were "very confident" about a peaceful transfer of power. Now just 23% are. Nearly 4 in 10 have little confidence that will happen.



you represented it as saying something it says te exact opposite of based on a presumption.
The word I used was 'probably'. No misrepresentation at all.

What do militias have to do with anything?
The small fact that the risk of militias taking to the street is from the right more than the left, which you spent the last page trying to claim is 'nonsense'

Honestly, what I am more shocked about is your downplaying of looting because of its portion of GDP. You are making it as if that is the issue with looting. The issue is that it is STEALING. I guarantee there was absolutely no cheshbon made about who they were stealing from. That you can downplay that speaks volumes.
Not sure what you're trying to say. Stealing is wrong. I condemn it 100% as much as you do. The issue isn't how wrong something is, the issue is how much impact it has on me (and the rest of the country). Somebody falling a sleep on the steering wheel may be 100% innocent, but much more dangerous than somebody driving 2x the speed limit. I've said clearly riots are more illegal than armed milita rallies. It doesn't make them less scary.
״וזה כלל גדול: שישנא אדם כל דבר שקר. וכל מה שיוסיף שנאה לדרכי השקר – יוסיף אהבה לתורה.״ - אורחות צדיקים

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Re: The Post-Trump World
« Reply #152 on: October 31, 2020, 08:57:08 PM »
The small fact that the risk of militias taking to the street is from the right more than the left, which you spent the last page trying to claim is 'nonsense'

But why are we limiting only to militias? If you limit to mostly right wing groups then it will be mostly right wing because of your sample bias and not anything else.
Feelings don't care about your facts

Offline zh cohen

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Re: The Post-Trump World
« Reply #153 on: October 31, 2020, 09:12:17 PM »
The bottom line is BLM protests destroy stores and malls, which has near zero impact on the economy as a whole.

How the real estate market in downtown Portland doing?

Looted publicly traded companies don't actually lose anything.

Except the desire to open stores in locations where they are likely to be looted.

It's also less conceivable that the left will claim the result are different that SCOTUS rules they are.

What, other that your political preferences, makes it less conceivable? Is it the great respect that the left has shown for the institution?

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Re: The Post-Trump World
« Reply #154 on: October 31, 2020, 09:15:42 PM »
What, other that your political preferences, makes it less conceivable? Is it the great respect that the left has shown for the institution?
The fact that Donald Trump is the one claiming the election results will be illegitimate if not known by Nov 3
״וזה כלל גדול: שישנא אדם כל דבר שקר. וכל מה שיוסיף שנאה לדרכי השקר – יוסיף אהבה לתורה.״ - אורחות צדיקים

Offline good sam

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Re: The Post-Trump World
« Reply #155 on: October 31, 2020, 09:18:51 PM »
The fact that Donald Trump is the one claiming the election results will be illegitimate if not known by Nov 3
How can you know in advance it will be legitimate? He's leaving his options open. Who wouldn't?

He said the same thing about the 2016 GOP primaries and general. Hillary called it horrifying, but it was the left who did not accept the results of the election.
If you don't care why would you comment?
HT: DMYD

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Re: The Post-Trump World
« Reply #156 on: October 31, 2020, 09:24:20 PM »
How can you know in advance it will be legitimate? He's leaving his options open. Who wouldn't?

He said the same thing about the 2016 GOP primaries and general. Hillary called it horrifying, but it was the left who did not accept the results of the election.
The left never said the results are false and HRC is the legitimate president. You know in advance the American system will reach a valid conclusion. Calling it into question is precisely the problem.
״וזה כלל גדול: שישנא אדם כל דבר שקר. וכל מה שיוסיף שנאה לדרכי השקר – יוסיף אהבה לתורה.״ - אורחות צדיקים

Offline good sam

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Re: The Post-Trump World
« Reply #157 on: October 31, 2020, 09:33:01 PM »


The left never said the results are false and HRC is the legitimate president.
They did so continuously.


The left never said the results are false and HRC is the legitimate president. You know in advance the American system will reach a valid conclusion. Calling it into question is precisely the problem.
You can't know that.
If you don't care why would you comment?
HT: DMYD

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Re: The Post-Trump World
« Reply #158 on: October 31, 2020, 10:13:47 PM »
They did so continuously.
So it should be easy for you to post links from CNN to backup your assertion.
You can have your own opinions but not your own facts!  :P
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Offline chinagel

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Re: The Post-Trump World
« Reply #159 on: October 31, 2020, 10:18:25 PM »
So it should be easy for you to post links from CNN to backup your assertion.
You can have your own opinions but not your own facts!  :P
I thought CNN was center?