Lakewood covid cases

[hllulbh1]

If the scientific community is still undecided on antibodies/herd immunity, not sure why the Lakewood frum community gets to be the arbitrator on this.

An Arbitrator is someone who abandons Arby's for Roy Rogers. Arbiter is the Lakewood frum community.

It is wishful thinking to assume any community has reached herd immunity for the Novel coronavirus. IMO it is stupid for anyone not to wear a mask based on an assumption that herd immunity has been achieved.

From Mayo clinic (https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/coronavirus/in-depth/herd-immunity-and-coronavirus/art-20486808):
Herd immunity can also be reached when a sufficient number of people in the population have recovered from a disease and have developed antibodies against future infection. For example, those who survived the 1918 flu (influenza) pandemic were later immune to infection with the H1N1 flu, a subtype of influenza A. During the 2009-10 flu season, H1N1 caused the respiratory infection in humans that was commonly referred to as swine flu.

However, there are some major problems with relying on community infection to create herd immunity to the virus that causes COVID-19. First, it isn't yet clear if infection with the COVID-19 virus makes a person immune to future infection.

Research suggests that after infection with some coronaviruses, reinfection with the same virus — though usually mild and only happening in a fraction of people — is possible after a period of months or years. Further research is needed to determine the protective effect of antibodies to the virus in those who have been infected.

Even if infection with the COVID-19 virus creates long-lasting immunity, a large number of people would have to become infected to reach the herd immunity threshold. Experts estimate that in the U.S., 70% of the population — more than 200 million people — would have to recover from COVID-19 to halt the epidemic. If many people become sick with COVID-19 at once, the health care system could quickly become overwhelmed. This amount of infection could also lead to serious complications and millions of deaths, especially among older people and those who have chronic conditions.

[shaulyaakov]

I could be wrong, and I'm not about to scour his posts, but I don't believe he made a blanket statement that antibodies aren't protective at all. I believe he said that they cannot be relied upon, because a) you may still be able to transmit the disease with antibodies, and b) we have no idea how long they confer immunity yet. To make blanket statements to the contrary, giving people the idea that they absolutely cannot get the virus twice, can prove to be a very deadly assumption.

This is all I'm saying.

[Euclid]

6 new cases via OCHD.

[chevron]

There are many people who argue seatbelts are uncomfortable.

[Baruch]

There are many people who argue seatbelts are uncomfortable.

And there used to be even more.
LEADERSHIP is needed for covid protective measures to be the new seatbelts.

[shaulyaakov]

What's clear to me is there's just a lot of moving of the goal posts. First it was a few isolated cases, then it was a few weddings but it was all under control, then it was minimal community spread, now it's spreading, but higher risk people can stay at home.

By next week, will it be "but the ICUs still have room" and so on? In what way are we not headed on a collusion course when everyone gets together for Rosh Hashanah?

[bmgkollelguy]

why dont you ask the local doctors privately and see what they say? I did they dont seem nervous

[Yard sale]

What's clear to me is there's just a lot of moving of the goal posts. First it was a few isolated cases, then it was a few weddings but it was all under control, then it was minimal community spread, now it's spreading, but higher risk people can stay at home.

By next week, will it be "but the ICUs still have room" and so on? In what way are we not headed on a collusion course when everyone gets together for Rosh Hashanah?

There are at a minimum hundreds of cases circulating in Lakewood.

If people believe there are hundreds and perhaps thousands of cases ongoing in Lakewood with virtually no hospitalizations and few Hatzolah calls perhaps that is what is leading them to have such a cavalier attitude.....

[Lurker]

If people believe there are hundreds and perhaps thousands of cases ongoing in Lakewood with virtually no hospitalizations and few Hatzolah calls perhaps that is what is leading them to have such a cavalier attitude.....

145 confirmed cases in the last 8 days. Hundreds of cases there are. The fallacy is comparing these numbers to post-Purim, when they are more likely to be similar to the period right before Purim.

[shaulyaakov]

145 confirmed cases in the last 8 days. Hundreds of cases there are. The fallacy is comparing these numbers to post-Purim, when they are more likely to be similar to the period right before Purim.

It's a good thing there are no holidays similar to Purim in that everyone comes to shul to listen to something that could ch"v accelerate the spread.

[aygart]

why dont you ask the local doctors privately and see what they say? I did they dont seem nervous

How many did you ask? I have spoken to more than one who didn't just seem nervous but told me that he is. Is this just your impression or were they specific?

[Euclid]

If people believe there are hundreds and perhaps thousands of cases ongoing in Lakewood with virtually no hospitalizations and few Hatzolah calls perhaps that is what is leading them to have such a cavalier attitude.....

Hatzolah has been getting multiple Covid calls a day.

[Euclid]

why dont you ask the local doctors privately and see what they say? I did they dont seem nervous

I know at least 4 doctors that are very concerned.

[shaulyaakov]

Hatzolah has been getting multiple Covid calls a day.

It's fine. People will say what they want to avoid wearing masks and distancing.

[bmgkollelguy]

spoke to 2 as well as what would be called askanim who spoke to others as well as the rabbis

[Euclid]

spoke to 2 as well as what would be called askanim who spoke to others as well as the rabbis

Oh we're well aware what the rabbis and askanim (and some doctors) are advocating. It's not a secret at this point - "let 'er rip and hope there aren't too many casualties."

I'm just mentioning that this is far from the consensus amongst Lakewood doctors.

[shaulyaakov]

Are there any plans to accommodate higher risk people at minyanim on rosh Hashanah, or are people on their own?

[simplicity]

I tested positive today, but never had it before

[Euclid]

Are there any plans to accommodate higher risk people at minyanim on rosh Hashanah, or are people on their own?

https://hefkervelt.blogspot.com/2020/09/minyanin-for-yomim-noraim-urgently.html

[dasmo801]

why dont you ask the local doctors privately and see what they say? I did they dont seem nervous

I dont believe that there is a single health professional in Lakewood who is not very concerned by the trajectory that we are on. Did they share with you the basis for their non concern?