Lakewood covid cases

[Lurker]

I'm not sure that I follow, can you please explain?

Widespread mask usage is more about keeping infected people from spreading the virus than it is about keeping uninfected people from getting sick.

An infected person is like a drunk driver. On a country road, no one will know the difference. During rush hour in the city, he causes a wide web of damage. You can wear your seatbelt, and it may help minimize your injuries from an accident, but you can't stop the impaired driver from smashing into you. A mask is like putting massive bumpers on the impaired driver's vehicle. Now when he interacts with you, there may still be damage, but it is lessened considerably.

[yaakov35]

Meanwhile Lakewood life goes on, maskless, blissfully unaware of the raging debate on DDF about what they should be doing.

well put.

[Euclid]

If possible please move this discussion to the Masks thread

[hllulbh1]

And if you don't "buy in" it goes away? Like taking the blue or red pill?

An interesting article about when a pandemic "goes away": https://www.nytimes.com/2020/05/10/health/coronavirus-plague-pandemic-history.html

[ShimshonK]

I'm betting that everyone is going to be exposed at some point. You can either drag it out in waves or get it over with.

How much are you willing to bet on this one, because that's a ridiculous assumption. To date, 'only' a minority of the country has actually gotten it (most of those before precautions were put in place or in locations with less precautions) and you assume 100% of people will get it with precautions??

It was a major error and a fiasco. There was no overload. They built 600 million dollars worth of field hospitals and treated basically zero patients. The researchers and models made one of the biggest modeling errors in modern times.

Preparing for the worst is the proper approach.
Many people pay tens of thousands of dollars in their lifetime to life insurance that thank God goes unused. Is that also a "modeling error"?

[yesitsme]

we need to wear a mask

we dont need to wear a mask

we need to wear a mask

we dont need to wear a mask

we need to wear a mask

we dont need to wear a mask

we need to wear a mask

we dont need to wear a mask

we need to wear a mask

we dont need to wear a mask

we need to wear a mask

we dont need to wear a mask

we need to wear a mask

we dont need to wear a mask

we need to wear a mask

we dont need to wear a mask

we need to wear a mask

we dont need to wear a mask

we need to wear a mask

we dont need to wear a mask

we need to wear a mask

we dont need to wear a mask

we need to wear a mask

we dont need to wear a mask

we need to wear a mask

we dont need to wear a mask

we need to wear a mask

we dont need to wear a mask

we need to wear a mask

we dont need to wear a mask

we need to wear a mask

we dont need to wear a mask

we need to wear a mask

we dont need to wear a mask

we need to wear a mask

we dont need to wear a mask

we need to wear a mask

we dont need to wear a mask

we need to wear a mask

we dont need to wear a mask

we need to wear a mask

we dont need to wear a mask

we need to wear a mask

we dont need to wear a mask

we need to wear a mask

we dont need to wear a mask

we need to wear a mask

we dont need to wear a mask

we need to wear a mask

we dont need to wear a mask

we need to wear a mask

we dont need to wear a mask

we need to wear a mask

we dont need to wear a mask

we need to wear a mask

we dont need to wear a mask

[Baruch]

I asked a teller in Lakewood's Santander Bank (very busy bank) if any employees got corona, she said "no".
Masks work.

[Baruch]

Maybe cases really are going back down. Labor day may explain in, we'll find out in a few days.

I personally know 3 people that tested positive yesterday. According to you, 33% of the positive cases yesterday, I know personally.

[cmey]

How much are you willing to bet on this one, because that's a ridiculous assumption. To date, 'only' a minority of the country has actually gotten it (most of those before precautions were put in place or in locations with less precautions) and you assume 100% of people will get it with precautions??
Preparing for the worst is the proper approach.
Many people pay tens of thousands of dollars in their lifetime to life insurance that thank God goes unused. Is that also a "modeling error"?

Paying for unused insurance costs money. This costed tens of thousands of lived among the elderly. It’s not like it was off. The scenarios painted had no basis in reality whatsoever.

[dasmo801]

I personally know 3 people that tested positive yesterday. According to you, 33% of the positive cases yesterday, I know personally.

I don't think it is clear that OCHD is reporting the results of the previous days tests. It is likely that they are reporting whatever results were reported to them by the labs rhe previous day. The labs may be reporting the same days results or possibly the previous days or maybe the past 2 days. Or maybe some labs report the same day, others the following day etc. IOW, even if everything was being reported to OCHD (ha!) the numbers would still not necessarily represent yesterday's testing. 

[ShimshonK]

Paying for unused insurance costs money. This costed tens of thousands of lived among the elderly. It’s not like it was off. The scenarios painted had no basis in reality whatsoever.

Do please explain how NY spending money on building additional hospitals killed tens of thousands.

And there was plenty basis in reality.
Even you mentioned about hospitals being overwhelmed in March -

Indeed, the game plan in March had one goal: flatten the curve. Stop the healthcare system from being overwhelmed.

[grodnoking]

Do please explain how NY spending money on building additional hospitals killed tens of thousands.

The hospitals that they refused to send the elderly to, and ended up never being used?

[grodnoking]

we need to wear a mask

we dont need to wear a mask

we need to wear a mask

we dont need to wear a mask

we need to wear a mask

we dont need to wear a mask

we need to wear a mask

we dont need to wear a mask

we need to wear a mask

we dont need to wear a mask

we need to wear a mask

we dont need to wear a mask

we need to wear a mask

we dont need to wear a mask

we need to wear a mask

we dont need to wear a mask

we need to wear a mask

we dont need to wear a mask

we need to wear a mask

we dont need to wear a mask

we need to wear a mask

we dont need to wear a mask

we need to wear a mask

we dont need to wear a mask

we need to wear a mask

we dont need to wear a mask

we need to wear a mask

we dont need to wear a mask

we need to wear a mask

we dont need to wear a mask

we need to wear a mask

we dont need to wear a mask

we need to wear a mask

we dont need to wear a mask

we need to wear a mask

we dont need to wear a mask

we need to wear a mask

we dont need to wear a mask

we need to wear a mask

we dont need to wear a mask

we need to wear a mask

we dont need to wear a mask

we need to wear a mask

we dont need to wear a mask

we need to wear a mask

we dont need to wear a mask

we need to wear a mask

we dont need to wear a mask

we need to wear a mask

we dont need to wear a mask

we need to wear a mask

we dont need to wear a mask

we need to wear a mask

we dont need to wear a mask

we need to wear a mask

we dont need to wear a mask

Thank you for summarizing this thread!

[yaakov35]

I asked a teller in Lakewood's Santander Bank (very busy bank) if any employees got corona, she said "no".
Masks work.

With logic like that you can write for cnn

[cmey]

There was plenty basis in reality.
And do please explain how NY spending money on building additional hospitals killed tens of thousands.

Have you been following the sequence of events? The governors of several states saw the modeling that predicted massive shortages of hospital beds, ICU’s and vents that was supposed to result in mass casualties due to lack of capacity. They panicked, and put all of their resources into building field hospitals and the like, and decided that freeing up hospital capacity was so crucial that it made sense to sacrifice the seniors by emptying the hospital wards of seniors who were contagious with covid, and sending them back into long term care facilities, which resulted in tens of thousands of resident deaths. They left the seniors to die in the LTC facilities, not even bothering to move them to the empty field hospitals and hospital ships because that wouldn’t leave room for the massive overload of younger covid patients the model predicted were soon to come.

A more realistic assessment would have made it obvious that the exact opposite was necessary; deploy all resources to protect the highest risk seniors. Instead of field hospitals, they should have equipped LTC facilities with adequate PPE and large scale testing. Positive seniors should have been moved away from the healthy population. The result would have been a fraction of the death toll.

[grodnoking]

Look at the numbers! How can you be in denial?! LOOK AT THE NUMBERS!!!

A few days later...

The numbers are FAKE! There is a cover up! DONT LOOK AT THE NUMBERS!!!

[yitzgar]

Look at the numbers! How can you be in denial?! LOOK AT THE NUMBERS!!!

A few days later...

The numbers are FAKE! There is a cover up! DONT LOOK AT THE NUMBERS!!!

Question is if this goes both ways....

[ShimshonK]

Have you been following the sequence of events? The governors of several states saw the modeling that predicted massive shortages of hospital beds, ICU’s and vents that was supposed to result in mass casualties due to lack of capacity. They panicked, and put all of their resources into building field hospitals and the like, and decided that freeing up hospital capacity was so crucial that it made sense to sacrifice the seniors by emptying the hospital wards of seniors who were contagious with covid, and sending them back into long term care facilities, which resulted in tens of thousands of resident deaths. They left the seniors to die in the LTC facilities, not even bothering to move them to the empty field hospitals and hospital ships because that wouldn’t leave room for the massive overload of younger covid patients the model predicted were soon to come.

A more realistic assessment would have made it obvious that the exact opposite was necessary; deploy all resources to protect the highest risk seniors. Instead of field hospitals, they should have equipped LTC facilities with adequate PPE and large scale testing. Positive seniors should have been moved away from the healthy population.

Definitely fair to say that in hindsight, some wrong calls were made, especially with regard to sending the covid infected seniors back to the nursing homes.

Now, let's do our part, and not kill any more people.

[cmey]

Definitely fair to say that in hindsight, some wrong calls were made, especially with regard to sending the covid infected seniors back to the nursing homes.

Everyone makes Cuomo and Murphy out to be some sort of murderous villains for what they did to the seniors, but to be fair they simply bought into the models and decided to sacrifice the seniors for the greater good.

[aygart]

The hospitals that they refused to send the elderly to, and ended up never being used?

Yes those. How did they kill people?