New Chassidish Community Being Planned in Tampa

[EliJelly]

Then I nominate you!

Best candidate for a Rav! Everyone will look up at him.

[Dan]

Best candidate for a Rav! Everyone will look up at him.

[grodnoking]

Options are good, casa grande, az, tampa, fl.. wayyyyyyyy better options than dirty brooklyn, we just need a Kauai rebbe, who wants to take the mantle?

I'd love to be a Rebbi, but I dont eat fish.

[Yehuda57]

Best candidate for a Rav! Everyone will look up at him.

Of equal importance to looking up to a rav is a rav who doesn't look down on others.

[shabbosabba]

I'd love to be a Rebbi, but I dont eat fish.

That's why we need @Something Fishy 

[AsherO]

Of equal importance to looking up to a rav is a rav who doesn't look down on others.

כל הפוסל...

[Yehuda57]

כל הפוסל...

Oy, I was definitely not directing that comment at anyone specific

[efflpetzel]

Ah mantle in Kauai??? What we need is a bathing suit with a mittele atura.

ALOL

[Ayl]

OK ill try to fill in some blanks:

The Tausig's are saying they have more than 100 people who signed, but of course I don't know the real number.
I believe most of the people who signed still have lots of questions and are uncertain about certain things, but I hope this will change once we get together, and there is an event this Moitse Shabbos, details and location is of course only for those who signed.

The location of the project changed, they say the reason is because, the original development in Pasco county got postponed with another year due to Covid.
The new location is in Hillsborough county, it has some downsides
1. The larger homes aren't available here (largest option is only 2600sf + 2 car garage)
3. They are not so flexible with changing the home layout
3. Hillsborough is already a more developed place so I think they wont be so forthcoming as in Pasco, plus I think its a democratic county, but this is just my theory, Im not sure if I'm right.

On the positive side:
1. This location is already confirmed and yes I know some have seen Models this week, and others are flying down shortly.
2. The development company is D.R Horton, a very large development company.
3. Lot size is either 40 or 50Ft Wide ( I think the length is 120, not sure though)
4. They have 3 options of homes, "Robie" "Cali" and "Hayden"  You can google it and look it up by yourself.

My biggest concern at the moment is type crowd and all around Moisdes Etc. I hope the event will clear this void

@Lurker I totally agree with you on this one, their PR was bad and there was a constant lack of engagement and transparency, But it seems like things are finally moving now

[Ayl]

Downside #3 is real, hills borough sheriff is a dirt bag more covid tyranny there than in nyc, by far. In March the same week he released a repeat offender who had 39 felons, he arrested a pastor for assembling in his church, totalitarian tyrant. If your primary reason to move is the tyranny in NY, hills borough isn’t the place to seek refuge.

[Jo 08701]

I hope this is the right forum, to vent all my ספיקות.
As I am looking already for quite sometime into the South Florida housing market, as an option to own a vacation house which should eventually cover itself through rentals over peak seasons. I found that North Miami Beach is out of the budget already.
Some background: I am Chasidish, with some strict values, for example i need a walking distance men mikva, especially for shabbos morning. Upto 1 hour walking should be good. I walked sometimes when I went on vacation, more than an hour per direction for טבילת עזרא.
Minyan I am ok with Chasidish, Chabad, Yeshivish/Sefard/Ashkenaz.
Food, I am not at the age anymore that I should have a must for real fancy restaurants. But I do need a supermarket with basic kosher food with heimeishe hechsheirim.
Since I live in Lakewood in a decent size house, I am not looking to go there Pesach/Succos. As of now I can't even go even I want, for many reasons.
So therefore i have no problem on counting on the rental income.
Over the Winter, in our current situation we won't go down more than once over the winter, kids are in school, young kids, etc.
Over the summer we are looking to spend there the Aug month, as we drove down over the last few years, and we really loved it. Yes in the hot weather, but the private pool and the quietness is very good.
I remember when some Chasidish people moved from NY to North Miami Beach about 15 years ago and houses were cheap. At that time approximately many chasidish people bought there for a vacation home, and they are really having a use of it now, and are able to rent it out for top money during season.
My question is, is there chances that Tampa might be in the same position? Some Chasidish people moving from NY, that will make it a nice size OOT Community with their local grocery etc.
I understand that I can't count on getting 400 a night during the whole winter, but how about 200 a night? Also for Pesach/Succos I believe I can count on 5000 each.
Now the pros and cons in my eyes for both options:
Miami PROs
Higher nightly rate and easier to rent out.
More kosher options which makes it cheaper for me when visiting.
Established, no risk, no worries not to have minyan, etc.
The Community is full fledged already and not dependent on vacationers.
They are in the middle of the stages to open chasidish schools. Hence I can see my kids live there when they marry.
TAMPA pros.
Cheaper upfront price, new construction.
Less exposure to Flooding, less risk even with global warming. (Remember I am planning to use it more in 40 years from now.)

Both options have cheap flight options.

Tampa Cons:
Risk if this will be working out, but I do believe if there will be 100 chasidish families that will guarantee it a mikva, kosher grocery.
As of now, there is no market for kosher villas there.

Here are some questions which I wonna have input from others who know answers.
How about the weather in the summer in Tampa, was never there, i was in Miami and it wasnt that bad as some are trying to portray it. In my eyes, על טעם וריח אין להתוכיח.

Many say that Miami metro is the main attraction the food. Since i am not a foodie guy, i can't real answer that. But I wonder why people don't go to Tampa/Sarasota/St. Petersburg areas for vacation, atleast on the same level as Cancun which also don't have many food options.

Now, I did spoke to the organizers, and they have no problem that some people should buy for vacation homes. I do believe it will only help them that some people should have vacation houses there. That will bring free advertising for their Community, all the home owners will have to advertise their houses for the heimeishe Community. It will also bring weekly new faces to the Community and more outside money into the local heimeishe economy.
Those visitors will also become ambassadors for the Community, back home in Tri State area.
Vacationers usually spend more money in Grocery for expensive items, that will make it more economically viable to bring it down those stuff.
Now if the demand would be more than supply, like for example Linden NJ,  I understand that it wouldn't be healthy to have outside investors to drive up prices. And I would never think of buying in such a climate, ואהבת לרעך כמוך and I am not even in the real estate industry to have a יצר הרע to do it.
Tampa is not that the case, they have a huge supply, about 700 houses in just that gated community. Plus many new communities are being build around that area.

Would you consider buying a vacation house in greater Tampa area, as an alternative to South Florida?

Do you think there is more chances that other areas in South Florida with low prices, should become more Chasidish friendly?
In my eyes is Hollywood the closest candidate to North Miami Beach in South Florida, but its also more expensive than Tampa, plus its older houses.
How about North Miami beach outskirts? Spoke to some house managers and they said I won't be able to rent it out as of now. Where are the younger chabad families moving as alternative to NMB?
Your input is appreciated.

[YitzyS]

I hope this is the right forum, to vent all my ספיקות.

I'm not going to weigh in, because I know nothing about Florida, but I just wanted to say that I love the way you write. So methodical, and you communicate your thoughts really well. It's rare that I enjoy reading such a long post, especially one that I know nothing about...

[AsherO]

I'm not going to weigh in, because I know nothing about Florida, but I just wanted to say that I love the way you write. So methodical, and you communicate your thoughts really well. It's rare that I enjoy reading such a long post, especially one that I know nothing about...

I gave him another like for you.

[TimT]

Has the minyan started? I heading to Tampa this week for work and can use a late ma'ariv.

TR ?

[jj1000]

Where are the younger chabad families moving as alternative to NMB?

Hallandale Beach, Aventura Isles, Hollywood a few different areas there.

Or go more north and get a cheap and big place in Boynton Beach, depending on age that can be a great option, but likely poor for rental income.

[Jo 08701]

Hallandale Beach, Aventura Isles, Hollywood a few different areas there.

Or go more north and get a cheap and big place in Boynton Beach, depending on age that can be a great option, but likely poor for rental income.

Hi, can you please elaborate on this.
Do this communities have a full fledged Chabad house similar to the NMB chabad which has a separate nice comfortable mens mikvah.
I forgot to note in my earlier post 2 points.
1) Tampa has more and easier evacuation options ח"ו in case of a major hurricane, you are closer to mainland.
2) I spoke to one of the major house managers,  who I am doing business with already for more than six years.
When I was there the first time he was busy the whole time how you can buy for cheap, fix it over, and use for yourself and rent it out, making nice money. When I spoke to him last week, he told he can't advise me what to do, he didn't want to say anything how much you can make etc. He just told me that if i end up buying he will gladly help me out, and manage it. That was a sign for me that he also believes that NMB is at their peak, and the numbers is to high.
He told I can try to go the other side of the canal where you can still find for a little cheaper, but also wasn't pushy as he was when prices were like 350 with a pool.
Regarding other areas, I asked him about Hollywood, he knows me well, so he advised me that it's not my type or even similar.
Regarding Tampa, he didn't have any info about that. Hence it's a new product and in the early stages.

[ad120]

Hallandale Beach, Aventura Isles, Hollywood a few different areas there.

Or go more north and get a cheap and big place in Boynton Beach, depending on age that can be a great option, but likely poor for rental income.

Boynton Beach is where everyone should invest now. It's going to explode in a few years. Similarly to Boca Raton.

[ad120]

I hope this is the right forum, to vent all my ספיקות.
As I am looking already for quite sometime into the South Florida housing market, as an option to own a vacation house which should eventually cover itself through rentals over peak seasons. I found that North Miami Beach is out of the budget already.
Some background: I am Chasidish, with some strict values, for example i need a walking distance men mikva, especially for shabbos morning. Upto 1 hour walking should be good. I walked sometimes when I went on vacation, more than an hour per direction for טבילת עזרא.
Minyan I am ok with Chasidish, Chabad, Yeshivish/Sefard/Ashkenaz.
Food, I am not at the age anymore that I should have a must for real fancy restaurants. But I do need a supermarket with basic kosher food with heimeishe hechsheirim.
Since I live in Lakewood in a decent size house, I am not looking to go there Pesach/Succos. As of now I can't even go even I want, for many reasons.
So therefore i have no problem on counting on the rental income.
Over the Winter, in our current situation we won't go down more than once over the winter, kids are in school, young kids, etc.
Over the summer we are looking to spend there the Aug month, as we drove down over the last few years, and we really loved it. Yes in the hot weather, but the private pool and the quietness is very good.
I remember when some Chasidish people moved from NY to North Miami Beach about 15 years ago and houses were cheap. At that time approximately many chasidish people bought there for a vacation home, and they are really having a use of it now, and are able to rent it out for top money during season.
My question is, is there chances that Tampa might be in the same position? Some Chasidish people moving from NY, that will make it a nice size OOT Community with their local grocery etc.
I understand that I can't count on getting 400 a night during the whole winter, but how about 200 a night? Also for Pesach/Succos I believe I can count on 5000 each.
Now the pros and cons in my eyes for both options:
Miami PROs
Higher nightly rate and easier to rent out.
More kosher options which makes it cheaper for me when visiting.
Established, no risk, no worries not to have minyan, etc.
The Community is full fledged already and not dependent on vacationers.
They are in the middle of the stages to open chasidish schools. Hence I can see my kids live there when they marry.
TAMPA pros.
Cheaper upfront price, new construction.
Less exposure to Flooding, less risk even with global warming. (Remember I am planning to use it more in 40 years from now.)

Both options have cheap flight options.

Tampa Cons:
Risk if this will be working out, but I do believe if there will be 100 chasidish families that will guarantee it a mikva, kosher grocery.
As of now, there is no market for kosher villas there.

Here are some questions which I wonna have input from others who know answers.
How about the weather in the summer in Tampa, was never there, i was in Miami and it wasnt that bad as some are trying to portray it. In my eyes, על טעם וריח אין להתוכיח.

Many say that Miami metro is the main attraction the food. Since i am not a foodie guy, i can't real answer that. But I wonder why people don't go to Tampa/Sarasota/St. Petersburg areas for vacation, atleast on the same level as Cancun which also don't have many food options.

Now, I did spoke to the organizers, and they have no problem that some people should buy for vacation homes. I do believe it will only help them that some people should have vacation houses there. That will bring free advertising for their Community, all the home owners will have to advertise their houses for the heimeishe Community. It will also bring weekly new faces to the Community and more outside money into the local heimeishe economy.
Those visitors will also become ambassadors for the Community, back home in Tri State area.
Vacationers usually spend more money in Grocery for expensive items, that will make it more economically viable to bring it down those stuff.
Now if the demand would be more than supply, like for example Linden NJ,  I understand that it wouldn't be healthy to have outside investors to drive up prices. And I would never think of buying in such a climate, ואהבת לרעך כמוך and I am not even in the real estate industry to have a יצר הרע to do it.
Tampa is not that the case, they have a huge supply, about 700 houses in just that gated community. Plus many new communities are being build around that area.

Would you consider buying a vacation house in greater Tampa area, as an alternative to South Florida?

Do you think there is more chances that other areas in South Florida with low prices, should become more Chasidish friendly?
In my eyes is Hollywood the closest candidate to North Miami Beach in South Florida, but its also more expensive than Tampa, plus its older houses.
How about North Miami beach outskirts? Spoke to some house managers and they said I won't be able to rent it out as of now. Where are the younger chabad families moving as alternative to NMB?
Your input is appreciated.

Eden Gardens in Kissimmee.
I personally love Sarasota and St. Petersburg. The lack of infrastructure makes it unattractive to drum families.

[Ergel]

(Remember I am planning to use it more in 40 years from now.)

I really don't get this cheshbon - who knows what will be in 40 years from now. Hopefully mashiach tzidkeinu will be here by then and you won't think of vacationing in FL. You can easily buy and sell many times over in the course of 40 years

[Jo 08701]

I really don't get this cheshbon - who knows what will be in 40 years from now. Hopefully mashiach tzidkeinu will be here by then and you won't think of vacationing in FL. You can easily buy and sell many times over in the course of 40 years

אחכה לו בכל יום שיבוא
So what the difference between making a calculations for 1 year or 40 years.
Now, I am not looking in to it as an investment,  I am looking to have something for my upcoming years עמו"ש, and if I am now almost 40, it makes sense to calculate till 80.
If I have bought already in Miami, or I live there, and scientists come put with a study that in 30 years from now Miami will be under water, I would leave it to hashem,  and not worry now. But since I don't have anything yet, so I believe I do have חיוב השתדלות to weigh my options on a normal level.
I am not a משפיע or any רוחניות authority, just a simple דעת בעל הבית.
I do believe that believing that South Florida can be under water is not a סתירה באמונת השם, after all the entire South Florida area was till approximately 100 years ago not habitated by Humans, the entire area was a swamp, so the sea can always reclaim it, ח"ו.