Author Topic: Stella Immanuel Asks Why We Don't Prescribe Prophylactic Hydroxychloroquine  (Read 4410 times)

Offline Lamppost

  • Dansdeals Gold Elite
  • ***
  • Join Date: May 2012
  • Posts: 144
  • Total likes: 27
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 0
    • View Profile
  • Location: Detroit
Re: Re: Tweets, Pictures, And Videos That Are Coronavirus Related
« Reply #40 on: July 28, 2020, 05:24:43 PM »
What's that? Last I saw, he claimed his patients have a 99.3% survival rate, which is the same as Coronavirus around the world with or without HCQ

Many people with Covid dont go to a dr. They never become a "patient". 99.3% of patients of a Dr is a better metric than than 99.3% of all cases

Offline PlatinumGuy

  • Dansdeals Lifetime 10K Presidential Platinum Elite
  • *******
  • Join Date: Apr 2011
  • Posts: 13631
  • Total likes: 1850
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 11
    • View Profile
Re: Re: Tweets, Pictures, And Videos That Are Coronavirus Related
« Reply #41 on: July 28, 2020, 05:25:17 PM »
Many people with Covid dont go to a dr. They never become a "patient". 99.3% of patients of a Dr is a better metric than than 99.3% of all cases
I doubt it. I'm sure he's counting anybody he prescribed HCQ to.
״וזה כלל גדול: שישנא אדם כל דבר שקר. וכל מה שיוסיף שנאה לדרכי השקר – יוסיף אהבה לתורה.״ - אורחות צדיקים

Offline yuneeq

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Presidential Platinum Elite
  • *********
  • Join Date: Jan 2013
  • Posts: 7352
  • Total likes: 1708
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 10
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
  • Location: NJ
Re: Re: Tweets, Pictures, And Videos That Are Coronavirus Related
« Reply #42 on: July 28, 2020, 05:27:46 PM »
That study as far as I am aware also did not include Zinc in it. Anyway I would like to know how you believe that a drug that worked in this coctail could have cured 99% of patients it was done on then be found in a study to be worthless. If someone told you that a study found that drinking water didnt cure dehydration would you belive that?

In fact, the study included people that used zinc, if you read my earlier reply. The link is above and can repost if necessary. While you're at it and you are very into solid evidence, I'd like to see your study that included zinc, and proves otherwise.

Offline Lamppost

  • Dansdeals Gold Elite
  • ***
  • Join Date: May 2012
  • Posts: 144
  • Total likes: 27
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 0
    • View Profile
  • Location: Detroit
Re: Re: Tweets, Pictures, And Videos That Are Coronavirus Related
« Reply #43 on: July 28, 2020, 05:28:40 PM »
Just curious - how exactly do I follow the money? Are there no companies that produce hcq, zpac, and zinc? Perhaps they won't make hundreds billions, but if it's in fact effective, that's billions of dollars for an already produced drug. What about insurance companies, don't they save billions of dollars if there's a cure? Where do I follow the money to? Do I need a 5g microchip implanted in my brain to get directions to Fauci's secret offshore bank on Bill Gates' island?

Um as far as I know, HCQ is a generic drug and extremely cheap. So is Zinc. There is a lot less profit there than selling a new vaccine. You do get that right? Regarding insurance, its funny that you dont ask that to Bernie Sanders and everyone else saying how the drug companies are making bilions and of dollars at our expense. Why would any politician need to talk about presription drugs being too high? Arent the insurance companies lobbying for that?


Offline Lamppost

  • Dansdeals Gold Elite
  • ***
  • Join Date: May 2012
  • Posts: 144
  • Total likes: 27
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 0
    • View Profile
  • Location: Detroit
Re: Re: Tweets, Pictures, And Videos That Are Coronavirus Related
« Reply #44 on: July 28, 2020, 05:30:05 PM »
I doubt it. I'm sure he's counting anybody he prescribed HCQ to.

Right those are all his patients...?

Offline Ergel

  • Dansdeals Lifetime 10K Presidential Platinum Elite
  • *******
  • Join Date: Jun 2010
  • Posts: 12617
  • Total likes: 792
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 3
    • View Profile
Re: Re: Tweets, Pictures, And Videos That Are Coronavirus Related
« Reply #45 on: July 28, 2020, 05:30:32 PM »
The point is @Lamppost may or may not be a crazy person, but has been driven to crazy views by a world gone insane. To me that is the scariest part
Life isn't about checking the boxes. Nobody cares.

Offline aygart

  • Dansdeals Lifetime 10K Presidential Platinum Elite
  • *******
  • Join Date: May 2008
  • Posts: 12440
  • Total likes: 7075
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 11
    • View Profile
    • Lower Watt Energy Brokers
  • Programs: www.lowerwatt.com
Re: Re: Tweets, Pictures, And Videos That Are Coronavirus Related
« Reply #46 on: July 28, 2020, 05:30:39 PM »
Um as far as I know, HCQ is a generic drug and extremely cheap. So is Zinc. There is a lot less profit there than selling a new vaccine. You do get that right? Regarding insurance, its funny that you dont ask that to Bernie Sanders and everyone else saying how the drug companies are making bilions and of dollars at our expense. Why would any politician need to talk about presription drugs being too high? Arent the insurance companies lobbying for that?


Huh?
Feelings don't care about your facts

Offline Lamppost

  • Dansdeals Gold Elite
  • ***
  • Join Date: May 2012
  • Posts: 144
  • Total likes: 27
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 0
    • View Profile
  • Location: Detroit
Re: Re: Tweets, Pictures, And Videos That Are Coronavirus Related
« Reply #47 on: July 28, 2020, 05:32:45 PM »
Also now that you clearly stated that you have zero regard for science or studies, what makes Zelenko study so remarkably truthful? Is he 100% leshem shamayim or is there a chance he's in it for the fame and constant interviews? And since you hate political hacks, how does your strong belief in an unscientific opinion not make you a hack?

Unrelated question - would you claim publicly that there is a cure for corona and tell people not to wear masks based on dr z? Or do you separate that which you believe personally and what you would advise others.

No I wouldnt and I do think she shouldnt have said that. But she is a dr with actual patients and I am not.

Offline PlatinumGuy

  • Dansdeals Lifetime 10K Presidential Platinum Elite
  • *******
  • Join Date: Apr 2011
  • Posts: 13631
  • Total likes: 1850
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 11
    • View Profile
Re: Re: Tweets, Pictures, And Videos That Are Coronavirus Related
« Reply #48 on: July 28, 2020, 05:34:07 PM »
Right those are all his patients...?
Yeah but his whole concept is giving it BEFORE infection, so many of the people he's counting probably never got Covid and the 99.3% survival rate is counting those people, whereas only ~0.65% of covid carriers died. He likely has a worse mortality rate because his sample size is biased towards high risk patients who sought him out in the first place.

Either way, he never backed up his claim with data and he's been proven to have a poor understanding of numbers, to put it mildly.
״וזה כלל גדול: שישנא אדם כל דבר שקר. וכל מה שיוסיף שנאה לדרכי השקר – יוסיף אהבה לתורה.״ - אורחות צדיקים

Offline yuneeq

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Presidential Platinum Elite
  • *********
  • Join Date: Jan 2013
  • Posts: 7352
  • Total likes: 1708
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 10
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
  • Location: NJ
Re: Re: Tweets, Pictures, And Videos That Are Coronavirus Related
« Reply #49 on: July 28, 2020, 05:35:10 PM »
Um as far as I know, HCQ is a generic drug and extremely cheap. So is Zinc. There is a lot less profit there than selling a new vaccine. You do get that right? Regarding insurance, its funny that you dont ask that to Bernie Sanders and everyone else saying how the drug companies are making bilions and of dollars at our expense. Why would any politician need to talk about presription drugs being too high? Arent the insurance companies lobbying for that?

I know people that sold 20 cent masks and made millions of dollars. Yes the regiment may be cheap but there's still billions of dollars to be made. And when there's money to be made, there's a company behind it with an agenda. While I'm still following the money, insurance companies would gladly push an agenda for HCQ if it saved them hundreds of billions of dollars. Don't understand what you're saying about Bernie.

Offline Lamppost

  • Dansdeals Gold Elite
  • ***
  • Join Date: May 2012
  • Posts: 144
  • Total likes: 27
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 0
    • View Profile
  • Location: Detroit
Re: Re: Tweets, Pictures, And Videos That Are Coronavirus Related
« Reply #50 on: July 28, 2020, 05:35:51 PM »
Yeah but his whole concept is giving it BEFORE infection, so many of the people he's counting probably never got Covid and the 99.3% survival rate is counting those people, whereas only ~0.65% of covid carriers died. He likely has a worse mortality rate because his sample size is biased towards high risk patients who sought him out in the first place.

Either way, he never backed up his claim with data and he's been proven to have a poor understanding of numbers, to put it mildly.

If that is the case then I stand corrected

Offline Lamppost

  • Dansdeals Gold Elite
  • ***
  • Join Date: May 2012
  • Posts: 144
  • Total likes: 27
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 0
    • View Profile
  • Location: Detroit
Re: Re: Tweets, Pictures, And Videos That Are Coronavirus Related
« Reply #51 on: July 28, 2020, 05:37:38 PM »
The point is @Lamppost may or may not be a crazy person, but has been driven to crazy views by a world gone insane. To me that is the scariest part

I may have crazy views :) But I promise you I am quite normal. Trying to make sense of a world gone mad.

Offline Lurker

  • Dansdeals Presidential Platinum Elite
  • ********
  • Join Date: Jul 2019
  • Posts: 4135
  • Total likes: 4494
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 1
    • View Profile
  • Location: As always, silence is NOT an admission of agreement on DDF. It just means that people lack the stamina to keep on arguing with made up "facts", illogical arguments, deceiving statements, nasty and degrading comments, and fuzzy math. - @yelped
Re: Re: Tweets, Pictures, And Videos That Are Coronavirus Related
« Reply #52 on: July 28, 2020, 05:44:27 PM »
IINM, Dr. Zelenko's protocol was not to give meds before infection, but immediately with the onset of symptoms. However, he also didn't have tests to give everyone, so he treated anyone with a hint of a symptom as a presumed positive. His 99.3% recovery rate is far from a reliable number, given the lack of info.
Failing at maintaining Lurker status.

Offline aygart

  • Dansdeals Lifetime 10K Presidential Platinum Elite
  • *******
  • Join Date: May 2008
  • Posts: 12440
  • Total likes: 7075
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 11
    • View Profile
    • Lower Watt Energy Brokers
  • Programs: www.lowerwatt.com
Re: Re: Tweets, Pictures, And Videos That Are Coronavirus Related
« Reply #53 on: July 28, 2020, 05:48:20 PM »
IINM, Dr. Zelenko's protocol was not to give meds before infection, but immediately with the onset of symptoms. However, he also didn't have tests to give everyone, so he treated anyone with a hint of a symptom as a presumed positive. His 99.3% recovery rate is far from a reliable number, given the lack of info.
Is it based on his claim that the entire KJ got it?
Feelings don't care about your facts

Offline Lurker

  • Dansdeals Presidential Platinum Elite
  • ********
  • Join Date: Jul 2019
  • Posts: 4135
  • Total likes: 4494
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 1
    • View Profile
  • Location: As always, silence is NOT an admission of agreement on DDF. It just means that people lack the stamina to keep on arguing with made up "facts", illogical arguments, deceiving statements, nasty and degrading comments, and fuzzy math. - @yelped
Re: Re: Tweets, Pictures, And Videos That Are Coronavirus Related
« Reply #54 on: July 28, 2020, 06:01:02 PM »
Is it based on his claim that the entire KJ got it?

No, it's based on the patients he actually treated, which was in the hundreds. He treated them remotely through tele-medicine, and I'm pretty sure most of them did not get tested. Watch his early videos from March.
Failing at maintaining Lurker status.

Offline yaakov35

  • Dansdeals Platinum Elite + Lifetime Silver Elite
  • *****
  • Join Date: Jun 2019
  • Posts: 713
  • Total likes: 162
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 0
    • View Profile
  • Location: US
Re: Re: Tweets, Pictures, And Videos That Are Coronavirus Related
« Reply #55 on: July 28, 2020, 06:02:23 PM »
Is it based on his claim that the entire KJ got it?
He wasn't wrong....

Offline aygart

  • Dansdeals Lifetime 10K Presidential Platinum Elite
  • *******
  • Join Date: May 2008
  • Posts: 12440
  • Total likes: 7075
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 11
    • View Profile
    • Lower Watt Energy Brokers
  • Programs: www.lowerwatt.com
Re: Re: Tweets, Pictures, And Videos That Are Coronavirus Related
« Reply #56 on: July 28, 2020, 06:04:18 PM »
He wasn't wrong....
100%? Source? I don't think that anywhere has shown more than 60-70%?
Feelings don't care about your facts

Offline yaakov35

  • Dansdeals Platinum Elite + Lifetime Silver Elite
  • *****
  • Join Date: Jun 2019
  • Posts: 713
  • Total likes: 162
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 0
    • View Profile
  • Location: US
Re: Re: Tweets, Pictures, And Videos That Are Coronavirus Related
« Reply #57 on: July 28, 2020, 06:06:37 PM »
100%? Source? I don't think that anywhere has shown more than 60-70%?
Its KJ... nobody tested there. But one of the urgent cares said that their positivity rates for antibodies were well over 80%. But they're never gonna make the info publicly available. But ask anyone in kj, 20k is under counting.

Offline moish

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Presidential Platinum Elite
  • *********
  • Join Date: May 2008
  • Posts: 9760
  • Total likes: 138
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 0
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
  • Programs: AA LT Plat, Avis, SPG Plat
Re: Re: Tweets, Pictures, And Videos That Are Coronavirus Related
« Reply #58 on: July 28, 2020, 06:19:35 PM »
You guys are completely misrepresenting what he did and said. He received over 2000 patients. Of those, he treated around 800 with his regimen.
The idea is that HCQ+zinc+azythromycin  works in the outpatient setting to prevent the virus from becoming a full blown inferno. He believed it was only effective in the first 5 days of infection.
So... By the time a patient presented to a doctor, it was generally day 4 or 5. To wait 3 days for results was too long, because by day 8 he felt it was too late. So he prescribed to those showing symptoms over the age of 60 or had comorbidities. 
His numbers take into account the full 2200 who presented with symptoms. To compare that with the general population is ludicrous.
Bottom line... The demographics in KJ is similar to that of BP and Willie, yet we don't find a similar pattern of destruction. Is it possible that it was due to his regimen? Absolutely. It's mind boggling that that isn't enough for people when there isn't an alternative. Sure, a randomized study would be great, but let's grab the driftwood to prevent drowning and then we can figure out how to build a boat.

Offline Lamppost

  • Dansdeals Gold Elite
  • ***
  • Join Date: May 2012
  • Posts: 144
  • Total likes: 27
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 0
    • View Profile
  • Location: Detroit
Re: Re: Tweets, Pictures, And Videos That Are Coronavirus Related
« Reply #59 on: July 28, 2020, 06:29:22 PM »
You guys are completely misrepresenting what he did and said. He received over 2000 patients. Of those, he treated around 800 with his regimen.
The idea is that HCQ+zinc+azythromycin  works in the outpatient setting to prevent the virus from becoming a full blown inferno. He believed it was only effective in the first 5 days of infection.
So... By the time a patient presented to a doctor, it was generally day 4 or 5. To wait 3 days for results was too long, because by day 8 he felt it was too late. So he prescribed to those showing symptoms over the age of 60 or had comorbidities. 
His numbers take into account the full 2200 who presented with symptoms. To compare that with the general population is ludicrous.
Bottom line... The demographics in KJ is similar to that of BP and Willie, yet we don't find a similar pattern of destruction. Is it possible that it was due to his regimen? Absolutely. It's mind boggling that that isn't enough for people when there isn't an alternative. Sure, a randomized study would be great, but let's grab the driftwood to prevent drowning and then we can figure out how to build a boat.

But what about all the studies that say that HCQ doesnt work?!This doesnt shtim with that!! ;)