Author Topic: Realistic vaccine date- end of 2021?  (Read 81735 times)

Offline AsherO

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Offline PlatinumGuy

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Re: Realistic vaccine date- end of 2021?
« Reply #201 on: November 24, 2020, 11:20:09 AM »
Before EUA, or there’ll be EUA?
The twiteer works for Newsmax. She's probably getting the vaccine on an alternate planet
״וזה כלל גדול: שישנא אדם כל דבר שקר. וכל מה שיוסיף שנאה לדרכי השקר – יוסיף אהבה לתורה.״ - אורחות צדיקים

Offline Traveler718

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Re: Realistic vaccine date- end of 2021?
« Reply #202 on: November 24, 2020, 11:23:51 AM »
The FDA isn't even meeting to discuss the EUA until something like December 9, so it's impossible to have EUA next week. It would be nice if he's right, but when I see that he works for Newsmax, I take it with a grain of salt until I see additional confirmation. My wife is a doctor at a major NYC hospital and hasn't heard anything about the vaccine being given yet.

Offline drosenberg88429

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Re: Realistic vaccine date- end of 2021?
« Reply #203 on: November 24, 2020, 12:32:07 PM »
https://twitter.com/axios/status/1331090810666844161

Research has shown that the biotech firm’s shot is effective at preventing people from getting sick with COVID-19, but there’s no hard evidence that it stops them from carrying the virus “transiently” and potentially infecting others who haven’t been vaccinated, according to Dr. Tal Zaks, Moderna’s chief medical officer.



Is this a real concern, or political posturing?

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Re: Realistic vaccine date- end of 2021?
« Reply #204 on: November 24, 2020, 12:36:04 PM »
https://twitter.com/axios/status/1331090810666844161

Research has shown that the biotech firm’s shot is effective at preventing people from getting sick with COVID-19, but there’s no hard evidence that it stops them from carrying the virus “transiently” and potentially infecting others who haven’t been vaccinated, according to Dr. Tal Zaks, Moderna’s chief medical officer.



Is this a real concern, or political posturing?
The operating term is 'no hard evidence'. It is still extremely likely to inhibit transmission - as the CMO himself says in this video.
״וזה כלל גדול: שישנא אדם כל דבר שקר. וכל מה שיוסיף שנאה לדרכי השקר – יוסיף אהבה לתורה.״ - אורחות צדיקים

Offline skyguy918

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Re: Realistic vaccine date- end of 2021?
« Reply #205 on: November 24, 2020, 12:46:27 PM »
The operating term is 'no hard evidence'. It is still extremely likely to inhibit transmission - as the CMO himself says in this video.
Why do we still have no data on this? I understand the vaccine isn't at that point yet, but shouldn't we have been able to study whether antibodies from having actually been infected are enough to prevent 'transient' passing of the virus by now?

Offline PlatinumGuy

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Re: Realistic vaccine date- end of 2021?
« Reply #206 on: November 24, 2020, 12:48:37 PM »
Why do we still have no data on this? I understand the vaccine isn't at that point yet, but shouldn't we have been able to study whether antibodies from having actually been infected are enough to prevent 'transient' passing of the virus by now?
We essentially know there is no such thing as transient passing, the virus is only shed when it's replicating. Removing the 1% doubt would likely require deliberate infection which is prohibited under ethical rules our governments are too incompetent to reevaluate.
״וזה כלל גדול: שישנא אדם כל דבר שקר. וכל מה שיוסיף שנאה לדרכי השקר – יוסיף אהבה לתורה.״ - אורחות צדיקים

Offline CountValentine

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Re: Realistic vaccine date- end of 2021?
« Reply #207 on: November 24, 2020, 12:49:35 PM »
Yup they are rushing it too fast and also sitting around waiting to cover up for something or other. Don't expect anything different from you.
And you defending Trump at every turn and then claiming you don't support him is expected.
Only on DDF does 24/6 mean 24/5/half/half

Offline Ergel

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Re: Realistic vaccine date- end of 2021?
« Reply #208 on: November 24, 2020, 03:09:38 PM »
I said this when the results came out and they were only testing symptomatic people - that the results therefore don't prove they inhibit infection, only symptomatic infections. I just don't get it. This is a multi-billion, maybe even trillion dollar market. Could they really not afford to test these people weekly?
Life isn't about checking the boxes. Nobody cares.

Offline PlatinumGuy

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Re: Realistic vaccine date- end of 2021?
« Reply #209 on: November 24, 2020, 03:52:32 PM »
I said this when the results came out and they were only testing symptomatic people - that the results therefore don't prove they inhibit infection, only symptomatic infections. I just don't get it. This is a multi-billion, maybe even trillion dollar market. Could they really not afford to test these people weekly?
Who says they didn’t test anybody? Negative PCR would still not be hard evidence of no transmission.
״וזה כלל גדול: שישנא אדם כל דבר שקר. וכל מה שיוסיף שנאה לדרכי השקר – יוסיף אהבה לתורה.״ - אורחות צדיקים

Offline Ergel

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Re: Realistic vaccine date- end of 2021?
« Reply #210 on: November 24, 2020, 03:57:32 PM »
Who says they didn’t test anybody? Negative PCR would still not be hard evidence of no transmission.

It would be better indication though. And all the reports said they only tested symptomatic
Life isn't about checking the boxes. Nobody cares.

Offline PlatinumGuy

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Re: Realistic vaccine date- end of 2021?
« Reply #211 on: November 24, 2020, 04:00:21 PM »
It would be better indication though. And all the reports said they only tested symptomatic
Its already 99.9%... I didn’t see a report that they didn’t test periodically or at least some asymptomatic. It would be in their interest to test as much as possible since the approval was tied to reaching the 160 infection milestone.
״וזה כלל גדול: שישנא אדם כל דבר שקר. וכל מה שיוסיף שנאה לדרכי השקר – יוסיף אהבה לתורה.״ - אורחות צדיקים

Offline gozalim

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Re: Realistic vaccine date- end of 2021?
« Reply #212 on: November 24, 2020, 05:54:08 PM »
Negative PCR would still not be hard evidence of no transmission.
if the respiratory samples have no virus in them, how is the airborne virus being transmitted?

Offline PlatinumGuy

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Re: Realistic vaccine date- end of 2021?
« Reply #213 on: November 24, 2020, 06:08:35 PM »
if the respiratory samples have no virus in them, how is the airborne virus being transmitted?
It can exist even if the PCR doesn’t pick it up, and even besides for that you’d need a PCR from every minute to preclude it entirely.
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Offline PlatinumGuy

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Re: Realistic vaccine date- end of 2021?
« Reply #214 on: November 24, 2020, 06:38:10 PM »
I said this when the results came out and they were only testing symptomatic people - that the results therefore don't prove they inhibit infection, only symptomatic infections. I just don't get it. This is a multi-billion, maybe even trillion dollar market. Could they really not afford to test these people weekly?
Pfizer has their protocol published online. Instead of wasting resources doing PCRs, they relied on antibody testing to determine if anybody got asymptomatic Covid.

Quote
In addition, a serological definition will be used for participants without clinical presentation of COVID-19:
• Confirmed seroconversion to SARS-CoV-2 without confirmed COVID-19: positive N-binding antibody result in a participant with a prior negative N-binding antibody result
Serum samples will be obtained for immunogenicity testing at the visits specified in the SoA. The following assays will be performed:
• SARS-CoV-2 neutralization assay
• S1-binding IgG level assay
• RBD-binding IgG level assay
• N-binding antibody assay

Moderna used a similar protocol to rule out asymptomatic infection.

https://www.modernatx.com/sites/default/files/mRNA-1273-P301-Protocol.pdf

Quote
Asymptomatic SARS-CoV-2 infection is determined by seroconversion due to infection assessed by bAb levels against SARS- CoV-2 as measured by a ligand-binding assay specific to the SARS- CoV-2 nucleocapsid protein and a negative NP swab sample for SARS- CoV-2 at Day 1.

« Last Edit: November 24, 2020, 06:42:15 PM by PlatinumGuy »
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Offline Traveler718

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Re: Realistic vaccine date- end of 2021?
« Reply #215 on: November 24, 2020, 07:47:13 PM »
A frum woman who participated in the Moderna trial and received the vaccine and had confirmed antibodies in September has now reported a severe case of COVID that she caught from her husband 2 days after Moderna released preliminary results of 94.5% effectiveness - not good news!

https://www.imamother.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=399108

Offline PlatinumGuy

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Re: Realistic vaccine date- end of 2021?
« Reply #216 on: November 24, 2020, 07:48:23 PM »
A frum woman who participated in the Moderna trial and received the vaccine and had confirmed antibodies in September has now reported a severe case of COVID that she caught from her husband 2 days after Moderna released preliminary results of 94.5% effectiveness - not good news!

https://www.imamother.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=399108
The study is blinded so there is no way she knows if she got the vaccine or placebo.
״וזה כלל גדול: שישנא אדם כל דבר שקר. וכל מה שיוסיף שנאה לדרכי השקר – יוסיף אהבה לתורה.״ - אורחות צדיקים

Offline aygart

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Re: Realistic vaccine date- end of 2021?
« Reply #217 on: November 24, 2020, 07:49:57 PM »
The study is blinded so there is no way she knows if she got the vaccine or placebo.
Even now after it is complete? How should she know if she should get the vaccine now that it is available?
Feelings don't care about your facts

Offline PlatinumGuy

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Re: Realistic vaccine date- end of 2021?
« Reply #218 on: November 24, 2020, 07:55:24 PM »
Even now after it is complete? How should she know if she should get the vaccine now that it is available?
The study isn't complete for 24 months. There are limited interim analysis's. She was either one of the known 5 cases or has no way of knowing yet.
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Offline aygart

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Re: Realistic vaccine date- end of 2021?
« Reply #219 on: November 24, 2020, 07:57:37 PM »
The study isn't complete for 24 months. There are limited interim analysis's. She was either one of the known 5 cases or has no way of knowing yet.
okay. The one monkey wrench is her testing positive for antibodies
Feelings don't care about your facts