Topic Wiki

Peace agreements reached with:
United Arab Emirates - Sep. 2020
Bahrain - Sep. 2020
Serbia - Sep. 2020
Sudan - Oct. 2020
Morocco - Dec. 2020

Likely:
Saudi Arabia
Oman

Rumored:
Qatar  HMMM
Kuwait


« Last edited by jew on October 26, 2023, 12:40:44 AM »

Author Topic: Peace In The Middle East Master Thread  (Read 183091 times)

Offline yelped

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Online aygart

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Feelings don't care about your facts

Offline Kobe Bryant

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Re: Peace In The Middle East Master Thread
« Reply #1322 on: July 24, 2024, 11:01:11 AM »
This thread will become relevant once again in 2025.

Offline yuneeq

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Re: Peace In The Middle East Master Thread
« Reply #1323 on: July 24, 2024, 11:11:04 PM »
This thread will become irrelevant once again in 2025.

FTFY
Visibly Jewish

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Re: Peace In The Middle East Master Thread
« Reply #1324 on: August 21, 2024, 03:56:17 AM »
Reuters reporting that the Taliban are throwing the UN out of Afghanistan. The irony is strong with this one.
https://www.jpost.com/breaking-news/article-815653
Taliban FM: "UN reports are based on prejudices and anecdotes detrimental to interests of Afghanistan and the Afghan people."
Quote from: ExGingi
Echo chambers are boring and don't contribute much to deeper thinking and understanding!

Offline yelped

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Offline yelped

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Re: Peace In The Middle East Master Thread
« Reply #1326 on: September 09, 2024, 09:42:19 AM »

Offline yfr bachur

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Re: Peace In The Middle East Master Thread
« Reply #1327 on: September 10, 2024, 08:49:18 AM »

Offline SSLPhD

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Re: Peace In The Middle East Master Thread
« Reply #1328 on: September 10, 2024, 09:21:32 AM »
can we get a screen shot for those with filters?

It's a bit long for a screenshot. Here's the text:

dan linnaeus
@DanLinnaeus

Dr. Einat Wilf: "Our country is being torn apart by a terrible struggle over something that doesn't really exist.

A few months ago, one of the senior American negotiators in the peace process said in a closed meeting that "after thirty years, he had to admit that there was never really a negotiation." According to him, "Israel offered, and Arafat said no. Israel offered more, and Arafat said no. Israel offered more, and Abu Mazen said no." He further added, "there was never a moment when there were real negotiations in the sense that the Palestinians tried to reach an agreed and acceptable outcome."

I add that to the extent there were negotiations during the years of the 'peace process,' they were conducted between the U.S. and Israel. The U.S. pressured Israel, and Israel offered more. The U.S. pressured again, and Israel offered more. But throughout those years of what was called the 'peace process,' we never truly bothered to check whether the Palestinians even accepted the most basic condition for any peace solution based on two states, which is that one of the two states is the nation-state of the Jewish people. We assumed that this was the intention behind the expression 'two states,' but that was only an assumption from our side. As far as Palestinian internalization that they are not refugees and that there is no such thing as a 'right of return' to Israel, there was never a moment when they were truly ready to accept a two-state solution where one of those states is the Jewish state.

This dynamic is repeating itself now. Ostensibly, there are negotiations about a deal to release the hostages, there are frameworks and stages, and the Americans are constantly pressuring the Israelis to agree to more, and Israel generally agrees, but there is no real deal from the Palestinian side. To understand this, one must listen not to the Americans, not to people on our side, but to the Palestinians.

If there is one thing I have committed to myself since realizing that the Palestinians do not lie about fundamental issues, it is to listen to them without masking what they say with my wishful thinking. For many months now, I have been listening to the voices coming from their side, and through the veil of 'negotiations,' flights to Doha and Paris, and Americans saying 'any minute now,' it is clear that there is no real deal to return all the hostages (and now we even have the document from Bild).

The enormous failure in managing the political, diplomatic, and military campaign has led to the situation where, eleven full months after Hamas and its supporters' invasion and massacre in Israel, Hamas feels secure enough to insist on the same position it presented after the invasion and massacre: full Israeli withdrawal, Hamas remaining in full control of Gaza, including the border with Egypt, and billions flowing in for 'reconstruction' (yes, the same reconstruction as in every previous round). Given the asymmetry in goals, this is Hamas’s definition of 'total victory,' with all the implications for inspiring our enemies as a whole.

For those asking — from Hamas's perspective, it has not paid a price, certainly not one that counts as a price in its eyes. The civilian casualties are not a price, and the skilled killers we have killed are already being replaced by others. As long as Hamas controls Gaza (thanks to Israel's capitulation in allowing regular supplies into Gaza and the total blindness to the double game being played by Qatar and Egypt, and of course, the American stupidity/naivety), and is in a position to demand what it demanded the day after the invasion and massacre.

And even for those saying we should accept this deal with all its implications, it's unclear that it even really exists. Because from Hamas's perspective, the main point is to ensure that Israel won’t attack again or threaten its rule, and for that, it is quite likely that hostages will be retained to ensure a horrifying and drawn-out negotiation over them to prevent Israel from acting against it. The enemy we are facing is not stupid. It has studied Israeli society. The talk of 'we’ll make a deal, and then we’ll do what we want in Gaza' shows that we still underestimate the enemy, its determination, and its sadism.

Instead of facing the horrific failure of managing the campaign since October 7th and acknowledging the determined enemy in front of us, we are tearing ourselves apart, blaming each other, blaming the hostage families who are tormented with worry, and getting bogged down in discussions about negotiations. Instead, we should understand that we need leadership that will conduct a determined campaign and policy (actions, not empty talk) that recognizes the gravity of the moment and the threat, that will not lead us to the terrible choice between abandoning the hostages and Israeli capitulation, and will create a different, new alternative.

The initial major mistake was to assume that the release of the hostages is opposed to the goal of defeating Hamas. It is exactly the same goal—precisely because for Hamas, keeping the hostages is a guarantee of its victory, and therefore, defeating Hamas is the only way to free the hostages. But defeating Hamas depends on a combination of a political, diplomatic, and military campaign that, first and foremost, makes clear that Israel has stopped supplying its enemy during the war, and that at least from Israel's side, nothing goes in until the hostages come out.

This is a policy that makes it clear that Egypt and Qatar are welcome to supply Hamas through the border with Egypt, and we won’t stop it (even if we are stationed at the border). We have a legal obligation to allow it, but not to do it ourselves from within our borders. As long as the enemy has not surrendered and there is no occupation but only a prolonged war, this is not our responsibility. We need a policy that works to clear northern Gaza and Gaza City and pushes the population southward with a clear statement that we will stop only when all the hostages are freed.

We have a bitter enemy who has long believed that the opportunity has fallen into its hands to bring to an end the mad experiment of maintaining a sovereign Jewish state and is acting in the cruelest way toward this goal. This is not an enemy seeking to achieve a limited goal of living alongside us in dignity or freeing some murderers from our prisons. Against such an enemy, we must be no less determined."
45/50, 46/63

Offline UKinNYS

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Re: Peace In The Middle East Master Thread
« Reply #1329 on: September 10, 2024, 05:38:27 PM »
very cool when someone you know has his new book on Bibi's desk
&t=1s

Offline yelped

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Offline yelped

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Offline yelped

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Offline AsherO

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Re: Peace In The Middle East Master Thread
« Reply #1333 on: September 29, 2024, 10:33:02 PM »
DDF FFB (Forum From Birth)

Offline Chester7

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Re: Peace In The Middle East Master Thread
« Reply #1334 on: September 29, 2024, 10:35:41 PM »

Offline Kobe Bryant

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Re: Peace In The Middle East Master Thread
« Reply #1335 on: September 30, 2024, 08:36:17 AM »
It is amazing what close to four years of terrible American foreign policy and a week administration can do to world peace and prosperity!

Offline Savingsbeast

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Re: Peace In The Middle East Master Thread
« Reply #1336 on: September 30, 2024, 03:20:10 PM »
Not sure in which thread to post it, so here goes.

https://x.com/VDHanson/status/1840743806519652685

Israel Unbound?
The Biden-Harris cohort, in their serial calls for an Israeli ceasefires with Hezbollah and Hamas, and their election-year paranoias of losing Michigan voters, seem to ignore these killers’ history.

And it is quite long, especially in the case of Hezbollah. Remember:

Its 40 years of murdering Americans and Jews; Its mission, as the late Mr. Nasrallah bragged last summer, of ending this “cancerous growth and this germ of corruption”;

Its zeal immediately after October 7th to pile-on and attack Israel (some 8,000 of its rockets ago);

Its strategy of displacing at one time over 80,000 Israelis from their homes and bleeding the Israeli economy with no war/no peace rocketing;

Its stockpiling of a reportedly 150,000 rockets to murder Jews, the vast majority stored beneath houses and civilian centers;

Its murdering by rocket of 12 Israeli Druze children to start its latest iteration of the war.

So, after the October 7 massacres and atrocities—and subsequently some 20,000 rockets collectively launched at Israeli civilians by Hamas, Hezbollah, the Houthis, and Iran—Israel could not afford to listen to any more Macron lectures, any more EU virtue-signaling, any more UN hate “resolutions”, or any more Biden-Harris-Blinken-Sullivan moral equivalency pontifications.

There was relative calm prior to October 7, and both Hezbollah and Hamas chose not just to end it, but to go pre-civilizational against Israel.

And now?

The world has been listening for years to the Hamas blood-curdling boasts of destroying Israel. They have heard all Hezbollah’s nihilist threats of all-out, no-holds-barred existential war with Israel. They have been reminded nonstop about Hezbollah’s ballyhooed inexhaustible supplies of rockets, and of Iran’s endless vows to do whatever it takes to destroy the “Zionist entity”.

After the mass killing October 7, all these terrorists assumed that the world would once again beg or bribe them to moderate their terrorist killing, and order Israel to remain “proportionate” and not tangle with such murderous foes and their overwhelming resources.

But this past year, Israel’s enemies, neutrals, and allies failed to remember a few essential truths about Israel:

1) that if Israel is ever pushed to the existential brink (and it was by Iran, Hamas, and Hezbollah), it will have no choice other than becoming unrestrained, given there can be no trajectories to a second Holocaust;

2) that its own prior restraint and those restrictions put upon it by its allies have masked its real strength and encouraged its enemies foolishly to ignore the mortal danger they would find should they incite a full-fledged conflict with a righteously nothing-left-to-lose Israel;

3) in our amoral world, the more Israel is proportionate and listens to Western appeasers, the more it loses deterrence among its terrorist neighbors, while the more it replies unpredictably and disproportionately to them, the more it will deter their aggressions.

So here we are in a surreal world in which supreme terrorist killers of Hezbollah now whine they are victims of “terrorism”, in which the fiery Supreme Leader Ayatollah Ali Khamenei issues his boilerplate threats from an Iranian “secure location”, and in which Iran is hesitant to incite its usual Hezbollah and Hamas appendages lest it too finds itself in its once wished-for full missile and bomb exchange with Israel, which recent history suggests it will utterly lose.

In sum, accustomed Middle-East pieties are dissolving before our eyes.

Offline Savingsbeast

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Re: Peace In The Middle East Master Thread
« Reply #1337 on: September 30, 2024, 03:25:33 PM »
From tweet above:
Quote
1) that if Israel is ever pushed to the existential brink (and it was by Iran, Hamas, and Hezbollah), it will have no choice other than becoming unrestrained, given there can be no trajectories to a second Holocaust;
Is this what Harris meant all along "What can be, unburdened by what has been"?

Offline Chester7

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Re: Peace In The Middle East Master Thread
« Reply #1338 on: September 30, 2024, 05:16:15 PM »
From tweet above:Is this what Harris meant all along "What can be, unburdened by what has been"?
Israel is showing the world what can be, unburdened by what has been:

https://x.com/DrEliDavid/status/1839768349988753738

Offline UKinNYS

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Re: Peace In The Middle East Master Thread
« Reply #1339 on: September 30, 2024, 05:51:14 PM »
How is this guy still given attention given how wrong he has been is beyond me.



While addressing the Israeli troops, Barak said that Israel's withdrawal from the territory now meant that an entire new threshold for responding to violence from the Lebanese side must now be set up.

Given the withdrawal, there is no justification for attacking Israeli soldiers or civilians he said.

The last Israeli troops and tanks rolled out of Lebanon at dawn on Wednesday, completing a swift and dramatic pull-out from the southern zone Israel occupied for nearly two decades and closing one of the most bitterly divisive chapters in the nation's history.

The last Israeli tank crossed over the border at 6:41 a.m. local - less than six hours after Prime Minister Ehud Barak gave the final order to leave, and six weeks ahead of Israel's self-imposed July 7th deadline for getting out.

SOUNDBITE: (Hebrew) (APPROXIMATE TRANSLATION)

"We intend to set from today a whole new threshold for Israel's response (to violence) not only here near the border, but also throughout Lebanon. Whoever now tries to hurt the state of Israel since we left Lebanon, will have no justification, no reason to shoot at an Israeli citizen or soldier. In such conditions I would like to see who dares to shoot at Israeli soldiers or villagers. "