Author Topic: Is Covid Spiking in Boro Park?  (Read 22163 times)

Offline shaulyaakov

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Re: Is Covid Spiking in Boro Park?
« Reply #105 on: August 24, 2020, 05:47:41 PM »
Bde on your friends fathers. But ask any poskim and they will tell you that covid now in the local frum communities is not Pikuach nefesh. Obviously irresponsibility isn't a good thing but where do we draw the line? One person on this thread said that its selfish and your killing people to break the 14 day quarantine. So if people say things like that how will we ever have a healthy approach to it?.
There are poskim who disagree. What I don't understand is why the Dina DeMalchusa element isn't getting more consideration.

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Re: Is Covid Spiking in Boro Park?
« Reply #106 on: August 24, 2020, 05:48:10 PM »
Bde on your friends fathers. But ask any poskim and they will tell you that covid now in the local frum communities is not Pikuach nefesh. Obviously irresponsibility isn't a good thing but where do we draw the line? One person on this thread said that its selfish and your killing people to break the 14 day quarantine. So if people say things like that how will we ever have a healthy approach to it?.

I have yet to see a posek put in writing any halachic basis for not needing to take precautions or listen to EOs or medical directives. All I've seen is people doing what they want to do, when they want to do it, and blaming it on whatever boich svara or nameless posek is convenient to them at the moment.
When you find yourself agreeing with me more often than not, it's time for a cheshbon hanefesh.

Offline yaakov35

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Re: Is Covid Spiking in Boro Park?
« Reply #107 on: August 24, 2020, 05:49:25 PM »


. All I've seen is people doing what they want to do, when they want to do it, and blaming it on whatever boich svara or nameless posek is convenient to them at the moment.

Can you reuse my own line on me? Is that even legal? Like breaking quarantine

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Re: Is Covid Spiking in Boro Park?
« Reply #108 on: August 24, 2020, 05:49:39 PM »
I know people don't like it, but I'm going to use the car analogy. People die in car accidents and yet we still drive cars (just this week klal yisroel lost a 19 y/o), there is some point where we go back to normal life. The situation now is very different than it was in March.

And yet we still implement rules, like stop signs, traffic lights, speed limits, and no drinking or texting while driving. Have a wedding, drive a car. Take precautions and follow the rules.
When you find yourself agreeing with me more often than not, it's time for a cheshbon hanefesh.

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Re: Is Covid Spiking in Boro Park?
« Reply #109 on: August 24, 2020, 05:50:56 PM »

Can you reuse my own line on me? Is that even legal? Like breaking quarantine

In case you don't remember, I asked days ago of both you and @aygart to provide any halachic basis for ignoring the EO. I'm still waiting on an answer.
When you find yourself agreeing with me more often than not, it's time for a cheshbon hanefesh.

Online Euclid

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Re: Is Covid Spiking in Boro Park?
« Reply #110 on: August 24, 2020, 05:51:23 PM »

This is why we aren't MO....
Literally an alternate universe.
We know why Otisville davens nusach sefard.

Offline yaakov35

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Re: Is Covid Spiking in Boro Park?
« Reply #111 on: August 24, 2020, 05:52:38 PM »

Thats because of no tachnun. Not necessarily because that's the nussach everyone there davens.

Offline avromie7

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Re: Is Covid Spiking in Boro Park?
« Reply #112 on: August 24, 2020, 05:53:12 PM »
I wonder what people who type "u" instead of "you" do with all their free time.

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Re: Is Covid Spiking in Boro Park?
« Reply #113 on: August 24, 2020, 05:54:07 PM »
The wholesale bashing of other Jewish communities and hashkafos is unnecessary and uncalled for. It serves no purpose.
When you find yourself agreeing with me more often than not, it's time for a cheshbon hanefesh.

Offline oldguy

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Re: Is Covid Spiking in Boro Park?
« Reply #114 on: August 24, 2020, 05:56:07 PM »
There are poskim who disagree. What I don't understand is why the Dina DeMalchusa element isn't getting more consideration.
In case you don't remember, I asked days ago of both you and @aygart to provide any halachic basis for ignoring the EO. I'm still waiting on an answer.
Does it say anywhere in Daled Chelkei Shulchan Aruch anything implying Dina D'Malchusa besides regarding to money matters?
« Last Edit: August 24, 2020, 06:16:29 PM by oldguy »

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Re: Is Covid Spiking in Boro Park?
« Reply #115 on: August 24, 2020, 06:07:48 PM »
Does it saw anywhere in Daled Chelkei Shulchan Aruch anything implying Dina D'Malchusa besides regarding to money matters?

Sorry, I'll be the first to admit I'm no talmid chacham. If you're saying that we are under no obligation to follow the law of our secular governments in areas that are not monetary, please educate me. This is the first I'm hearing of such a concept.
When you find yourself agreeing with me more often than not, it's time for a cheshbon hanefesh.

Offline oldguy

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Re: Is Covid Spiking in Boro Park?
« Reply #116 on: August 24, 2020, 06:13:31 PM »
Sorry, I'll be the first to admit I'm no talmid chacham. If you're saying that we are under no obligation to follow the law of our secular governments in areas that are not monetary, please educate me. This is the first I'm hearing of such a concept.
There is a concept of הוה מתפלל בשלומה של מלכות, שאלמלא, איש את רעהו חיים בלעו. but the whole Halacha of Dina D'Malchusa comes from the concept of eminent domain (Not exactly that concept, but similar, as the king has the right to take all your $ so he has the right to make laws about them), and that would only apply to monetary matters (Machlokes if Karka and Metaltilim or only 1 of them).

Don't get me wrong, I'm not getting at all into the discussion how we should go on in life, I'm just bringing up a point that all discussions regarding Dina D'Malchusa are not relevant, If you want to go into Pikuach Nefesh or Safek Pikuach nefesh that's another discussion.
« Last Edit: August 24, 2020, 06:30:12 PM by oldguy »

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Re: Is Covid Spiking in Boro Park?
« Reply #117 on: August 24, 2020, 06:14:33 PM »
The wholesale bashing of other Jewish communities and hashkafos is unnecessary and uncalled for. It serves no purpose.
Agreed. But the bulk of these arguments are because of these differences in hashkafa. My line about Otisville comes from a feature, not a bug. I'm not bashing, it's reality; and explains why these debates here about the laws just go in circles.

They're different universes. @yaakov35 is correct.

(Reposting because I mistakenly deleted.)

Offline shaulyaakov

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Re: Is Covid Spiking in Boro Park?
« Reply #118 on: August 24, 2020, 06:25:21 PM »
What I'm getting out of this is that it's important for everyone ELSE to keep up the restrictions so that peoplevwho wish can do whatever they want.

Offline Afrages6

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Re: Is Covid Spiking in Boro Park?
« Reply #119 on: August 24, 2020, 06:49:36 PM »
What I'm getting out of this is that it's important for everyone ELSE to keep up the restrictions so that peoplevwho wish can do whatever they want.
Who’s everyone else?
When should these restrictions end?
NY has had under 1 percent test positive for over 2 weeks and yet there is no end in sight to these crazy restrictions.