Author Topic: Is Covid Spiking in Boro Park?  (Read 14274 times)

Online shaulyaakov

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Re: Is Covid Spiking in Boro Park?
« Reply #90 on: August 24, 2020, 05:29:59 PM »
I think we're getting lost in semantics. The point is, people from OOT should not be coming in for simchos. If they feel it's important enough that they need to be there in person, there are remedies available to allow that to happen. Just because those remedies are difficult doesn't mean we should discard them and do as we please.
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Re: Is Covid Spiking in Boro Park?
« Reply #91 on: August 24, 2020, 05:31:54 PM »
I'm inspired by our commitment to Pikuach Nefesh.
Safek pikuach nefesh?

https://mishpacha.com/where-life-comes-from/


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Re: Is Covid Spiking in Boro Park?
« Reply #92 on: August 24, 2020, 05:33:03 PM »
You don't think people coming from hotspots are a risk?
Most of the areas on the quarantine lists aren't hotspots, some of the states on the list aren't hotspots but fall within the parameters and even in the states that are, there are many areas with a very low number of infections but because they happen to be part off the same state they're automatically included.
I wonder what people who type "u" instead of "you" do with all their free time.

Offline Ergel

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Re: Is Covid Spiking in Boro Park?
« Reply #93 on: August 24, 2020, 05:33:51 PM »
I'm sure you know numerous people who have died recently of covid.... In NY.  This isn't march anymore, they have more treatments and fact is far less people are dying. Get real. Every infected person isn't dropping dead now like they were then.
I'm confused. They have treatements in NY but not in other locations?
Life isn't about checking the boxes. Nobody cares.

Online shaulyaakov

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Re: Is Covid Spiking in Boro Park?
« Reply #94 on: August 24, 2020, 05:34:41 PM »
Safek pikuach nefesh?

https://mishpacha.com/where-life-comes-from/

We know that social distancing saves lives. This isn't really in dispute. The point is whether a seemingly onerous requirement is required. The answer is to follow the law as well as medical experts.

Also, the sugya is far more complicated as many times we DO treat a Safek P"N like a Vadai, but that's beyond the scope.

Online Lurker

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Re: Is Covid Spiking in Boro Park?
« Reply #95 on: August 24, 2020, 05:34:46 PM »
I'm sure you know numerous people who have died recently of covid.... In NY.  This isn't march anymore, they have more treatments and fact is far less people are dying. Get real. Every infected person isn't dropping dead now like they were then.

In the last 3 weeks, 2 of my friends buried their fathers. No, this wasn't in NY. The point is, people still do die from Covid, and the more people we allow to get infected, the greater the chances are that some will die.

You don't need to look very far to see infections that have happened at simchos. No, it was not "just a few." There have been cases every week since Tisha B'Av, and there were cases before the 3 weeks, as well. The more this happens, the more likely it is that locals get infected (see @Mikeoracle's frustrating personal account, and the resulting further spread within the local community). Dismissing it because we just can't be bothered is wrong, and I have yet to see any halachic basis for it.
« Last Edit: August 24, 2020, 05:43:11 PM by Lurker »
Please wear a mask.

Offline Ergel

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Re: Is Covid Spiking in Boro Park?
« Reply #96 on: August 24, 2020, 05:34:53 PM »
Most of the areas on the quarantine lists aren't hotspots, some of the states on the list aren't hotspots but fall within the parameters and even in the states that are, there are many areas with a very low number of infections but because they happen to be part off the same state they're automatically included.
That may be true. So should we therefore say everyone is welcome? Or should we make an actual determination of where is there risk and take necessary precautions for those?
Life isn't about checking the boxes. Nobody cares.

Online avromie7

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Re: Is Covid Spiking in Boro Park?
« Reply #97 on: August 24, 2020, 05:36:58 PM »
So how do you define who is at risk? Or are we just OK with some people getting sick and maybe some people dying? Because Corona is over and that's the price we pay for living our normal lives?
I know people don't like it, but I'm going to use the car analogy. People die in car accidents and yet we still drive cars (just this week klal yisroel lost a 19 y/o), there is some point where we go back to normal life. The situation now is very different than it was in March.
I wonder what people who type "u" instead of "you" do with all their free time.

Offline yaakov35

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Re: Is Covid Spiking in Boro Park?
« Reply #98 on: August 24, 2020, 05:37:09 PM »
I'm confused. They have treatements in NY but not in other locations?
Call it what you'd like. People aren't nearly as sick as they used to be and aren't dying like they used to in NY. Can't speak for other places.

Offline Ergel

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Re: Is Covid Spiking in Boro Park?
« Reply #99 on: August 24, 2020, 05:38:17 PM »
Call it what you'd like. People aren't nearly as sick as they used to be and aren't dying like they used to in NY. Can't speak for other places.
LOL
I get it. Basically whatever the answer needs to be that you aren't inconvenienced
Life isn't about checking the boxes. Nobody cares.

Offline yaakov35

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Re: Is Covid Spiking in Boro Park?
« Reply #100 on: August 24, 2020, 05:39:46 PM »
LOL
I get it. Basically whatever the answer needs to be that you aren't inconvenienced
I know people who got sick then and now. You can't deny that in March people were dying from one second to the next and now that just isn't the case.

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Re: Is Covid Spiking in Boro Park?
« Reply #101 on: August 24, 2020, 05:40:06 PM »
In the last 3 weeks, 2 of my friends buried their fathers. No, this wasn't in NY. The point is, people still do die from Covid, and the more people we allow to get infected, the greater the chances are that some will die.

You don't need to look very far to see infections that have happened at simchos. No, it was not "just a few." There have been cases every week since Tisha B'Av, and there were cases before the 3 weeks, as well. The more this happens, the more likely it is that locals get infected (see @Mikeoracle's frustrating personal account, and the resulting community spread). Dismissing it because we just can't be bothered is wrong, and I have yet to see any halachic basis for it.
CMIIW, but I don't think that's called community spread, community spread is when people get it by going about their daily life without knowing where it came from.
That may be true. So should we therefore say everyone is welcome? Or should we make an actual determination of where is there risk and take necessary precautions for those?
Broad restrictions lead to broad non compliance.
I wonder what people who type "u" instead of "you" do with all their free time.

Offline yaakov35

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Re: Is Covid Spiking in Boro Park?
« Reply #102 on: August 24, 2020, 05:42:40 PM »
In the last 3 weeks, 2 of my friends buried their fathers. No, this wasn't in NY. The point is, people still do die from Covid, and the more people we allow to get infected, the greater the chances are that some will die.

You don't need to look very far to see infections that have happened at simchos. No, it was not "just a few." There have been cases every week since Tisha B'Av, and there were cases before the 3 weeks, as well. The more this happens, the more likely it is that locals get infected (see @Mikeoracle's frustrating personal account, and the resulting community spread). Dismissing it because we just can't be bothered is wrong, and I have yet to see any halachic basis for it.
Bde on your friends fathers. But ask any poskim and they will tell you that covid now in the local frum communities is not Pikuach nefesh. Obviously irresponsibility isn't a good thing but where do we draw the line? One person on this thread said that its selfish and your killing people to break the 14 day quarantine. So if people say things like that how will we ever have a healthy approach to it?.

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Re: Is Covid Spiking in Boro Park?
« Reply #103 on: August 24, 2020, 05:44:35 PM »
CMIIW, but I don't think that's called community spread

You're right. Edited to reflect that I meant spread to locals within the community.
Please wear a mask.

Online shaulyaakov

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Re: Is Covid Spiking in Boro Park?
« Reply #104 on: August 24, 2020, 05:46:54 PM »
I know people don't like it, but I'm going to use the car analogy. People die in car accidents and yet we still drive cars (just this week klal yisroel lost a 19 y/o), there is some point where we go back to normal life. The situation now is very different than it was in March.
The car analogy is still bad. But I'll play along:

We put traffic lights at  busy intersections to save lives. Imagine if everyone who got to a red light got to decide whether or not they thought it was safe to proceed. Sure, most of the time, people would guess right. But all it takes is 1 time for someone to guess wrong for it to be bad.

The 14 day quarantine is a traffic light. Individuals don't get to decide if it applies to them or not.