Crown Heights as a COVID-19 lab

[Dan]

I don't think anyone is frustrated with COVID. If anything there is frustration at inconsistent and illogical directives.

I take issue with your קטגוריא that supposedly anyone is sacrificing elders at the altar for comfort. I strongly believe that if there was a coherent and consistent sensible directive, a vast majority of people would comply.

Sorry, but who complied when C"H B"D gave directives on masks in Tishrei?

[ExGingi]

Sorry, but who complied when C"H B"D gave directives on masks in Tishrei?

I don't specifically recall directives regarding masks during Tishrei, but I have already noted that the directives from the C"H B"D were (unfortunately) not taken seriously enough as they were not given seriously enough. And please let's not go down that rabbit hole on this public forum.

And for that matter, what changed between Tishrei and now, making current directives different?

[Dan]

I don't specifically recall directives regarding masks during Tishrei, but I have already noted that the directives from the C"H B"D were (unfortunately) not taken seriously enough as they were not given seriously enough. And please let's not go down that rabbit hole on this public forum.

How much more seriously did you want them to be given?
It was crystal clear, people just chose to ignore them. And at some point they gave up, no point harping on something that they know won't be followed.

[ExGingi]

How much more seriously did you want them to be given?
It was crystal clear, people just chose to ignore them. And at some point they gave up, no point harping on something that they know won't be followed.

Let's not continue this here. I am willing to try to explain this to you in private.

[Dan]

Let's not continue this here. I am willing to try to explain this to you in private.

You can relate it over to my CLE co-separatist @shmelke who flew in for his uncle's levaya today 

[Eru Ilúvatar]

Expressing frustration in general at the COVID is cancelled attitude. Masks help others, not yourself, which is the epitome of what a chassid is all about.

And yet, for want of comfort we are sacrificing our elders at the altar. Hashem yeracheim.

I agree though important to note that N95/KN95 do a lot to help the wearer as well.

[Dan]

I agree though important to note that N95/KN95 do a lot to help the wearer as well.

Not for any chossid

[4yourinfo]

Expressing frustration in general at the COVID is cancelled attitude. Masks help others, not yourself, which is the epitome of what a chassid is all about.

And yet, for want of comfort we are sacrificing our elders at the altar. Hashem yeracheim.

Who decided Masks is it?? Maybe you have to do more - maybe you have to live in a cave? What about washing your hands every hour? People got completely caught up with this mask if you wear one your saving the world if you don't wear one your killing the elders! Who exactly can decide it's about the mask??

[Dan]

Who decided Masks is it?? Maybe you have to do more - maybe you have to live in a cave? What about washing your hands every hour? People got completely caught up with this mask if you wear one your saving the world if you don't wear one your killing the elders! Who exactly can decide it's about the mask??

There's been plenty of research on it @yuneeq has posted lots of links. Certainly NOT a silver bullet, but it does save lives.
It's not comfortable, I get it. Amazing how it became such a flash point though.

Seatbelts are also uncomfortable, but we've all gotten used to that.

[4yourinfo]

There's been plenty of research on it @yuneeq has posted lots of links. Certainly NOT a silver bullet, but it does save lives.
It's not comfortable, I get it. Amazing how it became such a flash point though.

Seatbelts are also uncomfortable, but we've all gotten used to that.

I know people that basically are quarantining this entire time why isn't that the requirement? I just don't understand why the mask became THE place where we draw the line to someone  commiting רציחה.

[Dan]

I know people that basically are quarantining this entire time why isn't that the requirement? I just don't understand why the mask became THE place where we draw the line to someone  commiting רציחה.

First of all, nobody said anything about murder. Inconsiderate, certainly.
Second, it's inhumane to require people to be locked up for a year. We can all live our lives as normal, with basic precautions.
But it seems that many people insist on an all or nothing approach, without any ability to deal with nuance.

[ExGingi]

First of all, nobody said anything about murder. Inconsiderate, certainly.
Second, it's inhumane to require people to be locked up for a year. We can all live our lives as normal, with basic precautions.
But it seems that many people insist on an all or nothing approach, without any ability to deal with nuance.

Crown Heights is its own nuance (as is Williamsburg, as is KJ, etc.)

[ckmk47]

Those with antibodies aren't sharing covid germs with anyone, so they don't need a mask.
If 60% of CH already had it, what percentage need to wear masks?

[iluv2travel]

Seatbelts are also uncomfortable, but we've all gotten used to that.

I agree that masks should be worn whether one agrees if they're effective or not.

However, with that being said, I personally wouldn't compare the discomfort of having one's nose and mouth covered (sometimes for extensive amounts of times) to be the same uncomfortable as wearing a seat belt, which to most people causes minimal or no discomfort.

ETA: We should probably move this discussion to the Crown Heights thread and leave this as the BDE thread, which we hopefully won't add anymore names to.

[aygart]

Those with antibodies aren't sharing covid germs with anyone, so they don't need a mask.
If 60% of CH already had it, what percentage need to wear masks?

Ummmm, at least 40% if that is the reasoning. Maybe more to avoid the peer pressure preventing the ones who should from wearing it. I have yet to see a place successful in having only a portion wear masks.

[lcm]

ETA: We should probably move this discussion to the Crown Heights thread and leave this as the BDE thread, which we hopefully won't add anymore names to.

+1

[Dan]

Ummmm, at least 40% if that is the reasoning. Maybe more to avoid the peer pressure preventing the ones who should from wearing it. I have yet to see a place successful in having only a portion wear masks.

+1K. Impossible to enforce.

[Dan]

I agree that masks should be worn whether one agrees if they're effective or not.

However, with that being said, I personally wouldn't compare the discomfort of having one's nose and mouth covered (sometimes for extensive amounts of times) to be the same uncomfortable as wearing a seat belt, which to most people causes minimal or no discomfort.

ETA: We should probably move this discussion to the Crown Heights thread and leave this as the BDE thread, which we hopefully won't add anymore names to.

You just happen to be accustomed to seatbelts.
I daresay when they came out that it took a while and it took enforcement for people to use them. In Asia where some wear masks when they go out in general, I doubt they find them a nuisance.

[gozalim]

I think most people's crown heights experience are on both sides of @Dan 's
@ExGingi is probably in the minority of those genuinely confused at this point as to the guidance (perhaps due to his inside info)

[ExGingi]

I think most people's crown heights experience are on both sides of @Dan 's
@ExGingi is probably in the minority of those genuinely confused at this point as to the guidance (perhaps due to his inside info)

Your post is definitely confusing.