Are you offended by the term Ultra Orthodox?

[Lurker]

Rabbi Gifter would say “Orthodox is a greek word”, and the term Torah Jew should be used.

Anyone with any foresight knew that the term orthodox would be oh so easy to  hijack and redefine.

The Nazis didn't bother with superlatives or pejoratives; they just called us Jew. Let's leave the microaggressions to the sensitive snowflakes. When there's real anti-Semitism, we can deal with it. Until then,

if someone is going to use a slur against me, and the worst they can do is that I'm extreme in my Judaism, G-d bless them.

[chinagel]

The Nazis didn't bother with superlatives or pejoratives; they just called us Jew. Let's leave the microaggressions to the sensitive snowflakes. When there's real anti-Semitism, we can deal with it. Until then,

So now Hitler is your Rabbi?

[Yo ssi]

So now Hitler is your Rabbi?

A lesson can be learned from anyone and everyone.

[Lurker]

So now Hitler is your Rabbi?

Definitely. Exactly what I said.

[chinagel]

A lesson can be learned from anyone and everyone.

What do we learn from Nazis killing those who had jewish fathers? They're also jewish?

[Yo ssi]

What do we learn from Nazis killing those who had jewish fathers? They're also jewish?

A lesson can be learned from anyone and everyone.

[NTorch]

What do we learn from Nazis killing those who had jewish fathers? They're also jewish?

What we learn is that Esav Soneh L'Yaakov. Regardless of how you view yourself or your fellow Jews, the anti-semites at their core see all of us the same way.

If you need another example you can watch the video of Jews being beaten in Philly yesterday when they were "showing solidarity with BLM" https://nypost.com/2020/10/29/blm-mob-violently-chases-jewish-men-at-philadelphia-protest/

We need to stop labelling other Jews and ourselves and not give any fuel to the myth that the anti-semites will look at certain Jews differently because of how we identify as Jews.

Modern,yeshivish,Chassidic,liberal,conservative, Republican, Democrat or Independent, we are all just Jews to them.

[chinagel]

(some) also see halachic non-jews in the same way. Has zero bearing on me considering them jewish.
Point is, Anti-Semites don't get to decide our policy.

[Lurker]

(some) also see halachic non-jews in the same way. Has zero bearing on me considering them jewish.
Point is, Anti-Semites don't get to decide our policy.

So why do you care what they call you?

[chinagel]

So why do you care what they call you?

Here's the kicker.
I don't.
ETA: I just can't stand the Nazi analogy. Doesn't make any sense to me, and I hear it all the time.

[Lurker]

Here's the kicker.
I don't.

Shkoiach

[yuneeq]

It's definitely derogatory, and it has become a widespread acceptable term that constantly incites anti-semitism.
Sad thing that many ultra-Orthodox extremist Jews don't realize it, or worse, they don't care.

[EliJelly]

You're right. I'm just saying that if someone is going to use a slur against me, and the worst the can do is that I'm extreme in my Judaism, G-d bless them.

I don't care much for the slur matter of it, but when our way of observing religion is called ultra, its being perceived as extreme, and then we have a problem. The result is less respect and legitimacy for our way of life, from society, from government and from our secular employers. I have no doubt it is damaging. Why should anyone give into for "fanatical extremists".

And yes, that's my issue as well with the anti-vaxxers using religion as an excuse. 

[EliJelly]

Ngl

NGL, GIMF.

Am I the only one here suspecting that's a plot by Russian descendants colluding to overturn our democracy?

[Lurker]

Am I the only one here suspecting that's a plot by Russian descendants colluding to overturn our democracy?

AFAIK, none of my ancestors were Russian   

[EliJelly]

AFAIK, none of my ancestors were Russian   

Like so many others. But why tell everyone you're not a געבארן׳ע?

[shmoe joe]

it definitely depends in which context its said!

[Lurker]

I don't care much for the slur matter of it, but when our way of observing religion is called ultra, its being perceived as extreme, and then we have a problem. The result is less respect and legitimacy for our way of life, from society, from government and from our secular employers. I have no doubt it is damaging. Why should anyone give into for "fanatical extremists".

And yes, that's my issue as well with the anti-vaxxers using religion as an excuse.

I get that no one likes to be labeled or called names, especially by people who know nothing about them. And when you're afraid that name may have negative consequences, it's legitimate to dislike the label. I didn't grow up in a frum community. IME, Chassidim (and to some extent, black hatters) are always looked at as extreme by the outside world. We're in the same category as the Amish. The ones who get to know us form their opinions first-hand, and no media label will change their opinions. The ones who don't get to know us don't need to see "ultra" in the NYT to think what they think about us. People love us and people hate us. This is how it has always been and always will be. I don't believe that we are treated any differently because of that term.

On a personal level, is your approach to Yiddishkeit one of moderation? Do you aim to just be a Jew? Or do you aim higher, more than the bare minimum, a little extra? After 120, would you rather be described as a moderate Yid or an extreme Yid? If they're going to call us names, and they most definitely will, I'd just as well like to own this one.

[Lurker]

Like so many others. But why tell everyone you're not a געבארן׳ע?

I don't need their Gezhe. My grandfathers were the equivalent of "made men" in Lubavitch. I got coattails to ride on.

[yuneeq]

I get that no one likes to be labeled or called names, especially by people who know nothing about them. And when you're afraid that name may have negative consequences, it's legitimate to dislike the label. I didn't grow up in a frum community. IME, Chassidim (and to some extent, black hatters) are always looked at as extreme by the outside world. We're in the same category as the Amish. The ones who get to know us form their opinions first-hand, and no media label will change their opinions. The ones who don't get to know us don't need to see "ultra" in the NYT to think what they think about us. People love us and people hate us. This is how it has always been and always will be. I don't believe that we are treated any differently because of that term.

On a personal level, is your approach to Yiddishkeit one of moderation? Do you aim to just be a Jew? Or do you aim higher, more than the bare minimum, a little extra? After 120, would you rather be described as a moderate Yid or an extreme Yid? If they're going to call us names, and they most definitely will, I'd just as well like to own this one.

I will speak for myself, but when I hear the term radical Christian or right wing extremist, it definitely makes me perceive the person as a nut job before have a chance to read the story. Ultra Orthodox is exactly the same.