Author Topic: Predictions For What The Ds Will Do In Full Control Of DC?  (Read 4213 times)

Offline Shaya E

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Re: Predictions For What The Ds Will Do In Full Control Of DC?
« Reply #30 on: January 10, 2021, 03:09:12 PM »
Raising taxes on the rich isn't about bringing in more money, it's about class envy and political posturing

Hmm. On the one hand people complain about the spending, but when people propose actually raising money from the people who could most afford it, the knee-jerk reaction is that they have ulterior motives. I get being against taxes and handouts, but to imply that the taxes are to pay for anything but said handouts is stupid.
« Last Edit: January 10, 2021, 03:12:49 PM by Shaya E »

Offline Shaya E

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Re: Predictions For What The Ds Will Do In Full Control Of DC?
« Reply #31 on: January 10, 2021, 03:10:49 PM »
I agree, I think they will raise taxes in a way that has more political than practical impact. The US government doesnt need more tax revenue now when there is no inflation or interest on loans. Perhaps that will change before 2024

Have you received a stimulus check? Someone has to pay for that.

Offline zh cohen

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Re: Predictions For What The Ds Will Do In Full Control Of DC?
« Reply #32 on: January 10, 2021, 03:20:25 PM »
Colin Powell just said on CNN, I no longer consider myself a Republican.

Really?! I'm shocked that the guy who endorsed every Democrat presidential candidate in the past 20 years doesn't consider himself a Republican.

Offline PlatinumGuy

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Re: Predictions For What The Ds Will Do In Full Control Of DC?
« Reply #33 on: January 10, 2021, 03:21:53 PM »
Have you received a stimulus check? Someone has to pay for that.
Printers. Developing economies are paying for it with a fall in their currency values as global capital flees to the dollar enough to allows us to have zero inflation despite unprecedented burrowing and printing.

No reason to pay the bill today if we can push it off 10 years without interest
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Offline zh cohen

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Re: Predictions For What The Ds Will Do In Full Control Of DC?
« Reply #34 on: January 10, 2021, 03:22:02 PM »
Hmm. On the one hand people complain about the spending, but when people propose actually raising money from the people who could most afford it, the knee-jerk reaction is that they have ulterior motives. I get being against taxes and handouts, but to imply that the taxes are to pay for anything but said handouts is stupid.

The point is that it won't raise money because the people who can "most afford it" can also most afford to avoid the taxes (or move).

Offline Shaya E

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Re: Predictions For What The Ds Will Do In Full Control Of DC?
« Reply #35 on: January 10, 2021, 03:26:55 PM »
Printers. Developing economies are paying for it with a fall in their currency values as global capital flees to the dollar enough to allows us to have zero inflation despite unprecedented burrowing and printing.

No reason to pay the bill today if we can push it off 10 years without interest
So to clarify, if you would be in control, you would send thousands of dollars to every American all the time (COVID or no COVID). Or does even modern monetary theory have its limits. If it does, how are you sure we didn't already hit it. We can't have seen the affects of all the money printed over the last year. These things could take time to affect inflation.

Offline Shaya E

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Re: Predictions For What The Ds Will Do In Full Control Of DC?
« Reply #36 on: January 10, 2021, 03:29:59 PM »
The point is that it won't raise money because the people who can "most afford it" can also most afford to avoid the taxes (or move).

The wealthy are doing their best to avoid it regardless of how much you're taxing them. Some succeed more, some less and some not at all. We'll take what we can get. Again, it isn't a punishment, something as to fund the handouts.

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Re: Predictions For What The Ds Will Do In Full Control Of DC?
« Reply #37 on: January 10, 2021, 03:51:50 PM »
So to clarify, if you would be in control, you would send thousands of dollars to every American all the time (COVID or no COVID). Or does even modern monetary theory have its limits. If it does, how are you sure we didn't already hit it. We can't have seen the affects of all the money printed over the last year. These things could take time to affect inflation.
Im against sending people money now. Im for stimulating the economy with deficit spending until we start seeing inflation rise, at which point we can counter it by instituting interest rates.
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Offline Shaya E

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Re: Predictions For What The Ds Will Do In Full Control Of DC?
« Reply #38 on: January 10, 2021, 04:15:58 PM »
Im against sending people money now. Im for stimulating the economy with deficit spending until we start seeing inflation rise, at which point we can counter it by instituting interest rates.

Deficit spending and spending people money aren't mutually exclusive. All deficit spending means is that the money for the handout comes from borrowing instead of taxation. You're arguing to borrow instead of taxing. That's a valid argument, especially in today's world with practically no interest rates. But taxing on some level exists, now and always, as does borrowing (at least since 2000). With added expenses we need more income, to argue that the wealthy should foot some of that bill (and borrow the rest) doesn't have to for ulterior motives.

I would love to discuss financial theory with you but that wasn't the point of my original post.

Offline Shaya E

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Re: Predictions For What The Ds Will Do In Full Control Of DC?
« Reply #39 on: January 10, 2021, 04:18:58 PM »
As for deficit spending as a whole, it has its place. Which is why its always been used to control inflation, but it does lock up our ability to borrow in the future. The higher the debt, the harder it will be to borrow. So even putting interest aside (rates won't always remain so low) you have to watch the debt.

Offline Shaya E

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Re: Predictions For What The Ds Will Do In Full Control Of DC?
« Reply #40 on: January 10, 2021, 04:24:06 PM »
The interest on debt for this year was roughly $380 billion dollars. I believe (gotta do some research) that was roughly 10% of the budget. If that goes to much higher we won't be able to get a loan without astronomical interest rates. I could see a future where the US is downgraded to a lower credit worthiness rating and only then do people realize we might be in trouble.

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Re: Predictions For What The Ds Will Do In Full Control Of DC?
« Reply #41 on: January 10, 2021, 04:24:21 PM »
Student Loan Forgiveness?

Offline Shaya E

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Re: Predictions For What The Ds Will Do In Full Control Of DC?
« Reply #42 on: January 10, 2021, 04:25:40 PM »
I don't think so. But probably something to stop future students from accumulating so much debt.

Offline zh cohen

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Re: Predictions For What The Ds Will Do In Full Control Of DC?
« Reply #43 on: January 10, 2021, 06:06:18 PM »
But probably something to stop future students from accumulating so much debt.

Only if it doesn't come at the expense of college budgets.

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Re: Predictions For What The Ds Will Do In Full Control Of DC?
« Reply #44 on: January 10, 2021, 06:11:34 PM »
Deficit spending and spending people money aren't mutually exclusive. All deficit spending means is that the money for the handout comes from borrowing instead of taxation. You're arguing to borrow instead of taxing. That's a valid argument, especially in today's world with practically no interest rates. But taxing on some level exists, now and always, as does borrowing (at least since 2000). With added expenses we need more income, to argue that the wealthy should foot some of that bill (and borrow the rest) doesn't have to for ulterior motives.

I would love to discuss financial theory with you but that wasn't the point of my original post.
I oppose handouts, I was just saying the handouts now dont necessarily need to come from higher taxes now.
As for deficit spending as a whole, it has its place. Which is why its always been used to control inflation, but it does lock up our ability to borrow in the future. The higher the debt, the harder it will be to borrow. So even putting interest aside (rates won't always remain so low) you have to watch the debt.
If we use the money wisely, instead of handing it to people, we can ensure the US prospers and our credit rating remains the gold standard. Also worth noting how much of the debt is being bought by the Fed, which is right pocket owing the left pocket.

Deflation would be a much larger threat to US credit rating than a larger debt burden.
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