DC and PR Statehood

[Dan]

If one side already has the ID and the other side doesn’t have an ID yet, requiring an ID obviously makes it harder for one side.

Is there research done that shows this or is this speculation?
How do people without ID ever buy cigarettes or alcohol? Apply for food stamps or other gov't benefits? Go into a casino? Fly? Stay in a hotel? Etc...
Is there a reason to not get an ID that I'm not aware of?

[CountValentine]

Yes. If laws are put in place in order to prevent one side from voting it would be wrong (and illegal).

I didn't say prevent, I said harder. I was going to ask if there is a reason you always do that but I already know the answer.
Unless you have been living under a rock the R's try to pass laws to make it harder to vote and the D's try and pass laws to make it easier to vote.

[CountValentine]

Is there research done that shows this or is this speculation?
How do people without ID ever buy cigarettes or alcohol? Apply for food stamps or other gov't benefits? Go into a casino? Fly? Stay in a hotel? Etc...
Is there a reason to not get an ID that I'm not aware of?

Here is all you need to know. 

Unless you have been living under a rock the R's try to pass laws to make it harder to vote and the D's try and pass laws to make it easier to vote.

[zh cohen]

I didn't say prevent, I said harder.

I fixed my post.

R's try to pass laws to make it harder to vote

Even if this were true (and I think @Dan 's point is that requiring ID does not make it significantly harder) it does not make it harder for one side than it does for the other

[PlatinumGuy]

Which side doesn't have ID?

87% of blacks have an ID compared to 95% of whites, and blacks vote 80%+ D, but you already knew that.

Is there research done that shows this or is this speculation?

I don’t think anybody disputes it, here above is one source.

ETA link above is broken, see here http://www.projectvote.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/AMERICANS-WITH-PHOTO-ID-Research-Memo-February-2015.pdf

What there is no evidence of is any widespread voter fraud, that is definitely speculation (at best).

[CountValentine]

I fixed my post.

TY

Even if this were true (and I think @Dan 's point is that requiring ID does not make it significantly harder) it does not make it harder for one side than it does for the other

I agree it does not make it "significantly" harder but does make it harder which will cause some not to vote. Sometimes it is hard to understand the mindset of different groups of individuals.

Let me tell you a little story. When first started working at USPS they would hand out envelopes every second Friday. I ask what was going on and was told it was their check. So I asked you of the guys why he doesn't use DD. He said you need a bank account for that. I was floored a guy in his forties didn't have a bank account. Out of 30 or so they handed out only one person was of a different color. Do I need to paint a picture? 

[Dan]

What there is no evidence of is any widespread voter fraud, that is definitely speculation (at best).

And yet, you need ID to fly since 9/11, despite zero evidence that it has stopped a terrorist attack.
We need IDs for so much of our daily life. How come nobody says that's racist?

[CountValentine]

And yet, you need ID to fly since 9/11, despite zero evidence that it has stopped a terrorist attack.
We need IDs for so much of our daily life. How come nobody says that's racist?

Valid points but it doesn't change the fact of why one side is doing it.
I am not agreeing with either side but feel anything we can do to get more people to vote is a good thing.

[PlatinumGuy]

And yet, you need ID to fly since 9/11, despite zero evidence that it has stopped a terrorist attack.
We need IDs for so much of our daily life. How come nobody says that's racist?

You don’t need an ID to fly, that’s incorrect. Other ID requirements are criticized for having an racially outsized impact.

There also is evidence terrorist watch list and no fly lists have correctly flagged future terrorist acts.
 
I support voter ID but there is merit to both arguments.

[CountValentine]

I support voter ID but there is merit to both arguments.

How about a national ID issued at birth? This would cover everything but I am sure privacy would be a big concern.

[PlatinumGuy]

How about a national ID issued at birth? This would cover everything but I am sure privacy would be a big concern.

Personally I would go a step further and make it biometric + drastically reform voting with technology to get to 85%+ ‘turnout’, but that’s more of a radical opinion.

[CountValentine]

Ask Mr Redneck a question.
Should we have a gun ID to buy a gun? - Are you nuts? It is my 2A right.
Should we have a voters ID to vote? Are you nuts? Of course we should. It is not like you have a right to vote.

[zh cohen]

I agree it does not make it "significantly" harder but does make it harder which will cause some not to vote.

Right, but the number of people that it might cause not to vote is so small, that it is ridiculous to suggest that the laws are part of a Republican plot to tilt the elections towards themselves.

[PlatinumGuy]

Right, but the number of people that it might cause not to vote is so small, that it is ridiculous to suggest that the laws are part of a Republican plot to tilt the elections towards themselves.

There around 4,000,000 black voters who don’t have ID, and both of the last 2 election rounds were decided by ~100,000 voters.

[Kobe Bryant]

The House of Representatives just voted 216-208 to pass a bill that would grant statehood to Washington, D.C. — The bill now heads to the Senate, which is unlikely to pass.

[zh cohen]

Ask Mr Redneck a question.
Should we have a gun ID to buy a gun? - Are you nuts? It is my 2A right.
Should we have a voters ID to vote? Are you nuts? Of course we should. It is not like you have a right to vote.

This can easily be flipped on those who claim ID should not be required to vote (and it would be more correct. The only way you can buy a gun without ID is if it is a private sale between two individuals).

[zh cohen]

There around 4,000,000 black voters who don’t have ID, and both of the last 2 election rounds were decided by ~100,000 voters.

1 - link?
2 - How many white voters don't have ID?
3 - Do voter id laws provide easy opportunities to get id?

[Dan]

Valid points but it doesn't change the fact of why one side is doing it.
I am not agreeing with either side but feel anything we can do to get more people to vote is a good thing.

I mean, there's no evidence of people trying to checkin to hotel rooms that aren't theirs, but you still need ID.
I don't really understand why ID isn't racist to secure unemployment or buying a smoke, but it is for voting.
Other than the one side argument, which is weak. Either IDs are OK to ensure security or they're not.

[PlatinumGuy]

1 - link?
2 - How many white voters don't have ID?
3 - Do voter id laws provide easy opportunities to get id?

See link and numbers above.

[PlatinumGuy]

Other than the one side argument, which is weak.

The conversation started from that argument being applied to DC statehood.