Trump Impeachment Trial 2.0

[YitzyS]

Is there a court of law in this country that would admit as evidence a video montage that has been selectively and heavily edited and spliced with footage of speeches and protests?

Why can't unedited footage be shown? Having to edit footage to make it look like a Hollywood production implies that the real facts are not compelling enough for the cause.

[PlatinumGuy]

Will there be a secret ballot? IINM it would take 10 senators to force it not to be secret, which is very likely not to happen.

A secret ballot will likely mean conviction (Liz Cheney won the secret vote), but an open ballot gives Trump much better odds of acquittal.

So the question is if the Dem leaders prefer to satisfy their base and remove the threat of a future run by holding a secret ballot vote, or they prefer to divide (& conquer) the GOP by putting it to open ballot and letting the GOP voters fight with each other and leave the door open for Trump to destroy the party with future runs/Patriot party.

[biobook]

Is there a court of law in this country that would admit as evidence a video montage that has been selectively and heavily edited and spliced with footage of speeches and protests?

Why can't unedited footage be shown? Having to edit footage to make it look like a Hollywood production implies that the real facts are not compelling enough for the cause.

This isn't a court of law, is it?
The edited footage makes it easier for the viewer to piece together what was happening in different places at the same time.  Hard for the human brain integrate the bits and pieces of footage and create a clear narrative in their mind of what happened.

[YitzyS]

Will there be a secret ballot? IINM it would take 10 senators to force it not to be secret, which is very likely not to happen.

A secret ballot will likely mean conviction (Liz Cheney won the secret vote), but an open ballot gives Trump much better odds of acquittal.

So the question is if the Dem leaders prefer to satisfy their base and remove the threat of a future run by holding a secret ballot vote, or they prefer to divide (& conquer) the GOP by putting it to open ballot and letting the GOP voters fight with each other and leave the door open for Trump to destroy the party with future runs/Patriot party.

A agree it should be a secret ballot, but I don't know if you are correct that it would lead to conviction.

[YitzyS]

This isn't a court of law, is it?
The edited footage makes it easier for the viewer to piece together what was happening in different places at the same time.  Hard for the human brain integrate the bits and pieces of footage and create a clear narrative in their mind of what happened.

But this trial is about President Trump, and he was not able to see what was taking place as he was talking.

[biobook]

But this trial is about President Trump, and he was not able to see what was taking place as he was talking.

But as soon as he stopped talking, he went home to watch it on TV.

[AsherO]

But as soon as he stopped talking, he went home to watch it on TV.

This is what makes him guilty. What business does he have watching Fox News. Criminal!

[PlatinumGuy]

But this trial is about President Trump, and he was not able to see what was taking place as he was talking.

There is no requirement for there to be premeditation, malicious intent, or even knowledge. He's just as guilty if he incited violence wholly unknowingly.

[biobook]

What made David Schoen change his mind re:pausing for Shabbos?

[PlatinumGuy]

What made David Schoen change his mind re:pausing for Shabbos?

He was hoping the Senate would decline the request and he'd cry wolf, instead the senate called his bluff so he retracted his request.

[zh cohen]

A agree it should be a secret ballot

Why? If impeachment is a political process (and the only justification for it happening is that argument) shouldn't people have to take political responsibility for their votes?

[PlatinumGuy]

shouldn't people have to take political responsibility for their votes?

Not according to the US constitution.

[zh cohen]

Not according to the US constitution.

Link?

[PlatinumGuy]

Link?

Art. I, sec. 5

https://constitutioncenter.org/interactive-constitution/interpretation/article-i/clauses/760

Each House shall keep a Journal of its Proceedings, and from time to time publish the same, excepting such Parts as may in their Judgment require Secrecy; and the Yeas and Nays of the Members of either House on any question shall, at the Desire of one fifth of those Present, be entered on the Journal.

I stand corrected, it would take 20 senators to force it to be public.

[Yehuda57]

He was hoping the Senate would decline the request and he'd cry wolf, instead the senate called his bluff so he retracted his request.

Or, maybe his letter was the truth, and they have someone to cover for him on Shabbos? If he was not being truthful in his retraction, why the need to retract at all and risk people coming up with theories such as yours?

[PlatinumGuy]

why the need to retract at all and risk people coming up with theories such as yours?

That question stands even if he's truthful and he did suddenly find someone to cover for him, and I think the answer is Trump wants it to be over sooner.

[zh cohen]

Or, maybe his letter was the truth, and they have someone to cover for him on Shabbos? If he was not being truthful in his retraction, why the need to retract at all and risk people coming up with theories such as yours?

TDS's Razor - When presented with two possible explanation for events, the one most damaging to Trump is the one you should assume to be true.

[Yehuda57]

That question stands even if he's truthful and he did suddenly find someone to cover for him, and I think the answer is Trump wants it to be over sooner.

So you came up with two reasons that are a stretch at best to avoid the impossibility of Occam's razor?

(E)TA:

[aygart]

A secret ballot will likely mean conviction (Liz Cheney won the secret vote), but an open ballot gives Trump much better odds of acquittal.

Extrapolating from Liz Cheney to a Trump conviction is ridiculous

[PlatinumGuy]

So you came up with two reasons that are a stretch at best to avoid the impossibility of Occam's razor?

You're the one that came up with an implausible explanation to defend the honesty of some kook.

Extrapolating from Liz Cheney to a Trump conviction is ridiculous

OK, will you go on the record as saying he will be acquitted even with a secret ballot?