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What percentage alcohol vodka do the women in your family drink

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Author Topic: Ask a Lubavitcher Anything  (Read 275637 times)

Offline Euclid

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Re: Ask a Lubavitcher Anything
« Reply #460 on: June 14, 2021, 11:49:36 AM »
What other parts of that article are gross overstatements?
Nvm. Dan says the whole thing is trash.

Offline Yehuda57

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Re: Ask a Lubavitcher Anything
« Reply #461 on: June 14, 2021, 11:50:20 AM »
I hadn't read the piece when I saw your question, but I just skimmed through it. There is a substantial amount of stuff that is quite easily refutable or misrepresented. Ironic that the author's blindspots lead him to incorrect conclusions in a piece about where Lubavitchers' "wrongful" beliefs will lead them.

Offline aygart

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Re: Ask a Lubavitcher Anything
« Reply #462 on: June 14, 2021, 11:51:58 AM »
I hadn't read the piece when I saw your question, but I just skimmed through it. There is a substantial amount of stuff that is quite easily refutable or misrepresented. Ironic that the author's blindspots lead him to incorrect conclusions in a piece about where Lubavitchers' "wrongful" beliefs will lead them.

I had a feeling that my question would be a good litmus test of the whole article.
Feelings don't care about your facts

Offline Dan

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Re: Ask a Lubavitcher Anything
« Reply #463 on: June 14, 2021, 11:54:04 AM »
I can't think of a single one, though admittedly I'm no expert on matzeivos. I would also imagine that matzeivos in Eretz Yisroel would be different to ones in the USA, maybe that's what it is talking about? I'd also be interested to see the original Hebrew it is translating, it could be a misunderstanding/mistranslation.
+1
Save your time, I don't answer PM. Post it in the forum and a dedicated DDF'er will get back to you as soon as possible.

Offline AsherO

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Re: Ask a Lubavitcher Anything
« Reply #464 on: June 14, 2021, 12:12:51 PM »
I hadn't read the piece when I saw your question, but I just skimmed through it. There is a substantial amount of stuff that is quite easily refutable or misrepresented. Ironic that the author's blindspots lead him to incorrect conclusions in a piece about where Lubavitchers' "wrongful" beliefs will lead them.

The author clearly admits his bias, and thus discredits himself.
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Offline Yehuda57

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Re: Actual reasons people go OTD
« Reply #465 on: June 14, 2021, 12:25:09 PM »
What other parts of that article are gross overstatements?

Pretty much all of it, down to the amount of Covid deaths in Crown Heights.

Offline Euclid

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Re: Re: Actual reasons people go OTD
« Reply #466 on: June 14, 2021, 12:34:07 PM »
Pretty much all of it, down to the amount of Covid deaths in Crown Heights.
What is the more realistic number?

Offline AsherO

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Re: Re: Actual reasons people go OTD
« Reply #467 on: June 14, 2021, 02:32:46 PM »
why are the tefilin so big? even on little boys

Chabad custom per the Shulchan Aruch Harav (Hilchos tefillin siman 32 seif 63, see footnote 202) written by the first Chabad Rebbe. It's a chumra to an opinion that dates back to the Geonim.
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Offline whYME

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Re: Re: Actual reasons people go OTD
« Reply #468 on: June 14, 2021, 02:58:13 PM »
I'm really tempted to weigh in here but I'm not sure I can without it basically being a personal attack on this author.

Although he deserves it, I'm not sure I want to go there...

(I haven't read this article, but I have seen some of his past )

Offline AsherO

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Re: Re: Actual reasons people go OTD
« Reply #469 on: June 14, 2021, 03:09:34 PM »
I'm really tempted to weigh in here but I'm not sure I can without it basically being a personal attack on this author.

Can't you just weigh in on the facts as presented in the article?
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Offline AsherO

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Re: Re: Actual reasons people go OTD
« Reply #470 on: June 14, 2021, 03:11:35 PM »
For the record, the author's brother ostensibly got the same education, and has a PhD from NYU in sociology. For a moment I confused the two of them and thought it was the brother who wrote this article.
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Offline whYME

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Re: Re: Actual reasons people go OTD
« Reply #471 on: June 14, 2021, 04:05:49 PM »
Can't you just weigh in on the facts as presented in the article?
Maybe if I actually read it. And others here have already weighed in on that anyways so .


And in case it wasn't clear, I was talking about weighing in in terms of this aspect:
I think every. single. person. who ever went of the derech can write the exact same article and choose any one aspect of their life to blame it on.

He chose some random reason that is a hot topic, so more people are reading it. But there's nothing novel or new about a bitter person writing why he chose to live differently than his parents.
the education his parents have that he was deprived of
not everyone's stated reason is their true/only reason. Bullying, neglect, abuse, and family-of-origin issues are oftentimes significant factors

Offline M218

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Re: Re: Actual reasons people go OTD
« Reply #472 on: June 14, 2021, 04:59:15 PM »
I personally have a few friends who went OTD and some even came back. If you ask the most of them and you try to single out a reason you won`t find it. Yes there are some with bitterness, some with challenged families, some have been abused, and some lazy or enjoy it the other way around. But non of my friends ever went public to hurt their parents or place they grew up. My question is what motivates these few who do turn their backs on their friends and family and openly speak lies against them.

(Story edited with OP's approval):

I`m not a Lubavitcher, but I have seen many, many open miracles by the Rebbe`s Ohel. And I do try to keep a lot of things he requested from his followers to do.

I want to share a personal story I had when I was living in Israel.

I used to make a coffee every day at the same store. Over time I became friends with one of the workers, let’s call him Yoni, and he opened up to me about his life.

Yoni is Sephardi, his father is religious and he was raised orthodox, but he left his father’s way and no longer keeps Shabbos etc. So, one day I asked him the same question we are asking in this thread, Why? why hurt your father, your family, leave the ideals that raised you… His answer was: I don’t know, I just left.

He really was a lost soul, not trying to hurt anyone, he made some friends on the streets and was simply enjoying their lifestyle. As we became closer, I asked him if he would mind to put on Tefillin every day when I come to drink my coffee.

He agreed as long as I first got permission from his boss. The boss, a frum guy himself, happily agreed saying “You don`t know how happy you will be making his father, who is a close friend of mine".

We started on a Monday morning, and continued to put on teffilin for just a few moments every day that week. That Friday when I came to do my morning coffee and Tefillin, Yoni told me he wants to do something more for Shabbos, because he will miss putting on teffilin, BUT he does not want to actually keep Shabbos.

I got an idea, I told him he should put his phone down for just 1 hour every Shabbos. And this went on for around 3 weeks until one night I was on the Kosel bus and I saw Yoni at one of the bus stops. I called him onto the bus and told him to join me to the Kosel. He gladly agreed to join me. When we arrived at the Kosel we met a nice Lubavitcher Chassid and after some conversation he offered Yoni to come for Shabbos (I think to Kfar Chabad) if he is willing to keep this one Shabbos, arrive before Shabbos and leave after while observing it and joining with his own family during meals in shul etc. To give him a feel of a beautiful Shabbos which he hadn’t experienced since his childhood.
Since that Shabbos, he has kept everyone.

40 Days later he had kept his 5th Shabbos, he calls me up Motzei Shabbos and tells me that he`s engaged! And invited me to come to the party.
He got engaged to a girl that he was hanging out with and dated over a year before our story.

Her father had forbidden her from dating him though, and they broke up. Her father was affiliated with Lubavitcher Chassidim but wasn’t fully observant himself, he wasn’t shomer Shabbos yet he put on tefillin daily.

When I came to the engagement party, I asked the girl’s father asked why he broke them up a year ago and now he was the one that actually got them back together?

His answer shocked me then and I still can’t wrap my mind around it.

He said, It is not my fault that my father didn’t bring me up religious. But I always told my daughter that I want her to marry someone that identifies himself as Jew. When Yoni and my daughter first met I didn`t care that he wasn’t religious but I did care that he isn't acting Jewish, there was nothing about him that he identified with as being Jewish. One morning I was passing the coffee shop and saw you guys putting on Tefillin. The next day I saw the same thing, so I went to the owner and asked him what is going on here. He told me that you guys put on teffilin every day. I immediately called my daughter and gave her my blessing to call up Yoni and ask him out again.

The rest as they say is history. They are happily married and have a baby girl.

Before I left Israel I put him in contact with a Rav, they are both currently much more religious and still shomer Shabbos.

The saying that as we keep Shabbos, Shabbos keeps us, is so true, and something Yoni will never forget.
« Last Edit: June 18, 2021, 01:23:54 PM by jj1000 »

Offline AsherO

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Re: Re: Actual reasons people go OTD
« Reply #473 on: June 14, 2021, 05:07:27 PM »
I personally have a few friends who went OTD and some even came back. If you ask the most of them and you try to single out a reason you won`t find it. Yes there are some with bitterness, some with challenged families, some have been abused, and some lazy or enjoy it the other way around. But non of my friends ever went public to hurt their parents or place they grew up. My question is what motivates these few who do turn their backs on their friends and family and openly speak lies against them.


I`m not a Lubavitcher, but I have seen many, many open miracles by the Rebbe`s Ohel. I do try to keep a lot of things he requested from his followers to do.

I want to share a personal story I had when I was living in Israel. I used to make a coffee every day at a certain store. I became friends with one of the workers, and he opened up his life to me. He is Sephardi, his father is religious and he didn`t keep Shabbos. I asked him the same question we are asking here why? why hurt your father? your family? his answer was: he doesn't know. he really was a lost sole not trying to hurt anyone, but to enjoy the streets with the friends he made. As we became more close, I asked him if he would mind to put on Tefillin everyday when I come to drink my coffee.
He agreed if I asked his boss, and the (religious) boss happily agreed Quoting "You don`t know how happy you will be making his father, who is a close friend of mine". We started on a Monday morning, Friday when I came to coffee/Tefillin he told me he wants to do something more for Shabbos, instead of Tefillin but not keep it. I got this idea he should put his phone down for an hour every Shabbos. This went on for around 3 weeks one night I was on the Kosel bus and I see him by the bus stop, I called him up and told him to join me to the Kosel. He gladly came, by the Kosel we met a nice Lubavitcher Chassid there and after some conversation he offered him to come for Shabbos (I think to Kfar Chabad) if he is willing to keep this one Shabbos. (Since that Shabbos, he has kept every one.)

40 Days later he had kept his 3rd time Shabbos, he calls me up Motzei Shabbos that he`s engaged. He got engaged to a girl that he dated/hung with over a year before our story. Her father broke them up then for some reason. Her father was some what affiliated with Lubavitcher Chassidim but kept Judaism on a minimum, not "Shomer Shabbos" but everyday Tefillin. I came to the engagement party and asked him why he broke them up a year ago and now he put them back together? His answer was, It is not my fault that my father didn`t bring me up religious. I always told my daughter, I want her to marry someone that identifies himself as Jew. When they first met I didn`t care that he isn`t religious but that he isn't acting Jewish, he had nothing to himself. One morning I was passing the coffee shop and saw you guys putting on Tefillin. The next day I saw the same thing, I went to the owner and he said that you guys do it everyday. I immediately called my daughter to take this guy out again.

As for now they are happily married and have a baby girl. Before I left Israel I made him contact a Rav, they are currently much more religious and they keep Shabbos.     

Lovely story, thanks for sharing.
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Offline gozalim

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Re: Re: Actual reasons people go OTD
« Reply #474 on: June 14, 2021, 05:08:14 PM »
I'm really tempted to weigh in here but I'm not sure I can without it basically being a personal attack on this author.

Although he deserves it, I'm not sure I want to go there...

(I haven't read this article, but I have seen some of his past )
he seems to have been coopted by the YAFFED animals...

Offline M218

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Re: Re: Actual reasons people go OTD
« Reply #475 on: June 14, 2021, 05:17:04 PM »
Lovely story, thanks for sharing.
My moral of this story is and has always been. The world out there has a lot of terrible things (and tons of good BH) and you can`t fix it. But you can do "some" small steps to help "some" of the broken people, instead of blaming the world.

Offline YitzyS

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Re: Re: Actual reasons people go OTD
« Reply #476 on: June 14, 2021, 07:16:49 PM »
I want to share a personal story I had when I was living in Israel.
cc @RabbiPesachKrohn @NachmanSeltzer @YoelGold

Offline Yehuda57

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Re: Re: Actual reasons people go OTD
« Reply #477 on: June 14, 2021, 07:19:22 PM »

Offline MeirS

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Re: Re: Actual reasons people go OTD
« Reply #478 on: June 14, 2021, 10:32:23 PM »
How common is this?
In NY the Chevra Kadishe wouldn't allow such a thing to go up so it's an irrelevant conversation.
In EY, I would say it's not more than 0.5%. (Like if 100 Lubacitchers pass in a year, you might get one like that once in 2 years.)

Just my estimate

Offline neveryou

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Re: Re: Actual reasons people go OTD
« Reply #479 on: June 14, 2021, 10:38:08 PM »
In NY the Chevra Kadishe wouldn't allow such a thing to go up so it's an irrelevant conversation.
In EY, I would say it's not more than 0.5%. (Like if 100 Lubacitchers pass in a year, you might get one like that once in 2 years.)

Just my estimate
At the cemetery by the ohel they allow yechi, MaHa"M but not shlita on the matzeivas if I'm not mistaken