Guilty?

[S209]

Making a decision based on a fraction of the relevant evidence is not an open mind.

The video is literally all of the evidence necessary to rule here. Everything else is merely obfuscation.

Chauvin was actually videotaped committing murder. There are no two sides.

[CountValentine]

Then it's possible some could say that there may have superseding action, creating reasonable doubt that he was guilty of Murder 2?

I see no reasonable doubt that knee to neck wasn't the cause of death.
Anything is possible. Some believe the video shows the knee not directly on the neck. While that is possible it is not reasonable from the video.
Look this decision wasn't even close. It is like saying a SCOTUS 9-0 decision was wrong.

[CountValentine]

I assumed the poll was asking us to judge, not a prediction of what the actual jury would rule.

This is why we have problems. 

What do you think the jury will decide?

[S209]

This is why we have problems. 

I hadn’t read that when I voted

[CountValentine]

I hadn’t read that when I voted

It is the OP.

[S209]

It is the OP.

Which, in most polls, I don’t bother reading.

[zh cohen]

I see no reasonable doubt that knee to neck wasn't the cause of death.

Even the prosecution did not claim that the knee on the neck was the cause of death.

[S209]

Even the prosecution did not claim that the knee on the neck was the cause of death.

Sorry?

[zh cohen]

Sorry?

Hmm...

Maybe you would have learned something if you paid attention to the trial instead of deciding based on the video alone...

[CountValentine]

Even the prosecution did not claim that the knee on the neck was the cause of death.

Ok I am confused. How did he die? Was it a gun shot?
ME ruled it a homicide, correct? So who killed him and how?

[CountValentine]

Maybe you would have learned something if you paid attention to the trial instead of deciding based on the video alone...

Everything you are saying was rejected by the jury. Did you learn that from watching? 

[S209]

Hmm...

Maybe you would have learned something if you paid attention to the trial instead of deciding based on the video alone...

I find it hard to believe I would have learned that the prosecution didn’t claim he died of asphyxiation as the ME ruled and as I saw on tape.

[zh cohen]

Ok I am confused. How did he die?

I don't know. The prosecution claimed that it was the reduction in lung capacity that was caused by
1 - Being prone
2 - Handcuffed
3 - Pressed against the pavement
4 - (I don't remember the fourth factor)

Dr. Tobin testified that he was able to determine based on the video how much each of those factors reduced Floyd's lung capacity.

[S209]

I don't know. The prosecution claimed that it was the reduction in lung capacity that was caused by
1 - Being prone
2 - Handcuffed
3 - Pressed against the pavement
4 - (I don't remember the fourth factor)

Dr. Tobin testified that he was able to determine based on the video how much each of those factors reduced Floyd's lung capacity.

And what about #3 isn’t him dying of knee to the neck?

Can we agree you are obfuscating now?

[CountValentine]

I don't know. The prosecution claimed that it was the reduction in lung capacity that was caused by
1 - Being prone
2 - Handcuffed
3 - Pressed against the pavement
4 - (I don't remember the fourth factor)

Dr. Tobin testified that he was able to determine based on the video how much each of those factors reduced Floyd's lung capacity.

I guess you missed this part: "My opinion remains unchanged," Baker said as his testimony concluded. "It's what I put on the death certificate last June. That's cardiopulmonary arrest complicating law enforcement subdual, restraint and neck compression." "That was my top line then," he added. "It would stay my top line now." Blackwell asked him whether he considered the other contributing conditions as direct causes of Floyd's death, and Baker said, "They are not direct causes of Mr. Floyd's death, that's true. They are contributing causes."

[CountValentine]

Can we agree you are obfuscating now?

Not sure what that big word means but I have a picture of a pretzel in my mind.

[S209]

Not sure what that big word means but I have a picture of a pretzel in my mind.

More a smoke screen, but yes

[CountValentine]

Is your beef he was convicted on the first count? @zh cohen

[Lurker]

I see no reasonable doubt that knee to neck wasn't the cause of death.
Anything is possible. Some believe the video shows the knee not directly on the neck. While that is possible it is not reasonable from the video.
Look this decision wasn't even close. It is like saying a SCOTUS 9-0 decision was wrong.

You don't believe there was reasonable doubt (fair), and others do (also fair). And now we come full circle. There are those who say that the jury's conclusion that there was no reasonable doubt may have been influenced by things other than the facts of the case that were presented to them. Was it unanimous? Yes. Was it like a 9-0 SCOTUS decision? No.

A jury is made up of laymen with a rudimentary understanding of the law, and are very much susceptible to outside influences in their decision making. SCOTUS is made up of proven legal scholars who (are supposed to) understand that their job is to clarify the law and ensure it is applied as intended, regardless of their personal sentiments or the consequences. Our judicial system is imperfect, and one consequence of having a jury of laymen determine guilt is that other laymen feel that their opinions are as valid as those of the jury. Ultimately, this is the system we have and the jury gets to decide, not John Q. Public. That doesn't mean that the jury is right and people who disagree are wrong; it just means that what the people who disagree think doesn't actually matter.

[CountValentine]

You don't believe there was reasonable doubt (fair), and others do (also fair). And now we come full circle. There are those who say that the jury's conclusion that there was no reasonable doubt may have been influenced by things other than the facts of the case that were presented to them. Was it unanimous? Yes. Was it like a 9-0 SCOTUS decision? No.

They can say whatever they want. Provide proof or it is a nothing burger.
I have yet to hear one reasonable explanation on what caused his death if it wasn't the knee.
You are right about the SCOTUS comparison. I will be right right when the court is expanded to 12 as this was a 12-0 decision!!!