Author Topic: LIFE INSURANCE  (Read 139041 times)

Offline skyguy918

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Re: LIFE INSURANCE
« Reply #160 on: April 27, 2021, 04:25:35 PM »
They are not the only ones using such underwriting. There are quite a few (especially outside of NY) that will underwrite without a physical exam, though most will take a two-step (internal) process where there's the automated underwriting which is subject to manual review. That's obviously one way to bring costs down over traditional underwriting. Less manpower and actually more background sniffing.
I literally said 'and others'. My own company has made its own foray into digitial underwriting (for lack of better term), but is too conservative to go all in on it.

Offline yos9694

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Re: LIFE INSURANCE
« Reply #161 on: April 27, 2021, 04:26:18 PM »
At this point I'd be happy to join a spin off thread for experts like exgingi and skyguy918 etc to discuss inside baseball questions so as to keep that out of here.

Also, if anyone wants to try term4sale to get quotes and/or a direct to consumer insurance company but wants to ask newbie questions, I'd be happy to answer whatever I can in this thread, a different spin off thread, or by PM. All I'd ask is consider doing a "TR" afterwards with some anonymized screenshots for the benefit of other newbies.

Offline Kobe Bryant

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Re: LIFE INSURANCE
« Reply #162 on: April 27, 2021, 05:35:51 PM »
this discussion WL vs Term should be moved to correct thread. this thread is a to have or not to have...

the more confusing this thread is, the less likely someone will be inspired to get coverage.
WL Vs Term
Term Vs Whole Life
To have or not to have has been discussed
@mods can you merge with proper thread?

Offline ExGingi

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Re: LIFE INSURANCE
« Reply #163 on: April 28, 2021, 05:49:46 PM »
I recall @ExGingi, there being a advertisement for insurance in the yagdil torah calendar given in CH...

Actually a surprise development today is making a 5782 calendar a possibility. Trying to find options for printing in Western Hemisphere, as I am scared of having to deal with Shipping from China - though in the past even when shipping by air from China was cheaper than producing the same in the US.
I've been waiting over 5 years with bated breath for someone to say that!
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Offline michael

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Re: LIFE INSURANCE
« Reply #164 on: April 28, 2021, 06:05:46 PM »
This might be a crazy question but is your community big enough to be self insured?
A friend is trying to get me involved in forming such a company, but I donít understand the savings. Is there any reason to believe that a policy insuring only/primarily frum people would have lower premiums?

Offline bubkiz

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Re: LIFE INSURANCE
« Reply #165 on: April 28, 2021, 06:11:43 PM »
Another extremely important issue is making sure both spouses pay into Social Security. Aside from the retirement aspect, there is something called Survivor's Benefits - if c"v a parent dies or is disabled Social Security will make monthly payments to the surviving spouse and until the child turns 18.
This is especially important if one of the parents is not insurable.
I recently spoke to someone I know whose Kollel husband is not life insurable or Arevim eligible. They will iyh be making a legal financial change so that he receives a FICA taxable salary so that he pays into SS.

Offline JMHO

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Re: LIFE INSURANCE
« Reply #166 on: April 28, 2021, 08:21:44 PM »
I recently spoke to someone I know whose Kollel husband is not Arevim eligible.
Please don't mix Areivim into a life insurance thread.

Offline yos9694

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Re: LIFE INSURANCE
« Reply #167 on: April 28, 2021, 11:08:15 PM »
A friend is trying to get me involved in forming such a company, but I donít understand the savings. Is there any reason to believe that a policy insuring only/primarily frum people would have lower premiums?

Probably not. As a fraternal benefits society you could have a business purpose to help the frum community and perhaps improve premiums by having lower expenses and a nonprofit mission, but you will suffer from inefficiencies in underwriting, asset management, reinsurance costs, financial reporting, etc. My guess is you'd need to charge above market rates.

Offline AsherO

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Re: LIFE INSURANCE
« Reply #168 on: April 28, 2021, 11:49:39 PM »
Probably not. As a fraternal benefits society you could have a business purpose to help the frum community and perhaps improve premiums by having lower expenses and a nonprofit mission, but you will suffer from inefficiencies in underwriting, asset management, reinsurance costs, financial reporting, etc. My guess is you'd need to charge above market rates.

Itís not a big enough market and enough Frum people either wonít buy any, buy from another carrier, or keep their existing policies from other insurers. Itís a regulated industry so there are fairly extensive barriers to spin up an insurance company, we likely have the power to make it happen in our community, but it would be cost prohibitive.
DDF FFB (Forum From Birth)

Offline ExGingi

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Re: LIFE INSURANCE
« Reply #169 on: April 29, 2021, 12:04:51 AM »
Probably not. As a fraternal benefits society you could have a business purpose to help the frum community and perhaps improve premiums by having lower expenses and a nonprofit mission, but you will suffer from inefficiencies in underwriting, asset management, reinsurance costs, financial reporting, etc. My guess is you'd need to charge above market rates.

Do some of those really have that large of a market? I sometimes see them pop-up on comparison software as very competitive. Thrivent comes to mind.

Years ago (I recall hearing the name in the late 80s) I vaguely recall there was a Jewish/Frum CU in Brooklyn. I believe it collapsed.
I've been waiting over 5 years with bated breath for someone to say that!
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Offline ChapsTheMatzav

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Re: LIFE INSURANCE
« Reply #170 on: April 29, 2021, 12:12:02 AM »
The way you phrase that makes them sound opportunistic. They suffered a loss than no money can replace, if they feel like they need a campaign who are you to judge their feelings or needs?
PPL run the campaigns for them and take a FAT commission. Such as but not limited to https://thechesedfund.com/features
Whether you think you can or you think you cannot, you're right.

Offline ChapsTheMatzav

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Re: LIFE INSURANCE
« Reply #171 on: April 29, 2021, 12:13:05 AM »
I don't disagree, but it's often not the family running these campaigns.
And that "not the family" is takin a FAT commission posting pics of the 14 year old saying kaddish all over the internet.
Whether you think you can or you think you cannot, you're right.

Offline ChapsTheMatzav

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Re: LIFE INSURANCE
« Reply #172 on: April 29, 2021, 12:13:48 AM »
Many times itís their Rabbi/Shul or a close friend, who know their financial stand.
Many times its someone takin a FAT commission posting pics of the 14 year old saying kaddish all over the internet.
Whether you think you can or you think you cannot, you're right.

Offline ChapsTheMatzav

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Re: LIFE INSURANCE
« Reply #173 on: April 29, 2021, 12:14:41 AM »
Please don't mix Areivim into a life insurance thread.
Arevim is not a replacement for life insurance!
Whether you think you can or you think you cannot, you're right.

Offline yos9694

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Re: LIFE INSURANCE
« Reply #174 on: April 29, 2021, 07:52:38 AM »
Do some of those really have that large of a market? I sometimes see them pop-up on comparison software as very competitive. Thrivent comes to mind.

Years ago (I recall hearing the name in the late 80s) I vaguely recall there was a Jewish/Frum CU in Brooklyn. I believe it collapsed.

There's no (explicit) size limit for an FBS, it's defined by a purpose. A good example of a large one is KoC.

Itís not a big enough market and enough Frum people either wonít buy any, buy from another carrier, or keep their existing policies from other insurers. Itís a regulated industry so there are fairly extensive barriers to spin up an insurance company, we likely have the power to make it happen in our community, but it would be cost prohibitive.

The reason I mentioned FBS is because the regulations for them are much more favorable compared to an insurance company.

It really would not be cost prohibitive - but as I mentioned you'll be at a disadvantage to scaled companies. The healthiest people will qualify for low prices from ordinary carriers and you'll be picking up less healthy risks on average.

Most frum people I know would prefer the lowest price possible and value that more than supporting an unzerer company.

Offline ExGingi

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Re: LIFE INSURANCE
« Reply #175 on: April 29, 2021, 08:22:58 AM »
There's no (explicit) size limit for an FBS, it's defined by a purpose. A good example of a large one is KoC.

The reason I mentioned FBS is because the regulations for them are much more favorable compared to an insurance company.

It really would not be cost prohibitive - but as I mentioned you'll be at a disadvantage to scaled companies. The healthiest people will qualify for low prices from ordinary carriers and you'll be picking up less healthy risks on average.

Most frum people I know would prefer the lowest price possible and value that more than supporting an unzerer company.

I meant size in order to have a good risk pool and be able to offer competitive rates.

I've been waiting over 5 years with bated breath for someone to say that!
-- Dan

Offline aygart

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Re: LIFE INSURANCE
« Reply #176 on: April 29, 2021, 08:33:43 AM »
What causes many of these types of initiatives to fail is when it starts becoming a chesed organization for those who are uninsurable and come crying to someone who can't say no to them. This makes these all end up with a poor risk pool. I have seen this for both health and life insurance.
Feelings don't care about your facts

Offline Mordyk

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Re: LIFE INSURANCE
« Reply #177 on: April 29, 2021, 09:13:53 AM »
I don't think there is anyone not getting life insurance because of the $40 a month.  its just not important to them. so lets stop making organizations for this, and lets just bring awareness

Offline Lurker

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Re: LIFE INSURANCE
« Reply #178 on: April 29, 2021, 09:25:07 AM »
I don't think there is anyone not getting life insurance because of the $40 a month.  its just not important to them. so lets stop making organizations for this, and lets just bring awareness

I think you need more than awareness. There needs to be some incentive for people to actually act on it. Something like getting their first year's worth of premiums reimbursed. People sign up for credit cards for less, and it works great for the CC companies.
Failing at maintaining Lurker status.

Offline Mordyk

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Re: LIFE INSURANCE
« Reply #179 on: April 29, 2021, 09:35:21 AM »
I think you need more than awareness. There needs to be some incentive for people to actually act on it. Something like getting their first year's worth of premiums reimbursed. People sign up for credit cards for less, and it works great for the CC companies.
The incentive should be when they see their neighbors face plastered around town and they wouldn't want it for themselves. 

How much did an average person give this year alone to these causes? life insurance costs less than that
#TYH