Author Topic: LIFE INSURANCE (Read 119659 times)

peace123 · « **Reply #400 on:** October 07, 2021, 09:02:18 PM »

Quote from: ExGingi on October 07, 2021, 08:42:32 PM

WL = Whole Life. Provides permanent (lifetime) protection.

my broker told me he applied with principle who declined my application. Banner came up $215 monthly premium, 30 year term $400K coverage . I haven’t yet accepted this offer . Application with protective is pending . I asked him to apply with other companies as well but he told me I shouldn’t do it and wait for protective . What should I do if protective’s premium is also high like banner? Apply on my own online or accept or reject the banner and principle offer?

ExGingi · « **Reply #401 on:** October 07, 2021, 09:15:02 PM »

Quote from: peace123 on October 07, 2021, 09:02:18 PM

my broker told me he applied with principle who declined my application. Banner came up $215 monthly premium, 30 year term $400K coverage . I haven’t yet accepted this offer . Application with protective is pending . I asked him to apply with other companies as well but he told me I shouldn’t do it and wait for protective . What should I do if protective’s premium is also high like banner? Apply on my own online or accept or reject the banner and principle offer?

If you're working with a broker, he is more likely to to better for you than you can do for yourself. You have CAD & HTN, it needs to be shopped to see which carrier will give the best offer.

ckmk47 · « **Reply #402 on:** October 08, 2021, 11:08:23 AM »

Peace123, maybe get a local broker that has a good reputation and see what he can offer.

peace123 · « **Reply #403 on:** October 08, 2021, 11:20:01 AM »

Quote from: ckmk47 on October 08, 2021, 11:08:23 AM

Peace123, maybe get a local broker that has a good reputation and see what he can offer.

i have a local broker through term4sale but he just shopped with three, principle, banner and protective , the first declined very fast without asking for anything. the 2nd quoted me $215 monthly $400k coverage 30 year term, the last is awaiting underwriter decision.

I have asked him to shop around with several companies cos only then i will know and get the satisfaction. but he keeps telling me this something like wait for protective and select protective or banner's price and no use shop around.
below is his reply when i ask him to shop around with several companies. I told him i have no problem disclosing my health info and give me actual quotes from multiple companies not just your wild guess.

is he making sense and helping me you think?

We can apply to every company under the sun, but each application is going to take you time to complete and every carrier can see where you have previously applied and will ask what happened there. You are not stuck at any carriers. However, given that I do this every day and have for decades, I know where you are likely to get the best offer given your situation. It would be wise for us to wait for Protective to reply with an offer before applying elsewhere. That is my advice. If you are anxious to start another process before hearing back from Protective, which should be likely in the next week, I am okay with that. Alas, I am telling you that it is silly to do. One of Protective’s specialties is your exact condition. Banner made the exact offer that I thought they would and confirmed the reason as expected.

I have spoken with numerous other carriers about your situation. So, just because we haven’t formally applied elsewhere doesn’t mean we haven’t been doing anything. Most carriers will call you Standard Non-smoker Table 4. However, Protective will hopefully provide us with a non-rated offer because cases like yours are their specialty. I expect them to give you Standard NS. I have spoken with AIG/Amgen, Minnesota/Securian, Prudential, John Hancock, Symetra, Penn Mutual, Transamerica, Cincinnati, Lincoln, and Nationwide about your situation. All said they would table rate you. (So you have been in-formally reviewed by those carriers.

Banner’s pricing at table 4 is good for a table 4. If you want to formally apply to more carriers let me know which since I feel that your application awaiting approval is the best possible chance for the most competitive price, and the carriers I have already spoken with will not deliver a price better than Banner’s, which you have already told me that you will not accept.

we have to disclose that test you had done and the results otherwise any policy taken will be fraudulent and eventually not pay a death benefit due to fraud. So, what additional companies would you like me to formally apply to, or do you want to wait now noting that I have already done what you wanted to do by already speaking with the underwriters at almost all of the carriers that you are asking to apply to? For fun, I have attached the most competitive carriers at a Standard NS, noting that most on that list already said that they would rate you. Help me help you, What am I missing here?

ExGingi · « **Reply #404 on:** October 08, 2021, 11:36:03 AM »

Quote from: peace123 on October 08, 2021, 11:20:01 AM

i have a local broker through term4sale but he just shopped with three, principle, banner and protective , the first declined very fast without asking for anything. the 2nd quoted me $215 monthly $400k coverage 30 year term, the last is awaiting underwriter decision.

.....

I have spoken with numerous other carriers about your situation. So, just because we haven’t formally applied elsewhere doesn’t mean we haven’t been doing anything. Most carriers will call you Standard Non-smoker Table 4. However, Protective will hopefully provide us with a non-rated offer because cases like yours are their specialty. I expect them to give you Standard NS. I have spoken with AIG/Amgen, Minnesota/Securian, Prudential, John Hancock, Symetra, Penn Mutual, Transamerica, Cincinnati, Lincoln, and Nationwide about your situation. All said they would table rate you. (So you have been in-formally reviewed by those carriers.

The broker obviously did shop your case with multiple carriers. Getting an informal quote on a case that is likely to be rated is the first step in shopping the case around.

I have no idea about your financial situation, but 400k doesn't sound like much coverage in today's day and age.

peace123 · « **Reply #405 on:** October 08, 2021, 11:54:19 AM »

Quote from: ExGingi on October 08, 2021, 11:36:03 AM

The broker obviously did shop your case with multiple carriers. Getting an informal quote on a case that is likely to be rated is the first step in shopping the case around.

I have no idea about your financial situation, but 400k doesn't sound like much coverage in today's day and age.

He didn't shop with other carriers.he didnt show me any proof of speaking with other carriers today. he only told me this now after i asked him why i am stuck with banner and protective and why not shop around ?
also i dont want to pay $600 monthly for a million coverage and hence $400K. my wife has higher coverage

yos9694 · « **Reply #406 on:** October 08, 2021, 12:48:36 PM »

Informals are a real thing. He should have explained that to you more clearly, because he should know that you won't understand the insider lingo. Why bother to formally apply if you got an informal review that says substandard?

Sounds like this guy has a solid approach - if you're going to be table rated then Banner will be the cheapest. But if he can get someone to rate you standard that should probably be cheaper than Banner's NS4. This is exactly how brokers shine- anyone who can cleansheet the app can shop around for themselves, but if a person has some health items that need to be reviewed the broker should know who has a favorable view of the condition.

If he wasn't doing this I would say get a different broker.

ExGingi · « **Reply #407 on:** October 08, 2021, 01:00:30 PM »

Quote from: peace123 on October 08, 2021, 11:54:19 AM

He didn't shop with other carriers.he didnt show me any proof of speaking with other carriers today. he only told me this now after i asked him why i am stuck with banner and protective and why not shop around ?
also i dont want to pay $600 monthly for a million coverage and hence $400K. my wife has higher coverage

I have no idea what your financial situation is. But remember that the premium isn't the problem, it's part of the solution to a problem you need solved.

ushdadude · « **Reply #408 on:** October 08, 2021, 02:15:29 PM »

I've heard that if you have a preexisting condition, you should have a broker ask around anonymously because if you are ever decline by a company directly, you have to disclose that all future applications.

yos9694 · « **Reply #409 on:** October 08, 2021, 02:27:25 PM »

Quote from: ushdadude on October 08, 2021, 02:15:29 PM

I've heard that if you have a preexisting condition, you should have a broker ask around anonymously because if you are ever decline by a company directly, you have to disclose that all future applications.

Yes, please do disclose on all future applications... what's even the question here?

ExGingi · « **Reply #410 on:** October 08, 2021, 02:45:22 PM »

Quote from: yos9694 on October 08, 2021, 02:27:25 PM

Yes, please do disclose on all future applications... what's even the question here?

I think by anonymously he is referring to an INFORMAL application. When doing that there is no positive answer to rated or declined on a subsequent FORMAL application.

ushdadude · « **Reply #411 on:** October 08, 2021, 03:04:57 PM »

Quote from: ExGingi on October 08, 2021, 02:45:22 PM

I think by anonymously he is referring to an INFORMAL application. When doing that there is no positive answer to rated or declined on a subsequent FORMAL application.

This

yos9694 · « **Reply #412 on:** October 08, 2021, 03:57:38 PM »

Got it.... I misread it and thought he was implying you could hide the condition on a future app. Reread it and understand he meant so that you don't have to disclose a prior underwriting decision of decline or rated, which is totally legit.

ExGingi · « **Reply #413 on:** October 08, 2021, 04:15:57 PM »

Quote from: yos9694 on October 07, 2021, 07:36:20 PM

Yeah WL only makes sense now for the tax sheltering and fixed income investment components. Way too much of the premium is just to fund cash value growth so you'd really be overpaying if you're focused on protection.

The BIGGEST change coming is in Paid-Up-Additions (which I have often referred to as one of the best things since sliced bread). Buying policies now that will enable current version PUA payments can make sense in many situations.

peace123 · « **Reply #414 on:** October 08, 2021, 09:51:03 PM »

I let go of the current broker and got a new broker. My health is good and thats what my doctor and have said and that's what my test results showed. I only went to see a cardiologist last year only becos I had a very minor chest discomfort and I have excellent health coverage at that hospital network. The cardiologist, who is one of the top rated at very big hospital network told me he can order and do a complete heart citi scan and complete heart ultrasound check. Told me the only thing the ct scan found is a mild blockage of about 50% and told me there is nothing to do here except , diet, excercise and the cholesterol lowering medicine to help with the mild plaque. I don't have high cholesterol and even the most recent lab Protective life ordered showed everything within range and normal. I have 130 blood pressure and my cardiologist told me taking blood pressure medicine will always help. My doctor told me everybody every person has some blockage and such mild blockage is not cause of concern and the minor chest discomfort I only once had should not be a chest pain and should be muscle pain. Only if it is 70% or more then they intervene and that time, I may start to feel chest pain. Mine is only about 50% plaque and nothing else.

The broker I fired told me Principle declined right away after easily approving my spouse cos she takes zero medication. I think he said principle is doing this cos of covid season. Banner didn't require lab but i still gave them the lab result from protective and later came up with the $215 premium 30 year $400k and protective is pending. I am shopping around with other carriers cos even my cardiologist don't understand why this 50% mild blockage is such an issue and told me with the plaque removing medicine I take with good food and excercise, my chance of heart attack in next 10 years is 10%.

Regarding my labs that I have been doing every 3 months not cos i have some pain or something but just cos they are free and i like to take full charge of my health and like to stay in the know,
Here is how good my lab is

Always excellent lab results. my 3 labs test shows recently , been taking every 3 months are the following
Cholesterol 93, LDL 43, HDL 36, LDL/HDL RATIO 1.22, Cholesterol/HDL Ratio 2.6, TRIGLYCERIDES 66. NO DIABETES AND NOTHING ELSE.

ExGingi · « **Reply #415 on:** October 09, 2021, 11:51:37 PM »

Quote from: peace123 on October 08, 2021, 09:51:03 PM

I am shopping around with other carriers cos even my cardiologist don't understand why this 50% mild blockage is such an issue and told me with the plaque removing medicine I take with good food and excercise, my chance of heart attack in next 10 years is 10%.

Your Cardiologist might be an excellent doctor, but is not an underwriter or an actuary.

Based on the statement "chance of heart attack in the next 10 years is 10%", how much in premium would YOU or YOUR CARDIOLOGIST charge in order to GUARANTEE a $400,000 payout? (What are the chances of heart attack in 12, 15, 20, 25 and 30 years). You also mention what diet, exercise and medication COULD DO, but do you have a history of following through on those?

Fish Tank · « **Reply #416 on:** October 10, 2021, 01:17:54 PM »

Hi,
I don't see a wiki on this thread.

Can I take out a term life insurance policy from several carriers simultaneously ? Has anyone done that? Can someone post the pros and cons?

I currently don't have a policy. I'm a beginner. My thought process is this:

The big names charge for example $350/month. I always see ads for carriers' that charge $100/month etc. So why not a get a few cheaper policies instead of one big one?
If you only have one, they may not pay out for whatever reason. Additionally they may "rate" someone differently (better) than the big names. etc.

Am I way off here?

ExGingi · « **Reply #417 on:** October 10, 2021, 01:31:01 PM »

Quote from: Fish Tank on October 10, 2021, 01:17:54 PM

Am I way off here?

Yes. You are way off.

Der Deutsche Jude · « **Reply #418 on:** October 10, 2021, 01:31:18 PM »

Quote from: Fish Tank on October 10, 2021, 01:17:54 PM

Hi,
I don't see a wiki on this thread.

Can I take out a term life insurance policy from several carriers simultaneously ? Has anyone done that? Can someone post the pros and cons?

I currently don't have a policy. I'm a beginner. My thought process is this:

The big names charge for example $350/month. I always see ads for carriers' that charge $100/month etc. So why not a get a few cheaper policies instead of one big one?
If you only have one, they may not pay out for whatever reason. Additionally they may "rate" someone differently (better) than the big names. etc.

Am I way off here?

You can certainly take out multiple policies. I'm not sure what you mean about big names' prices and small names' prices. Are the small companies charging less for an identical policy? Then why not just get one policy from the small company? Need more coverage? Just get a higher coverage from the cheaper policy.

Often when people have multiple policies, it is because they got one policy and some years later want to increase coverage, so they take out another policy and keep the old one as well because the premiums are likely cheaper. Or someone might want to take out multiple policies from the start because they are worried about being over-insured, so they can just lapse on one policy later. But if you know how much you want to be covered for, it will be cheaper to get one larger policy due to economies of scale.

peace123 · « **Reply #419 on:** October 10, 2021, 02:03:15 PM »

Quote from: ExGingi on October 09, 2021, 11:51:37 PM

Your Cardiologist might be an excellent doctor, but is not an underwriter or an actuary.

Based on the statement "chance of heart attack in the next 10 years is 10%", how much in premium would YOU or YOUR CARDIOLOGIST charge in order to GUARANTEE a $400,000 payout? (What are the chances of heart attack in 12, 15, 20, 25 and 30 years). You also mention what diet, exercise and medication COULD DO, but do you have a history of following through on those?

My point of the detail mentioned above is: the broker I fired did have everything about my medical history and Protective got everything they wanted from my doctor and including the most recent lab results they they did on me. I explained everything in the online application. I don't have lots of medical history visits. I even got him a letter from my cardiologist that says I am taking medicine for the blood pressure medicine and the other medicine to help with the mild plaque (CAD) and that NO intervention is required. Even a simple google search will show that there is no clinical treatment required unless you have a heart blockage of at least70% or more with lots of symptoms.
Yet my broker acts as if he still doesn't know my medical history and told me protective asks me if I did cardiac catheterization test, why I didn't do it and if I wanted to do it blah blah. I told him , I can't go around demanding doctors to do me this or that tests , I am not a doctor and my doctor never required any further tests after the angiogram, heart ct scan, heart ultra sound and he found nothing wrong with my heart except for that mild blockage. He should have told Protective that.

He got me stuck between banner's high premium offer and protective's pending underwriting and as if there are no other companies except for these two.
He simply wasn't on my side, I mean present everything from my side.