What’s worse China pay to play or us procrastination

[Ver hut gazugt]

China has been highly criticized for using vaccines to gain politically on a global scale.
Is that worse then the usa sitting on millions of vaccines letting people die on a daily basis around the world. Even with Biden’s new pledge they won’t give the vaccines till late August. As we speak millions of vaccines are sitting in warehouses and rotting.

Another way to look at it. For every day we don’t give away these vaccines we are killing literally thousands of people.

[ckmk47]

Another way to look at it. For every day we don’t give away these vaccines we are killing literally thousands of people.

NO!  We're not!


We're not helping save these people, but we're NOT killing them!!

[AsherO]

NO!  We're not!


We're not helping save these people, but we're NOT killing them!!

I hope you're being sarcastic.

China has been highly criticized for using vaccines to gain politically on a global scale.
Is that worse then the usa sitting on millions of vaccines letting people die on a daily basis around the world. Even with Biden’s new pledge they won’t give the vaccines till late August. As we speak millions of vaccines are sitting in warehouses and rotting.

Another way to look at it. For every day we don’t give away these vaccines we are killing literally thousands of people.

I've been wondering the same thing for a while now. Ironically this is the Ds acting contrary to their stated values.

IDK if you could compare the superior US vaccines to the subpar Chinese vaccines, it's like comparing apples and cr@pples.

[ckmk47]

I hope you're being sarcastic.

I'm not.

[yuneeq]

As we speak millions of vaccines are sitting in warehouses and rotting.

Source? We may have millions of doses lying around but from what I understand the vaccines are already mostly distributed to tens of thousand locations and practically impossible to gather and redistribute. There isn't some huge stockpile sitting in a warehouse ready to be shipped overseas.

[Ver hut gazugt]

NO!  We're not!


We're not helping save these people, but we're NOT killing them!!

If a person and his friend were lost in the desert one had double the water he needed to stay alive and one had no water left. However, the friend with ample water does not want to give any away and his friend does not make it.
What would you say in such a case ?

[Ver hut gazugt]

Source? We may have millions of doses lying around but from what I understand the vaccines are already mostly distributed to tens of thousand locations and practically impossible to gather and redistribute. There isn't some huge stockpile sitting in a warehouse ready to be shipped overseas.

I can look for a source but logic dictates that we do. We were vaccinating over 3 million people a day.
now we do about 1m. Plus the manufacturers are getting better not worse at making them.
So where is all the extra supply?

[AsherO]

I can look for a source but logic dictates that we do. We were vaccinating over 3 million people a day.
now we do about 1m. Plus the manufacturers are getting better not worse at making them.
So where is all the extra supply?

Manufacturing has nothing to do with how much is going to the US government for distribution.

[TzviR]

If a person and his friend were lost in the desert one had double the water he needed to stay alive and one had no water left. However, the friend with ample water does not want to give any away and his friend does not make it.
What would you say in such a case ?

I’m not saying what’s  right, but there is a difference between שב ועל תעשה and actively doing a מעשה בידים

[yuneeq]

I can look for a source but logic dictates that we do. We were vaccinating over 3 million people a day.
now we do about 1m. Plus the manufacturers are getting better not worse at making them.
So where is all the extra supply?

Please provide a source for your logic that there is a warehouse filled with millions of vaccines. According to this article, the US sent out 25 million doses beginning of June and will be sending out 65m more before the end of month. This is in addition to the Astra Zeneca allotment that will be diverted overseas. Also as I mentioned previously, there are literally tens of thousands of vaccination locations around the US, if they only used up 80% of the supply then there would be tens of millions of doses available. It's not simple to get them back into the federal stockpile.

Furthermore, who said we are getting new delivery of vaccines right now?

Manufacturing has nothing to do with how much is going to the US government for distribution.

[Ver hut gazugt]

I’m not saying what’s  right, but there is a difference between שב ועל תעשה and actively doing a מעשה בידים

Totally agree but still does not make it right.

[Ver hut gazugt]

Please provide a source for your logic that there is a warehouse filled with millions of vaccines. According to this article, the US sent out 25 million doses beginning of June and will be sending out 65m more before the end of month. This is in addition to the Astra Zeneca allotment that will be diverted overseas. Also as I mentioned previously, there are literally tens of thousands of vaccination locations around the US, if they only used up 80% of the supply then there would be tens of millions of doses available. It's not simple to get them back into the federal stockpile.

Furthermore, who said we are getting new delivery of vaccines right now?

Not saying it easy but no reason why it should not be done.

https://covid.cdc.gov/covid-data-tracker/#vaccinations

Just from distributed we have 65m extra. That does not count all those that have not been distributed yet.

[ckmk47]

If a person and his friend were lost in the desert one had double the water he needed to stay alive and one had no water left. However, the friend with ample water does not want to give any away and his friend does not make it.
What would you say in such a case ?

At any moment they don't know  how long they'll need to wait to be saved - they don't know how much water each person needs.


Are you obligated to reach into a pool to pull out a drowning child?  would you do it even if you're not obligated?
How about if it's a heavy adult in the deep end?  how about if you're a small woman?
How about if you see someone drowning in a lake? an ocean?  What if you're not that good/ strong a swimmer?


We have excess vaccines.  We are a richer country than most.  We have the capacity to help others at a cost to us.  Is the cost too much?  Are we obligated? or do we do this because we want to?


We're  not killing others by not helping. Sometimes  it's the right and noble thing to help others even when it's a risk to ourselves. Sometime the risk is so small, we'd be wrong not to help.  But we are not doing any killing.

[avromie7]

Not saying it easy but no reason why it should not be done.

https://covid.cdc.gov/covid-data-tracker/#vaccinations

Just from distributed we have 65m extra. That does not count all those that have not been distributed yet.

How many of those 64m doses were discarded because part of the vial was left over at the end of the day? Just because they were distributed and not administered doesn't mean they're just sitting around.

[yuneeq]

Not saying it easy but no reason why it should not be done.

https://covid.cdc.gov/covid-data-tracker/#vaccinations

Just from distributed we have 65m extra. That does not count all those that have not been distributed yet.

You just continue to complain without responding to anything I said. For that reason I'm out.

[Ver hut gazugt]

How many of those 64m doses were discarded because part of the vial was left over at the end of the day? Just because they were distributed and not administered doesn't mean they're just sitting around.

Good point. I don’t think it would be too many. Maderna has 10 per vial plus many places have a special syringe and it may not even be counted in these numbers.


Here is an article that suggest an extra 100m doses besides for what has been delivered.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.brookings.edu/blog/future-development/2021/05/04/how-big-of-a-vaccine-surplus-will-the-us-have/amp/

[AsherO]

Good point. I don’t think it would be too many. Maderna has 10 per vial plus many places have a special syringe and it may not even be counted in these numbers.


Here is an article that suggest an extra 100m doses besides for what has been delivered.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.brookings.edu/blog/future-development/2021/05/04/how-big-of-a-vaccine-surplus-will-the-us-have/amp/

If/when Novovax gets FDA EUA-approval there will be another hundred million doses available, OWS prepaid $1.6 billion for them (that includes R&D funding).