Author Topic: Ron DeSantis Master Thread  (Read 35783 times)

Offline dm123

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Re: Ron DeSantis Master Thread
« Reply #720 on: September 22, 2022, 05:43:34 PM »
I was referring to state and federal income taxes, social security, and medicaid. Are they getting on payroll and filing tax returns?
Billions, and even tens of billions does not sound like a high number.

I don't know how they pay in, Think some have a ITIN that they pay through.
Here's a link to a page that looks like it discusses some of it.
https://bipartisanpolicy.org/blog/how-do-undocumented-immigrants-pay-federal-taxes-an-explainer/

As I mentioned they do pay Billions into Social security and income tax. No idea what percent of the total that is and think the figures are from years ago.

Quote
Illegal immigrants are estimated to pay in about $7 billion per year into Social Security.

Quote
$1.1 billion in income taxes

Offline CountValentine

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Re: Ron DeSantis Master Thread
« Reply #721 on: September 22, 2022, 05:43:51 PM »
Are they getting on payroll and filing tax returns?
Yes
Billions, and even tens of billions does not sound like a high number.
For people who claim they pay no taxes it blows the argument out of the water.
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Offline biobook

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Re: Ron DeSantis Master Thread
« Reply #722 on: September 22, 2022, 05:51:45 PM »
It's nice to be nostalgic, but try to remember how many received any benefits. Also, try to remember how many were sent to their eventual death while trying to escape the Holocaust.
Nostalgic?  Not at all.

The similarities in the journey - Getting from home to the port of departure hundreds of miles away (by train for some, but more usually some combination of walking and sitting in a horse-drawn cart), teens leaving on their own (to avoid conscription) knowing they may never see family again, escaping from violence (pogroms), traveling in groups for safety (though even so, not all made it through alive), carrying one bag with all one's possessions and food the trip (though some lost it to robbers and scammers), sleeping on the ground, the risky border crossing (dangerous for men who lacked documentation of army service, and required swimming across rivers, seeking desolate, unguarded regions, hiding beneath merchandise in a cart), spending weeks or even months to reach your destination, and then finally the steerage class ship travel.

Once they reached NY, most went quickly through Immigration, though about 2% were turned back for things like tuberculosis or eye infections or senility (suspected in anyone over 60).

True, they received no benefits from the government, but then, neither did native-born Americans.  There was no safety net for the unemployed, elderly, disabled.  Social Security began in the 1930s, Medicaid and Medicare in the 1960s.

Offline yuneeq

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Re: Ron DeSantis Master Thread
« Reply #723 on: September 22, 2022, 05:56:11 PM »
YesFor people who claim they pay no taxes it blows the argument out of the water.

Definitely eye opening to see that they are filing/paying taxes at a much higher rate than I thought, as per the link from @dm123

"The best evidence suggests that at least 50 percent of undocumented immigrant households currently file income tax returns...several studies have found, undocumented immigrants would earn much more, and therefore pay much more in taxes, if they had some sort of legal status, be it permanent or temporary. Not surprisingly, permanent status yields more tax revenue than temporary status."

Based on this I still stand with what I said earlier - if we're not deporting, we may as well legalize them to increase tax revenue. And keep the borders open mainly to those that serve our best interests.
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Offline yelped

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Re: Ron DeSantis Master Thread
« Reply #724 on: September 22, 2022, 06:02:51 PM »
https://georgewbush-whitehouse.archives.gov/stateoftheunion/2007/initiatives/immigration.html

This is a little too right and too left for today's day and age.

Offline zh cohen

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Re: Ron DeSantis Master Thread
« Reply #725 on: September 22, 2022, 07:20:57 PM »
How is that?

Some use fake (or stolen) SS numbers

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Re: Ron DeSantis Master Thread
« Reply #726 on: September 22, 2022, 07:36:56 PM »
Some use fake (or stolen) SS numbers
...and you think they are filing taxes with fake SS numbers?
You're so far up Trump's a** you can see Giuliani's feet.  HT Baruch

Offline CountValentine

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Offline zh cohen

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Re: Ron DeSantis Master Thread
« Reply #728 on: September 22, 2022, 09:38:27 PM »
...and you think they are filing taxes with fake SS numbers?

Not filing, but having payroll taxes withheld.

Offline CountValentine

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Re: Ron DeSantis Master Thread
« Reply #729 on: September 22, 2022, 09:42:51 PM »
Not filing, but having payroll taxes withheld.
They will probably end up paying more then.
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Offline yuneeq

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Re: Ron DeSantis Master Thread
« Reply #730 on: September 22, 2022, 11:33:27 PM »
...and you think they are filing taxes with fake SS numbers?

Yes. How else are they filing taxes?

Not filing, but having payroll taxes withheld.

According to the link above, they are filing as well.
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Offline aygart

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Re: Ron DeSantis Master Thread
« Reply #731 on: September 22, 2022, 11:39:15 PM »
I remember seeing a source that they file and that it is a net negative after you include tax refunds, EIC, and CTC, etc. But I don't remember where and it may be a biased article.
Feelings don't care about your facts

Offline CountValentine

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Re: Ron DeSantis Master Thread
« Reply #732 on: September 22, 2022, 11:42:34 PM »
Yes. How else are they filing taxes?
They don't file if they have a fake SS#.
You're so far up Trump's a** you can see Giuliani's feet.  HT Baruch

Offline jj1000

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Re: Ron DeSantis Master Thread
« Reply #733 on: September 22, 2022, 11:42:39 PM »
Yes. How else are they filing taxes?
You are missing it, you don't need a SS # to pay taxes.

"The IRS will not allow a tax return to be filed with a fake or stolen Social Security number. Therefore, unauthorized workers who wish to file their taxes–and potentially get future credit for it— must find another way. Thus, many use the Individual Taxpayer Identification Number, or ITIN, which allows immigrants without Social Security numbers to legally file tax returns and claim the income reported on their W-2’s to the IRS."
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Offline jj1000

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Re: Ron DeSantis Master Thread
« Reply #734 on: September 22, 2022, 11:44:04 PM »
I remember seeing a source that they file and that it is a net negative after you include tax refunds, EIC, and CTC, etc. But I don't remember where and it may be a biased article.
Or it may be a percentage that do that while others don't. If one guy did that, the right will make an article on it.
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Re: Ron DeSantis Master Thread
« Reply #735 on: September 22, 2022, 11:49:25 PM »
Or it may be a percentage that do that while others don't. If one guy did that, the right will make an article on it.
Are you an "I"?
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Offline yuneeq

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Re: Ron DeSantis Master Thread
« Reply #736 on: September 22, 2022, 11:52:06 PM »
I remember seeing a source that they file and that it is a net negative after you include tax refunds, EIC, and CTC, etc. But I don't remember where and it may be a biased article.

I am very skeptical that they are even close to a net positive even if they all paid taxes. They aren't usually in high-paying jobs, they have a lot of kids and receive many benefits - free schooling, extra school programs for kids that don't speak English natively, free hospital visits, and more. Illegals also pass on a lot of costs on society that can't be easily measured. Example - they are much more likely to be uninsured or underinsured, leaving the extensive costs of accidents on victims of crashes where they are at fault.

You are missing it, you don't need a SS # to pay taxes.

"The IRS will not allow a tax return to be filed with a fake or stolen Social Security number. Therefore, unauthorized workers who wish to file their taxes–and potentially get future credit for it— must find another way. Thus, many use the Individual Taxpayer Identification Number, or ITIN, which allows immigrants without Social Security numbers to legally file tax returns and claim the income reported on their W-2’s to the IRS."

Thanks for clarifying. Why would anyone illegal file taxes unless they are coming out ahead?
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Offline jj1000

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Re: Ron DeSantis Master Thread
« Reply #737 on: September 22, 2022, 11:54:07 PM »
Are you an "I"?
If I stands for Independent Thinker, then I'll bite ;)

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Re: Ron DeSantis Master Thread
« Reply #738 on: September 22, 2022, 11:55:30 PM »
Thanks for clarifying. Why would anyone illegal file taxes unless they are coming out ahead?
This may be hard to believe, but many love this country and are very happy to be here. And therefore want to pay their share.

Also it may help them with ICE deportation as well as getting citizenship in the future if I had to start making up guesses.
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Re: Ron DeSantis Master Thread
« Reply #739 on: September 23, 2022, 12:07:53 AM »
Thanks for clarifying. Why would anyone illegal file taxes unless they are coming out ahead?
Many are undocumented and want to become citizens.
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