Afghanistan Falls To The Taliban After US Withdrawal

[ExGingi]

Forgot the

I omitted that on purpose learned from the רבש"ע who created the world לעשות... had to leave something for you to add.

[Dan]

The airport remains open with flights leaving every hour. They estimate 5-10k people leaving each day. How many are we responsible for?

"However, as of Tuesday afternoon many thousands of Afghans who had been employed by Western embassies and nongovernment organizations in Kabul remained stranded and unable to reach Hamid Karzai International Airport for evacuation flights as the Taliban erected checkpoints at airport entrances, whipping and beating Afghans who attempted to cross."

https://www.wsj.com/articles/taliban-consolidate-control-in-afghanistans-capital-thousands-remain-stranded-11629195393

[skyguy918]

"However, as of Tuesday afternoon many thousands of Afghans who had been employed by Western embassies and nongovernment organizations in Kabul remained stranded and unable to reach Hamid Karzai International Airport for evacuation flights as the Taliban erected checkpoints at airport entrances, whipping and beating Afghans who attempted to cross."

https://www.wsj.com/articles/taliban-consolidate-control-in-afghanistans-capital-thousands-remain-stranded-11629195393

How would Bagram have fixed that issue though?

[Dan]

How would Bagram have fixed that issue though?

Everyone should have been evacuated before the withdrawal. It's not rocket science.
What happens in Gaza if the troops pull out and leave the settlers behind?

[skyguy918]

Everyone should have been evacuated before the withdrawal.

Who exactly is everyone? Anyone who wants to leave? Anyone with a visa? Anyone eligible for a visa? We have no hard numbers on these things yet - just reports of individuals of various statuses who can't get out.

[jj1000]

Who exactly is everyone? Anyone who wants to leave? Anyone with a visa? Anyone eligible for a visa? We have no hard numbers on these things yet - just reports of individuals of various statuses who can't get out.

We have no hard number as this time, so let them die.

Great policy, you should work for the Government!

Imagine the Surfside rescue operation said, we have no hard numbers at this time, so we won't bother looking for people...

[Dan]

Who exactly is everyone? Anyone who wants to leave? Anyone with a visa? Anyone eligible for a visa? We have no hard numbers on these things yet - just reports of individuals of various statuses who can't get out.

Anyone eligible for a visa should have been given a deadline to apply and been evacuated in an orderly fashion before pulling out the rug. This isn't rocket science.

[skyguy918]

We have no hard number as this time, so let them die.

Great policy, you should work for the Government!

Imagine the Surfside rescue operation said, we have no hard numbers at this time, so we won't bother looking for people...

What? How do you get any of that from what I said? I'm saying that it's hard to level specific criticisms about this point without knowing the numbers. Yes we see the scenes at the airport, and reports of people being killed by the Taliban for being traitors, but how many of these would we actually have taken in realistically?

Anyone eligible for a visa should have been given a deadline to apply and been evacuated in an orderly fashion before pulling out the rug. This isn't rocket science.

The SIV program is notoriously slow, likely intentionally so. Average wait time through the process is 3 years.

[CountValentine]

We have no hard number as this time, so let them die.

Great policy, you should work for the Government!

Imagine the Surfside rescue operation said, we have no hard numbers at this time, so we won't bother looking for people...

What number do you have in mind. If we evacuate 10k did we do our job? How about 20, 30, 50k?

[avromie7]

What? How do you get any of that from what I said? I'm saying that it's hard to level specific criticisms about this point without knowing the numbers. Yes we see the scenes at the airport, and reports of people being killed by the Taliban for being traitors, but how many of these would we actually have taken in realistically?
The SIV program is notoriously slow, likely intentionally so. Average wait time through the process is 3 years.

I don't know anything about it, but this is not an excuse to let them die.

What number do you have in mind. If we evacuate 10k did we do our job? How about 20, 30, 50k?

Every single person we have a responsibility to protect. I don't care if it's 5 of 500,000.

[CountValentine]

Every single person we have a responsibility to protect. I don't care if it's 5 of 500,000.

So now you care about these people?
I don't know how much more I can take of this. 

[Dan]

The SIV program is notoriously slow, likely intentionally so. Average wait time through the process is 3 years.

So let them die? C'mon man!
You put the resources needed into expediting applications from Afghanistan and/or find a temporary solution like a refugee camp somewhere outside of Afghanistan.

[CountValentine]

Who said let them die? All that was asked is how many we are talking about. So far there has been no answer, estimate or even a guess. Lets just pick a number and say 20k. We should have a figure on how many were evacuated after this is over. Then can judge on the job they did.

[yesitsme]

Who said let them die? All that was asked is how many we are talking about. So far there has been no answer, estimate or even a guess. Lets just pick a number and say 20k. We should have a figure on how many were evacuated after this is over. Then can judge on the job they did.

There is no answer because there is no process, just like the Mexican border

[jj1000]

What number do you have in mind. If we evacuate 10k did we do our job? How about 20, 30, 50k?

Asking for a number just aplifies how you've been comparing apples and oranges this entire thread.

The conversation was about how this went down, and all you want to talk about it how it'll be in the future. No connection.

Now you want to know how many people we have to save. When I am saying we needed to have a process to make sure people who need to be saved are. That has no connection to numbers but rather again, the process of how this was done.

[AsherO]

The airport remains open with flights leaving every hour. They estimate 5-10k people leaving each day. How many are we responsible for?

Where are they flying to and how many of them have their hopes on the US as their final destination?

[efflpetzel]

I don't know anything about it, but this is not an excuse to let them die.
 Every single person we have a responsibility to protect. I don't care if it's 5 of 500,000.

Oh so lets take in hundreds of thousands of Afgans because they translated something for our troops, we're doing such a great job at the Mexican border, what's another 100,000 Afgans refugees

My opinion will be unpopular but I wouldn't take in any of them. Not one.

No one forced them to work for the Americans, they were good paying jobs & they knew the risks they were getting into.

If they were so frightening of a Taliban takeover then they should've fought harder against them.

[Dan]

No one forced them to work for the Americans, they were good paying jobs & they knew the risks they were getting into.

No, they were told the US would protect them.

[CountValentine]

Asking for a number just aplifies how you've been comparing apples and oranges this entire thread.

The conversation was about how this went down, and all you want to talk about it how it'll be in the future. No connection.

Now you want to know how many people we have to save. When I am saying we needed to have a process to make sure people who need to be saved are. That has no connection to numbers but rather again, the process of how this was done.

You need something as a yardstick. The whole country needs to be saved. We already failed at that by pulling out.

You want this magical process that doesn't exist. We all agree the way it was done is a failure. The point I and others have been making is it doesn't matter as the end result will be the same.

ETA - Here are the WH numbers: It's unclear how many individuals can be evacuated in just two weeks. More than 11,000 American citizens are in Afghanistan, according to White House Press Secretary Jen Psaki. And at least 30,000 Afghan nationals who aided the U.S. effort over the last two decades are desperate to flee the country.

[Yehuda57]

Oh so lets take in hundreds of thousands of Afgans because they translated something for our troops, we're doing such a great job at the Mexican border, what's another 100,000 Afgans refugees

My opinion will be unpopular but I wouldn't take in any of them. Not one.

No one forced them to work for the Americans, they were good paying jobs & they knew the risks they were getting into.

If they were so frightening of a Taliban takeover then they should've fought harder against them.

Next time you're sipping on a late prepared by an immigrant for less than minimum wage, think of the Afghan who got his US dog tags branded into his chest as his 10 year old daughter was raped before he was executed.