Parental support

[yr]

That’s beautiful. We lived in a one basement apartment if you could call it that. Support consisted of my mother in law buying household supplies on my wife’s credit card. We were lucky the chasunah was paid for. 15 year old clunker was our only car. We didn’t fly on a plane ever- couldn’t afford even a cheap flight. Learned in kollel far, far longer than my friends who were supported. Times have changed and you will lose a lot of the newlyweds to the workforce if you hold them up to your standard.

So let them go work. Why should the parents work second jobs and /or delay retirement?  And don't tell me they want to. Having the feeling that your daughter won't get marred if you dont offer support is akin to being forced.

[jye]

Only if done of your own free will.

You are free to choose an orthodox branch that doesn’t prioritize the above. If you decide to join the MO community you will not have to support prospective shidduchim in kollel. In that sense yes, you are free. I’m not free to join viznitz but expect my wife to be allowed to drive.

[yr]

Sounds like just continuing to pay tuition. And if it's only girls then 50% better than tuition

So when the parents thought they can finally settle and start putting away for retirement....

I'm actually very curious how the typical middle class couple will fare in retirement,  when they are easily marrying kids off until their 60s.

[ushdadude]

So when the parents thought they can finally settle and start putting away for retirement....

I'm actually very curious how the typical middle class couple will fare in retirement,  when they are easily marrying kids off until their 60s.

Retirement savings have to start well before that.

[jye]

So let them go work. Why should the parents work second jobs and /or delay retirement?  And don't tell me they want to. Having the feeling that your daughter won't get marred if you dont offer support is akin to being forced.

The community as a whole and appear to feel that the benefit of the years in kollel outweighs the above but one who doesn’t buy into it is free to join a different orthodox system.

[aygart]

Times have changed and you will lose a lot of the newlyweds to the workforce if you hold them up to your standard.

Times have not changed. If they are not prepared for such a standard they will be in the workforce pretty quickly either way.

[jye]

Times have not changed. If they are not prepared for such a standard they will be in the workforce pretty quickly either way.

If the goal is to learn the first 3-5 years while being supported to lay the foundation for the marriage the above is not an issue.

[yr]

Retirement savings have to start well before that.

Wholeheartedly agree. But a system that demands parental support like this kinda makes it difficult.

So let's play this out.

First 5 years, being supported, no extra money.

Next 10 to 15 years , catch up and wedding savings. next 10 to 15 years weddings and support. When is there any time to put away any significant amount of money?

[etech0]

Next 10 to 15 years , catch up and wedding savings. next 10 to 15 years weddings and support. When is there any time to put away any significant amount of money?

don't forget tuition

[Euclid]

Time in kollel has experienced deflation over the past decade. 7 years is now 4-5 years; 5 years is 2.5-3 years; 3 years is 1 year. People are going to work much sooner (and parental support tapers off earlier); BMG's enrollment has not risen at the same rate as the population growth.

[aygart]

If the goal is to learn the first 3-5 years while being supported to lay the foundation for the marriage the above is not an issue.

Agreed. The amount needed to support a family with up to 2 or 3 children with none in school is so much less  than the amounts mentioned.

[jye]

Sounds like just continuing to pay tuition. And if it's only girls then 50% better than tuition

More like 3-5 years of seminary.

[dasmo801]

Asked a couple of friends. The informal numbers I’m hearing sound like for Lakewood run of the mil learning boy it would range from around $1500 at the lower end (with $1000 being an outlier) to $2500 or more ($3500 is not unheard of) with some even asking for a commitment of 150k-200k down payment on a house when the time comes. The length of support ranges from 3-7 years with some committing to longer or indefinite. Some provide a credit card for additional expenses as well.

I don't know who your friends are and while I'm sure there are all kinds of numbers that are "not unheard of" and all kinds of demands that "some" are making, this is far from the norm. What you are calling the "lower end" would be much closer to what most regular poshute people are doing. And I'm speaking as someone who is in this parsha right now.

[MeirS]

Unpopular opinion: if we’re encouraging boys (and girls) to get married at 21-22 or younger, parents should support if they are able. No one wants the alternative where people wait until they are “financially sound” before marrying.

Since when is an 18 YO not able to hold a stable income?
פוק חזי מאי עמא דבר.
I know some yeshiva dropouts who make 6 digit incomes in their early 20s. 

I'm all for expanding the stable foundation of spending the first few years in Kolel but isn't the Kolel supposed to pay for that?

[smart man]

Agreed. The amount needed to support a family with up to 2 or 3 children with none in school is so much less  than the amounts mentioned.

Should I send you my bills?

I don't know who your friends are and while I'm sure there are all kinds of numbers that are "not unheard of" and all kinds of demands that "some" are making, this is far from the norm. What you are calling the "lower end" would be much closer to what most regular poshute people are doing. And I'm speaking as someone who is in this parsha right now.

+100

[aygart]

Should I send you my bills?

I have marrieds

[moko]

That's extremely commendable and well done. Kudos to you .

The question is how many these days are going with the expectation of not getting any help, like you? I'd venture to say it's the minority.

no need for kudos. We enjoyed our apartment and didn't feel it was mesiras nefesh. It's about expectations. The fact that a you g couple expects a late model sedan and a nice 2/3 bedroom apartment is na issue.

[smart man]

I have marrieds

And their monthly expenses are less than $3,500?

[aygart]

And their monthly expenses are less than $3,500?

After salary and kollel check?

[smart man]

After salary and kollel check?

Okay I misunderstood. Sorry