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A (unauthorized) write up of what Rav Reich stated in his Macha. I definitely did not write every word he said, but hopefuly its accurate
-regardless of what people are saying, nothing like this has happened before, red lines have been crossed
-we don't need to hear both sides and there's no tayna "don't mish in our machlokes"
-The reason we need to be moche is: Haroeh Soteh Bikilkola Yazor Atzmo Min Hayayin: because we get affected that we realize such a thing is possible: a pirtzas Geder (quote from Rav Aharon's Macha on the mevaze of the Brisjker Rav
-Even though the waring parties will not hear the macha, and even if they do they'll ignore it, need to be moche

-There are things that must be totally beyond the realm of possibility (his mashal was a conversation in middle of silent amida)
-A Yid who hits another Yid is a Rasha, pasul l'eidus, chiyuv malkos, and does not count for a minyan.
-You can play games and say you're a nirdaf, doesn't change anything, Zos HaTorah Eino Muchlefes. Those involved are pasul leidus and don't count for a minyan.
-There's a story with the Chidushei Harim: in short The gabbi hit one of the chassidim who wanted to enter when the rebbe was unavailable. Later the Rebbe told the gabbi to bring a Minyan, the gabbai brought 8 more, the rebbe said where's the minyan? the gabbai said theres 10. The rebbbe said "you hit a Yid, you don't count for minyan" The gabbai answered "I did it for the kavod of the Rebbe!" The Rebbe answered "This is not a Kavod for me! This is is (bizayon)"
-It's a group of people who are doing what they think is kavod for their rebbe
-doesn't think that the rebbe has any idea what their doing "for his kavod"
-the rebbe is a continuation of gedolei gedolim. (he went on for several minutes praising in turn each of the shalsheles Gur including the current rebbe)
-what happened is a bizayon for the rebbe, chazer treif.
-It's not the first time that a Yid hit another Yid. This is different. This was a POGROM. and that hasn't happened before. Five yungerlite made Gomel w/ shem and malchos because of a Pogrom made by Yidden with Spodiks. "That's a Bizayon for the Rebbe, a Bizayon for Ger, a Bizayon for me, and a Bizayon for you, a Bizayon for Kol Beis Yisroel"
-"Yidden should beseige a shul, and the people inside should be afraid they're going to be killed? Yidden? Pesulei Eidus! Mechalilei Shabbos! …It's a stain on the whole nation!"
-The claim "it was spontaneous": Kristalnach from the German point of view: We were nirdafim, the Jews were after them, they were sovel, it was terrible, they couldn't anymore. They waited for a ruse. The assassination of a German diplomat in Paris by a jewish boy. The German goverment announced in code: We cant take the achrayus of containing those people who were outraged by what the jews did here and there, we won't be able to contain them anymore."
So too here. Some one did something. It's not clear what exactly was the "great avla" that he did. Comes a "rav" says "Nisbakashti limsor Meis HaVaad Haelyonim (they're not elyonim - they're underworld people!) Limsor: that we have acted till now with so much savlonus...such restraint, everyone knows, they've been rodef us we've been niddafim...." [You remember these nirdafim, 10 rabbanim came to America when Rav Shaul was here, because they were Nirdafim...R' Shaul must of been killing people left and right, they were such nirdafim they had to come from eretz yisroel with the hatzalah...], we are nirdafim, and therefore we can't stop people..." and the code was very clear, and from this came the...
-they have no shame? These are Yidden? A rav?, a Vaada? and bachurim and yungerlite standing, hitting, going into peoples house...makkos retzach...Rachmone Letzlan!!!
-what's worse? this, or what's been going on the last few years?
-the fact that there is an orginization in klal yisreol like yeasfeini is a stain on the whole nation. an ORGINISATION that befriends children that they manged to catch, keep away from their parents, Mechanech a gantze dor not to speak to thier father or mother because they (father/mother) chose a different derech, cut off from this one, not to go to simchas...and these are pekudos that you cant tell me are not true because they've PRINTED them, and sent them in Robocalls...Have they no shame?
-there's a musag in klal yisroel of Mishkal - some times you need to do somthing, but knowing when, and how . (story of the Sar Shalom, who's elderly mother was only willing to eat what her Shalom'ke ate. On peasach he ate gebrochts, so she would eat the matza). Right, the kavod of the rebbe is very, very important. But for this you couse an almana pain? Metzaer Yesomim? Pekudos, everything lo plug, no exceptions. estranging children from their parents. people are crying. Every tear from a yid, SHaarei Dimaos Lo Yinalu...Shrekt zach nisht? (have you no fear?) no pachad? You think this isn't going to come back to haunt you? You think you're not going to suffer? The torah says "shmoe eshma tzakaso...".....people are crying....(and they say) "its gornisht, WE"RE nirdafim, they're rodfim!", what is this jokes? this is a game? They won't have nachas from their children, that I can say. Kinder that were torn from their parents, sitting on mizrach, getting kavod becuase people are telling them it's the right thing to do...not to go to their mothers levaya, fathers levaya...and then in 20 years time you'll have volumes of yaldei ger, malshinim(?). It'll come to haunt them. A child must have a father, a mother, yasmus is a tragedy. It's not going to end well for them. The RbS"O doesn't give siyata dishmaya for such things. It's not a mehalach!
-difference between the two side.
       -Sometimes a minority controls. This Vaade has a few eidel yidden, they can't say anything, they can't stand up to it...one is mechazek the other, this must be the right thing to do, and they quell their guilty conscience, to bring out the lowest element in people.
       -The other eida. Rav Shaul demands Romemus Hanefesh, he demands it, talks about it, lives with it. he refuses to speak negatively. He himself is a Groise Mentch, a talmid chochom amiti, he is a baal madreiga, and kederech haRuchnius its mashpia on all his people. They're the same people, they come from the same crowd, why are the so different? On this side there's a "vaade" and on this side there's a adam gadol who demands romemus from his tzibur..... Abaal kishron nifla.... and people connect with him and are mashpia ltov
-You're eida creates that people need to make gomel with shem/malchus and you make a joke about it...pasuk in navi yeshaya you don't want to understand because then you'll need to do teshuva...the r eibishter sees all
-this has to be something that doesn't happen in klal yisreol, a one time aberration...
-maybe this happened to publicize Rav shaul to the rest of klal Yisroel. There are many great chassidishe RY that the rest of the world doesnt hear of (brought examples...), mistome by chassidim they've never heard of R' Nachum...
-his misnagdim are causing his growth in the world...(mashal like tzefardeia was spread by the metzriim themselfs)
-what is this vaade worried about? he doesn't want to be rebbe. he want's to be a RY. The greatest kavod for Ger would have been for him to be their RY!
-you see in his the gadlus of a talmid chacham amiti, not intrested in the pettyness of lo sikom v'lo sitor...
-how sad it is that the hemshech of the gadlus of pshischa and kotzke has become...mesiras nefesh for narishkeiten...madeup stories...
-how Rav Shilo Raphael (from Mosad Harav Kook - grandson of Rav Maimon - Mizrachi) became a Gerer chossid...

« Last edited by yfr bachur on June 18, 2022, 07:51:48 PM »

Author Topic: Rav Uren Reich: "We must talk about what happened in Ger"  (Read 40686 times)

Offline elihak7

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Re: Rav Uren Reich: "We must talk about what happened in Ger"
« Reply #100 on: June 08, 2022, 04:06:41 PM »
Can anyone bring the speech in drive?

Offline Moshe Green

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Re: Rav Uren Reich: "We must talk about what happened in Ger"
« Reply #101 on: June 08, 2022, 04:37:00 PM »
Rav Reich had an entirely different reason for disseminating it but perhaps another תועלת will result. They are very image conscious and widespread מחאה from a broad swath of the tzibbur may go a long way toward them letting Rav Shaul and his community live in peace.

i guess if R' Reich is your Rav you could rely on him, but what about all of us? To quote one of the posters:
It takes an אדם גדול to know...

Offline cmey

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Offline chff

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Re: Rav Uren Reich: "We must talk about what happened in Ger"
« Reply #103 on: June 08, 2022, 06:58:41 PM »
And from advocate to prosecutor. Satmar had no frictions at all with most kehillos in Williamsburg whatsoever. Besides for the fact that another wrongdoing doesn't make it any less disgusting.
Satmar always had and has frictions with everyone

Offline EliJelly

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Re: Rav Uren Reich: "We must talk about what happened in Ger"
« Reply #104 on: June 08, 2022, 07:00:36 PM »
Satmar always had and has frictions with everyone
What do you call frictions?

Offline VacationLover

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Re: Rav Uren Reich: "We must talk about what happened in Ger"
« Reply #105 on: June 08, 2022, 07:51:57 PM »
This thread should have been locked after the first post.

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Re: Rav Uren Reich: "We must talk about what happened in Ger"
« Reply #106 on: June 08, 2022, 09:14:45 PM »
This thread should have been locked after the first post.
FTR, I disagree. This attitude is what allows things to spiral out of control like this. If people who committed these acts were ostracized the way they should be, instead of everything being swept under the rug because of a misguided LH campaign, we would never have gotten to this point, where literally every single of the worst aveirahs are being committed and the foundations of society are being turned over shamelessly and in an institutionalized fashion.

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Re: Rav Uren Reich: "We must talk about what happened in Ger"
« Reply #107 on: June 08, 2022, 09:37:11 PM »
(which IINM was the reasoning behind the חרם on the Hechsher of Hisachdus back in the early 80s).
and now they give hashgacha at Chabad houses!

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Re: Rav Uren Reich: "We must talk about what happened in Ger"
« Reply #108 on: June 08, 2022, 09:39:11 PM »
This thread should have been locked after the first post.
Why?

Offline ExGingi

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Re: Rav Uren Reich: "We must talk about what happened in Ger"
« Reply #109 on: June 08, 2022, 10:02:59 PM »
and now they give hashgacha at Chabad houses!

They were Davening and getting aliyos at Chabad of Palm Springs in the early 90s (and possibly earlier).
I've been waiting over 5 years with bated breath for someone to say that!
-- Dan

Offline Dan

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Re: Rav Uren Reich: "We must talk about what happened in Ger"
« Reply #110 on: June 08, 2022, 10:19:20 PM »
They were Davening and getting aliyos at Chabad of Palm Springs in the early 90s (and possibly earlier).
it's something I would have never thought I would see.
Save your time, I don't answer PM. Post it in the forum and a dedicated DDF'er will get back to you as soon as possible.

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Re: Rav Uren Reich: "We must talk about what happened in Ger"
« Reply #111 on: June 08, 2022, 11:38:50 PM »
FTR, I disagree. This attitude is what allows things to spiral out of control like this. If people who committed these acts were ostracized the way they should be, instead of everything being swept under the rug because of a misguided LH campaign, we would never have gotten to this point, where literally every single of the worst aveirahs are being committed and the foundations of society are being turned over shamelessly and in an institutionalized fashion.
+100000000

Offline Moshe Green

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Re: Rav Uren Reich: "We must talk about what happened in Ger"
« Reply #112 on: June 09, 2022, 09:15:12 AM »
FTR, I disagree. This attitude is what allows things to spiral out of control like this. If people who committed these acts were ostracized the way they should be, instead of everything being swept under the rug because of a misguided LH campaign, we would never have gotten to this point, where literally every single of the worst aveirahs are being committed and the foundations of society are being turned over shamelessly and in an institutionalized fashion.
"We MUST speak LH to fix the problem", he yelped. Dans Deals Forums, 2022

If you think trashing a whole chassidus on Dans Deals is gonna fix anything, your only fooling yourself. Lets leave it for the big guns, (which it seems from some of these posts, that there are many of them,) to deal with the issue.

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Re: Rav Uren Reich: "We must talk about what happened in Ger"
« Reply #113 on: June 09, 2022, 09:56:34 AM »
If you think trashing a whole chassidus on Dans Deals is gonna fix anything, your only fooling yourself. Lets leave it for the big guns, (which it seems from some of these posts, that there are many of them,) to deal with the issue.
Why in the world? Why do you think you are not mechiyev to speak out the same way they should?

And please learn the Halachos of LH before calling everything unpleasant LH.

Offline ExGingi

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Re: Rav Uren Reich: "We must talk about what happened in Ger"
« Reply #114 on: June 09, 2022, 10:04:46 AM »
FTR, I disagree. This attitude is what allows things to spiral out of control like this. If people who committed these acts were ostracized the way they should be, instead of everything being swept under the rug because of a misguided LH campaign, we would never have gotten to this point, where literally every single of the worst aveirahs are being committed and the foundations of society are being turned over shamelessly and in an institutionalized fashion.

As I mentioned before, there is a difference between leaders who have a חובת מחאה and simpletons who write on DDF. Obviously if there is anyone who has first hand knowledge and acquaintance with someone who transgressed, that person might also be required to be מוחה.
I've been waiting over 5 years with bated breath for someone to say that!
-- Dan

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Re: Rav Uren Reich: "We must talk about what happened in Ger"
« Reply #115 on: June 09, 2022, 10:13:10 AM »
As I mentioned before, there is a difference between leaders who have a חובת מחאה and simpletons who write on DDF. Obviously if there is anyone who has first hand knowledge and acquaintance with someone who transgressed, that person might also be required to be מוחה.
I humbly disagree. לא תעמוד על דם רעך applies to everybody. And please don't listen to the Yetzer Hara who says "who are you to be able to do anything, anyways? You're just a nobody." If the masses did not have this attitude, this could have never happened.

Offline Moshe Green

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Re: Rav Uren Reich: "We must talk about what happened in Ger"
« Reply #116 on: June 09, 2022, 10:22:37 AM »
I humbly disagree. לא תעמוד על דם רעך applies to everybody. And please don't listen to the Yetzer Hara who says "who are you to be able to do anything, anyways? You're just a nobody." If the masses did not have this attitude, this could have never happened.

so if you see someone robbing another person you should speak loshon hora about him because maybe he wont steal any more? does this make any sense to you?

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Re: Rav Uren Reich: "We must talk about what happened in Ger"
« Reply #117 on: June 09, 2022, 10:23:25 AM »
As I mentioned before, there is a difference between leaders who have a חובת מחאה and simpletons who write on DDF. Obviously if there is anyone who has first hand knowledge and acquaintance with someone who transgressed, that person might also be required to be מוחה.

I'm not sure that there is any issue with "simpletons" sharing audio of leaders properly discharging their חובת מחאה.

Offline Yehuda57

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Re: Rav Uren Reich: "We must talk about what happened in Ger"
« Reply #118 on: June 09, 2022, 10:33:04 AM »
"We MUST speak LH to fix the problem", he yelped. Dans Deals Forums, 2022

I hereby make a machaah against this lashon hara about a specific individual under the guise of not speaking lashon hara. Goodness, this is gonna get tiring.

If you think trashing a whole chassidus on Dans Deals

There are specific unspeakable actions under discussion, not trashing an entire Chassidus. But if one is part of that Chassidus and feel that criticism is against the entire Chassidus, well then, that's a challenge for you, not the people calling out the horrific things.



Offline VacationLover

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Re: Rav Uren Reich: "We must talk about what happened in Ger"
« Reply #119 on: June 09, 2022, 10:35:32 AM »
Why in the world? Why do you think you are not mechiyev to speak out the same way they should?

And please learn the Halachos of LH before calling everything unpleasant LH.
Speaking out against violence etc. is one thing, discussing each sides and all (un)related nitty-gritty (i.e. mentioning names) is another thing. Bringing up politics from decades ago is simply LH. (Similar to bringing up עבירות that a BT did)